Orci talks about Star Trek 3

[BillJ]

And as I said before, I'm not convinced Kirk turned around for any prurient reason in the first place. I think he was just frustrated continuing the conversation with his back turned. His timing was bad, and he was more embarrassed than Carol was.

I think the thing that bothers me most is the fact that those two seconds of footage seem to drive the majority of discussion about this movie. The worst of it is, that people seem to purposely misread the scene into being something vulgar so they can have something to bitch and moan about.

 

[borgboy]

Obviously that scene struck a nerve with a lot of people, and in a way that was really different from what was intended.
I don't think the scene is being made into something vulgar, I think the scene is vulgar in it's own right.
For what it's worth, my feelings are sincere, not "something to bitch and moan about."

 

[Nerys Myk]

Obviously that scene struck a nerve with a lot of people, and in a way that was really different from what was intended.
I don't think the scene is being made into something vulgar, I think the scene is vulgar in it's own right.
For what it's worth, my feelings are sincere, not "something to bitch and moan about."

Vulgar? That's a bit extreme. It was pretty tame.

 

[BillJ]

Obviously that scene struck a nerve with a lot of people, and in a way that was really different from what was intended.
I don't think the scene is being made into something vulgar, I think the scene is vulgar in it's own right.
For what it's worth, my feelings are sincere, not "something to bitch and moan about."

I'm sorry, I've watched this movie with my 38-year old wife, my 20-year old daughter and my 72-year old Mother-in-law and none of them found anything remotely "vulgar" about the scene in question and all of them are quite opinionated when they find things that offend them.

 

[BillJ]

Obviously that scene struck a nerve with a lot of people, and in a way that was really different from what was intended.
I don't think the scene is being made into something vulgar, I think the scene is vulgar in it's own right.
For what it's worth, my feelings are sincere, not "something to bitch and moan about."

Vulgar? That's a bit extreme. It was pretty tame.

We're Trekkies! We have to go to the ludicrous extreme every single time!

It's why the stereotypes continue to persist.

 

[borgboy]

It's the tone of the scene that I found vulgar, not the showing of skin and undies.

 

[Nerys Myk]

It's the tone of the scene that I found vulgar, not the showing of skin and undies.

Still, pretty tame. She's a woman changing her clothes. It's not a strip tease and Kirk isn't going all "Wolfie".

 

[BillJ]

It's the tone of the scene that I found vulgar, not the showing of skin and undies.

What tone? I see people going on about this and yet I still simply don't see it. He turns around, sees her, is asked to turn back around and does. I think people would be far more offended by the scene in Star Trek (2009) where Kirk is trying to get a glimpse of Uhura undressing without her knowledge than anything that is going on in Into Darkness. Yet I've never heard anyone here complain about that scene in the five years that film has been out.

But what do I know? Obviously, I should be incredibly offended by a two-second shot of a woman in her underwear with a man turning and seeing her.

 

[BillJ]

It's the tone of the scene that I found vulgar, not the showing of skin and undies.

Still, pretty tame. She's a woman changing her clothes. It's not a strip tease and Kirk isn't going all "Wolfie".

You wouldn't know it judging by the reaction that has occurred over it.

 

[LOKAI of CHERON]

As I stated upthread, we all have differing views. But I am truly, truly astonished at the description of what is essentially a seconds long, lighthearted comedy skit as "vulgar" - and other emotive adjectives.

Like BillJ, I am struggling to see even a hint of that. The scene is about as tame and free of "vulgarity" as you can get.

 

[urbandefault]

That scene was taken from real life situations many of us have experienced. The subtlety seems to be wasted here. :/

 

[MakeshiftPython]

It isn't vulgar for sure. Stupid, yes, but not vulgar.

 

[borgboy]

Interpretation can be subjective. Carol could've done a naked fan dance and if it was done well, I wouldn't have found it offensive. It's not about the skin that was shown, but the tone of the scene.
It's a different issue, but I was skeeved out by the learning that Kirk had a one night stand with Chapel that he didn't even remember which led her to leave the ship. I don't have a problem with Kirk being promiscuous, but it doesn't make him seem like a good captain if he's having one night stands with his crew so often that he can't even keep up with which crew members he's slept with.
That probably bothers me more because I am a fan of Chapel in TOS, and she seems like a very reserved, sensitive woman who wouldn't sleep around. I realize that's open to some interpretation, but what we see of her on screen is a woman who is grieved at losing her fiancee, and is pained by a long time unrequited love, so I probably would feel more protective over Chapel than if Carol had just mentioned a friend who'd slept with Kirk that we had never heard of.
I want to add that I like Pine's Kirk a lot, but I think it's worth discussing his short comings. TOS Kirk certainly got around, but I think he still had more sensitivity with how he treated women.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Interpretation can be subjective. Carol could've done a naked fan dance and if it was done well, I wouldn't have found it offensive. It's not about the skin that was shown, but the tone of the scene.
It's a different issue, but I was skeeved out by the learning that Kirk had a one night stand with Chapel that he didn't even remember which led her to leave the ship. I don't have a problem with Kirk being promiscuous, but it doesn't make him seem like a good captain if he's having one night stands with his crew so often that he can't even keep up with which crew members he's slept with.
That probably bothers me more because I am a fan of Chapel in TOS, and she seems like a very reserved, sensitive woman who wouldn't sleep around. I realize that's open to some interpretation, but what we see of her on screen is a woman who is grieved at losing her fiancee, and is pained by a long time unrequited love, so I probably would feel more protective over Chapel than if Carol had just mentioned a friend who'd slept with Kirk that we had never heard of.
I want to add that I like Pine's Kirk a lot, but I think it's worth discussing his short comings. TOS Kirk certainly got around, but I think he still had more sensitivity with how he treated women.

The tone? Again I don't get that. Carol is in control for the entire scene. She's not some victim being forced to strip while a leering man looks on. She's giving exposition while changing clothes not cowering in fear or trying to be sexy. I don't recall Kirk leering either.

 

[LOKAI of CHERON]

The tone? Again I don't get that. Carol is in control for the entire scene. She's not some victim being forced to strip while a leering man looks on.

You've nailed it. Carol is in complete control, and that, more than anything, is what dictates the actual tone of the exchange.

 

[Nerys Myk]

It's a different issue, but I was skeeved out by the learning that Kirk had a one night stand with Chapel that he didn't even remember which led her to leave the ship. I don't have a problem with Kirk being promiscuous, but it doesn't make him seem like a good captain if he's having one night stands with his crew so often that he can't even keep up with which crew members he's slept with.
That probably bothers me more because I am a fan of Chapel in TOS, and she seems like a very reserved, sensitive woman who wouldn't sleep around. I realize that's open to some interpretation, but what we see of her on screen is a woman who is grieved at losing her fiancee, and is pained by a long time unrequited love, so I probably would feel more protective over Chapel than if Carol had just mentioned a friend who'd slept with Kirk that we had never heard of.
I want to add that I like Pine's Kirk a lot, but I think it's worth discussing his short comings. TOS Kirk certainly got around, but I think he still had more sensitivity with how he treated women.

We actually don't know what, if anything, happened between Kirk and Chapel. Her name is brought up after Carol mentions Kirk is smarter than his reputation implies. From that context it would appear Chapel didn't think Kirk was very bright, not that he slept with her.

 

[BillJ]

We actually don't know what, if anything, happened between Kirk and Chapel. Her name is brought up after Carol mentions Kirk is smarter than his reputation implies. From that context it would appear Chapel didn't think Kirk was very bright, not that he slept with her.

This. I don't think it was quite clear why Chapel left the Enterprise.

 

[borgboy]

I thought it was completely clear that Chapel had a one night stand with Kirk that he didn't remember, and this led to her leaving the Enterprise.
I don't like that, so I'd be glad to be wrong, but I don't see how that whole point with Chapel worked any other way.

 

[Nerys Myk]

I thought it was completely clear that Chapel had a one night stand with Kirk that he didn't remember, and this led to her leaving the Enterprise.
I don't like that, so I'd be glad to be wrong, but I don't see how that whole point with Chapel worked any other way.

I just watched the scene. Like I said, "her name is brought up after Carol mentions Kirk is smarter than his reputation implies." Carol mentions Chapel, Kirk pretends he recognizes the name and Carol calls him on that. Kirk then admits he doesn't recall her. Could be she failed to make an impression on Kirk. Wouldn't be the first time Kirk didn't know the name of a crew member. He couldn't recall McGivers' name in Space Seed. Spock and McGivers herself had to remind him.

 

[Commishsleer]

I find much of what I've read about this scene to be OTT and reactionary in the extreme - and pretty hysterical to be honest.

My wife, a pretty staunch feminist, laughed about people getting in an uproar over it.

Yup, my Mrs is a feminist too. She laughed with me in the theatre! No complaints at all.

So are you saying as a woman I should regard seeing a 'Captain' of a ship ogling a new female recruit in her underwear as a step forward for feminism?
Maybe nuTrek can be regarded as a feminist movie series now we've seen all the female leads in their underwear?

Clearly they put that scene in to bring in the sexy in the movies. I'm not against that and if they showed the same amount of flesh but just did it funnier or sweeter or even less corny I'd have no problems.
Ripley was stripped down to very skimpy underwear in 'Alien' for quite a long time and I thought that was OK and a bit feminist (LOL).
But for all my complaints it the undies scene was only a couple of seconds and if they hadn't included it in the trailer I probably wouldn't have remembered it at all.