Opinions on a couple of older novels
- Thread starter RonG
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The Phoenix books are awful. Lots of thinly veiled K/S and pathos.
I LOVED Red Sector. But I know many here hate it. Diane Carey's idea of non-self-sufficiant starships and support tenders is at odds with everything we've ever seen in Trek. And, there's a BIG, non-ignorable goof - that the Romulans are ruled by a royal family.
I LOVED Red Sector. But I know many here hate it. Diane Carey's idea of non-self-sufficiant starships and support tenders is at odds with everything we've ever seen in Trek. And, there's a BIG, non-ignorable goof - that the Romulans are ruled by a royal family.
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I won't argue where Price is concerned, but Fate actually dabbled with some deeper philosophical questions. It was the first work of Trek Lit that ever explored the issues behind the Prime Directive in any way; it didn't do much more than raise some questions and leave them unresolved, but at least it raised the questions.
Found both Price and Fate to be okay, though I don't remember specifics right now. Didn't even really notice the K/S stuff at the time, or at least didn't spend a lot of time thinking about it.
Red Sector - Liked it. Probably because3 it made me laugh in a few places. And I don't have a problem with the support vessel idea.
Red Sector - Liked it. Probably because3 it made me laugh in a few places. And I don't have a problem with the support vessel idea.
Before even glancing at the responses you've received so far, these are a real hoot. Reading them today, if you've read a lot of recent ST novels, you'll probably want to hurl them into the trash. They represent ST fiction (and fan fiction) in its formative years.
"The Fate of the Phoenix" was one of my first ST novels, bought early in 1980, and read not long after Marshak's "Star Trek Lives!", and I was frustrated I couldn't find "Price" anywhere, but "Fate" was hard to put down. I'd only recently done a teacher education course - and the two units on "literature" (not children's literature) were so way beyond high school novel studies - and it felt like Marshak & Culbreath had done a similar course, and had pumped all their discoveries about real literature into a Star Trek novel.
At the same time, this was a sequel to both a novel I hadn't read (ie. "Price..."), and an episode I'd never seen ("The Enterprise Incident")! Intriguing, like watching a car crash, and yet with some fascinating characters and ideas.
I eventually found "Price" (for years only ever as the first UK edition, but since replaced with a good second hand copy of the US):
Price of the Phoenix, Cordi UK edition by Therin of Andor, on Flickr
I assume this is Omne?
You know, it didn't really matter that I'd read them out of order.
I would later describe these books to friends as "Black Omne, running down an endless corridor, with a Kirk tucked under each arm, pursued by Spock. And the Female Romulan Commander behind them, calling out 'Wait for me!'"
People will tell you this is awful. I have to say, I hung on every word. Loved it, and was so grateful it wasn't following the highly-predictable "cookie cutter" pattern that the first two books in the mini-series had done.
Loved the new characters, loved the throwbacks to "Balance of Terror" and the Romulan Wars, loved McCoy and Spock working together, and was thus as startled as hell to find the then-Psi Phi BBS and encounter the often-bizarre, intense Diane Carey-hatred that was out there in online fandom. I'd accidentally ticked a box "email me when a reply to this post is made" and my in-box became overwhelmed with vitriole. What a welcome to Psi Phi!
Thanks, Therin, for your well-thought points on these books.
The Phoenix books (at least Price, which I'm reading now) are quite a so far a departure from modern TrekLit to be considered professionally-published fanfic IMO - but that's part of the charm of the old 1970's novels (Spock Must Die and Galactic Whirlpool are still fond memories
).
As for Red Sector, I bought it on a whim, and I hope that the first 2 Double Helix books are not required reading, as I don't have or read them. I do like Diane Carey (at least her April "duology", the Piper duology and First Frontier), so I hope I won't be disappointed.
The Phoenix books (at least Price, which I'm reading now) are quite a so far a departure from modern TrekLit to be considered professionally-published fanfic IMO - but that's part of the charm of the old 1970's novels (Spock Must Die and Galactic Whirlpool are still fond memories
).As for Red Sector, I bought it on a whim, and I hope that the first 2 Double Helix books are not required reading, as I don't have or read them. I do like Diane Carey (at least her April "duology", the Piper duology and First Frontier), so I hope I won't be disappointed.
Thanks, Therin, for your well-thought points on these books.
The Phoenix books (at least Price, which I'm reading now) are quite a so far a departure from modern TrekLit to be considered professionally-published fanfic IMO - but that's part of the charm of the old 1970's novels (Spock Must Die and Galactic Whirlpool are still fond memories
I think it's great to read those old novels from the modern perspective and see how authors went in different directions than the franchise ended up going.
You don't need any of the other Double Helix novels to enjoy Red Sector. In fact, the continuity between the Double Helix novels is awful. They fit together very poorly, each establishing things which the others ignore.
Not that I recall.
I have not read any ST books prior to the year 2000. I would think I missed a few gems as a result. Are there any older Trek novels that any of think are a must read?
Do the older Trek books measure up to today's Trek lit?
Do the older Trek books measure up to today's Trek lit?
The First Virtue I believe is consistent (and possibly even referenced in later NF books?).
Quarantine I believe has some details regarding Chakotay's ship contradicted (especially the name - but that's almost a running gag at this point
), but is generally consistent AFAIK.
My favourite Trek novels date back to the 80's and 90's, classics like "Final Frontier", "Prime Directive", "Crossroad", "Dreadnought!", "Metamorphosis", "Federation", "Ishmael", "Strangers From the Sky", "The Captain's Honor", "Q-Squared", "Vendetta", "Vulcan's Glory", anything by A.C. Crispin or Diane Duane....
Short answer: YES, they measure up. More than. IMO the quality is, if anything, a little lower now than the 80's.
I bought and read The Price and the Fate of the Phoenix when they were new, or within a year or two of new, because I remember reading them back-to-back. So - it's been more than thirty years and the memory certainly isn't what it used to be. That said, I enjoyed the Price, but as I read the Fate, I can remember being put off by the number of times the authors put Kirk in danger, and (as I remember) it was the same, or similar situation repeated. It definitely lost it's dramatic affect after such overuse; becoming rather tedious - in my opinion.
A few years back I picked up World Without End and Starless World at a Convention for a few bucks each. I also own Spock Must Die! and Spock Messiah, which i picked up at my local used book store (sadly before it closed.) I've tried giving the Spock books a shot but found them to be non-starters. That was a few years back so I may give them another whirl one of these days. Are these decent books from the Bantam era?
Spock Must Die! is very strange and idiosyncratic, but worth tackling, I think. Spock: Messiah! is very idiosyncratic, but not so good. It's really rather trashy and sexist and has some major plot holes. Although it's certainly never boring.
World Without End is okay, but it's not as good as Haldeman's first, Planet of Judgment, which is one of Bantam's best. The Starless World is okay but rather strange. It gets into some bizarre pseudo-mystical territory about the stars being sentient life forms.
The best Bantam novel by far is The Galactic Whirlpool by David Gerrold. It's a big, impressive, epic story with some very fun interludes fleshing out the universe (in ways incompatible with modern Trek continuity, but intriguing), and it anticipates ideas that Gerrold later incorporated into TNG as one of its uncredited co-creators. Gerrold even writes a version of himself into the story as the Enterprise's historian.
Thanks so much, Chris. Spock Must Die! is my friend's favorite Trek novel, so I may give it an attempt rather soon. I'll be honest I picked up Starless World and World Without End mainly because they had cool titles and covers. I just wanted to make sure they're not outright terrible.
I've seen Galatic Whirlpool touted a bit. I'll have to track it down!
I've seen Galatic Whirlpool touted a bit. I'll have to track it down!
Yevetha
Commodore
TNG Reunion is consistent and has a spinoff series.
^Cool, thanks Yevetha. I look into that series.
Thanks KingDaniel. I will check a few of these out, once I am done with the books in my current queue.
Thanks KingDaniel. I will check a few of these out, once I am done with the books in my current queue.
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