On the sidelining of the original cast...

[eschaton]

So, I've noticed as this season has gone on that the core crew of Discovery (other than Michael of course) are basically becoming irrelevant to the show. The real actors are guest stars, like Rillak, Tarka, T'Rina, and increasingly Dr. Hirai and General Ndoye.

I mean, let's look at the core crew that's left:

• Saru is a captain (without a ship or any set responsibilities) whose function in the show in recent weeks has mostly been trying to get laid with T'Rina
• Stamets has been vanishing into the background. This episode he got a single scene. Most weeks he just spits some technobabble, and maybe gets a scene where he gets to act like a dad to Adira/a good husband to Culber.
• Adira had their boyfriend written off the show as a cast member as soon as he was incorporated. Their role this season mostly seems to be just being awkward.
• Culber actually is the one exception - his role has increased, although it occurred due to the puzzling decision to have him largely change careers from doctor to counselor.

Tilly of course is gone. Despite the assurances she'll "be back" I don't see any way she'll appear next week, meaning the most we'll see her before Season 5 is maybe a cameo in the finale. Gray is gone as well, as was noted.

In some cases, we see pretty good character scenes involving the core characters. But the writers really seem to be struggling to find some way to actually make them relevant to the plot each week. I can understand part of why this is harder - they are a random assortment of the Discovery crew, not the senior officers. But I feel like in recent weeks one or more of them tend to get less likes than the likes of Detmer and Owo, who were originally meant to be glorified extras.

Is this bothering anyone else?

 

[Quinton]

There's a quick shot of Tilly and Vance reacting to surrounding explosions in the Season 4, Part 2 trailer. Could be more than a cameo.

 

[IMC Headquarters]

• Saru is a captain (without a ship or any set responsibilities) whose function in the show in recent weeks has mostly been trying to get laid with T'Rina

Is this bothering anyone else?

Saru is the breakout character in this series and yes, it's bothersome he has been reduced to fawning over the Vulcan President. It's embarrassing to watch because he's otherwise displayed deep confidence and self-assurance. Even when he still had fear ganglia. I fear writers just ran out of ways to keep Saru meaningfully engaged. And display his leadership ability.

 

[Uhura's Song]

Owu has gotten more screen time.

Bryce is transfering.

 

[The Wormhole]

I suspect part of this is when Fuller originally conceived of season 1, it was as a seasonal anthology show, and season 2 would have been about a completely different set of characters, possibly (though not necessarily) played by different actors. As such, all the characters in season 1 had a specific purpose to that narrative, but after that now they have to try to fit the characters into new narrative.

About the only thing that really gets to me was in the first season they had this who stick up their ass about "this show is not about the senior officers" but in subsequent seasons, the main characters have essentially become the senior officers anyway. Culber is serving the same narrative as a CMO, though they do seem to have him doubling up as ship's counselor too, Stamets basically is the chief engineer, in that he's the one who spews technobabble about how to run the ship these days.

And that's before we get into the silliness that everyone on the ship this season besides Tilly, Adira and Linus are Lt. Commander or above.

 

[F. King Daniel]

Saru is the breakout character in this series and yes, it's bothersome he has been reduced to fawning over the Vulcan President. It's embarrassing to watch because he's otherwise displayed deep confidence and self-assurance. Even when he still had fear ganglia. I fear writers just ran out of ways to keep Saru meaningfully engaged. And display his leadership ability.

The guy shoots darts out of his head when he gets angry and they can't think of anything for him? Oof.

 

[fireproof78]

Is this bothering anyone else?

Nope. I love the variety of characters, getting to see more and appreciating different points of view.

 

[JWPlatt]

What's with Mary Wiseman's mysterious mostly-exit from the show anyway? Is anything true known? IMDB shows nothing more than Discovery in 2021 and nothing in progress. And there's nothing else besides unsubstantiated or debunked speculation. Events like this are normally personal, but not even that has been said. Sometimes it's actually story reasons, but again that's not been said. Crickets.

 

[Lord Garth]

I figured they wrote Tilly off so she could be part of the Starfleet Academy series, but it still doesn't explain why she was written out as early as the fourth episode of the season. Doesn't bother me, but is strange. Mary Wiseman probably has something going on in her life that's none of our business.

Culber, at this point, should just be Ship's Counselor and Pollard should be the Chief Medical Officer. This is a situation of the series Michelle Paradise inherited versus the direction she wanted to take it in. If she'd created DSC from scratch, I think he'd have been the Counselor -- and just the Counselor -- from Day One.

I like T'Rina, Rillak, and Vance. Also Zora and Kovich. If the older characters were being pushed aside in favor of newer characters who were less interesting, I'd be bothered. But that's not the case. I like who they're focusing on now. They're expanding the scope of DSC beyond just Discovery's crew.

 

[fireproof78]

What's with Mary Wiseman's mysterious mostly-exit from the show anyway? Is anything true known? IMDB shows nothing more than Discovery in 2021 and nothing in progress. And there's nothing else besides unsubstantiated or debunked speculation. Events like this are normally personal, but not even that has been said. Sometimes it's actually story reasons, but again that's not been said. Crickets.

Not our business.

They're expanding the scope of DSC beyond just Discovery's crew.

And that's a good thing. Remember all the griping about Discovery's main cast not being interesting and wishes for focusing on other characters? Wish granted.

 

[F. King Daniel]

Maybe she got a better contract with fewer dates? Who knows.

 

[eschaton]

Owu has gotten more screen time.

Bryce is transfering.

Yes, but I'm not talking about the "co-starring" - they are clearly lower in billing. I'm saying there's relatively little difference any longer between how the show is treating the "starring" cast members and the costars. And the guest characters typically get the weightier roles.

I suspect part of this is when Fuller originally conceived of season 1, it was as a seasonal anthology show, and season 2 would have been about a completely different set of characters, possibly (though not necessarily) played by different actors. As such, all the characters in season 1 had a specific purpose to that narrative, but after that now they have to try to fit the characters into new narrative.

Indeed. Tilly was probably the character that suffered worse for that. She was clearly constructed mostly to show how far Michael fell - that she was sent back to square 1 and rooming with a lowly, awkward cadet. But given the show completely dropped its "lower decks" pretenses even midway through the first season, Tilly no longer made much sense on the show, so they kept on mutating her skills/role on the show. She went from one of many people working in the spore drive to his second when it came to understanding the spore drive (which they later forgot). Then they put her on command track, and jumped up her role on the ship steadily way, way faster than her rank. They also Mary Wiseman in a role which was a bit too young for her, which wasn't a big issue in the first season, but as she began visibly aging her status as a cadet/ensign became stranger and stranger.

I like T'Rina, Rillak, and Vance. Also Zora and Kovich. If the older characters were being pushed aside in favor of newer characters who were less interesting, I'd be bothered. But that's not the case. I like who they're focusing on now. They're expanding the scope of DSC beyond just Discovery's crew.

I'm not saying the characters are bad. But if I were a supporting member of the main cast on Discovery, I would be POed to be honest. Historically Trek always threw the supporting cast a bone and gave them their own episodes. I understand that's harder to do with serialized drama, but they could give them character arcs across the whole season or something. If I were say Anthony Rapp, I would be seriously thinking about leaving the show just because of how underutilized I was.

 

[Lord Garth]

I'm not saying the characters are bad. But if I were a supporting member of the main cast on Discovery, I would be POed to be honest. Historically Trek always threw the supporting cast a bone and gave them their own episodes. I understand that's harder to do with serialized drama, but they could give them character arcs across the whole season or something. If I were say Anthony Rapp, I would be seriously thinking about leaving the show just because of how underutilized I was.

Please note that I don't think you're wrong.

But given that this season was produced during Peak Covid Time, there might be other factors. They had to write Reno lighter than usual. Something might've been going on with Anthony Rapp too.

It's also the reason why there were episodes we didn't see Detmer and Owo and there were substitute sometimes for whoever/whatever they had filling in for them.

 

[fireproof78]

Yes, but I'm not talking about the "co-starring" - they are clearly lower in billing. I'm saying there's relatively little difference any longer between how the show is treating the "starring" cast members and the costars. And the guest characters typically get the weightier roles.



Indeed. Tilly was probably the character that suffered worse for that. She was clearly constructed mostly to show how far Michael fell - that she was sent back to square 1 and rooming with a lowly, awkward cadet. But given the show completely dropped its "lower decks" pretenses even midway through the first season, Tilly no longer made much sense on the show, so they kept on mutating her skills/role on the show. She went from one of many people working in the spore drive to his second when it came to understanding the spore drive (which they later forgot). Then they put her on command track, and jumped up her role on the ship steadily way, way faster than her rank. They also Mary Wiseman in a role which was a bit too young for her, which wasn't a big issue in the first season, but as she began visibly aging her status as a cadet/ensign became stranger and stranger.



I'm not saying the characters are bad. But if I were a supporting member of the main cast on Discovery, I would be POed to be honest. Historically Trek always threw the supporting cast a bone and gave them their own episodes. I understand that's harder to do with serialized drama, but they could give them character arcs across the whole season or something. If I were say Anthony Rapp, I would be seriously thinking about leaving the show just because of how underutilized I was.

Historically, Trek wasn't written during a pandemic.

 

[Sci]

I think @Lord Garth and @fireproof78 hit the bullseye. More than likely, some of these things are a function of the production having to cope with COVID. A lot of it might also have to do with increased personnel costs imposed by needing to work according to COVID safety protocols; if they know they have these increased costs and they know in advance that they want to do a season that focuses on the relationship between Michael and Book, for instance, I could see them deciding they need to save some money by temporarily writing out some principle cast members, presumably with an intent to bring them back once COVID is under better control and COVID-related costs are down. And remember, they were writing and producing this season in 2020, when there still wasn't a vaccine.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Yes, but I'm not talking about the "co-starring" - they are clearly lower in billing. I'm saying there's relatively little difference any longer between how the show is treating the "starring" cast members and the costars. And the guest characters typically get the weightier roles.

Recurring guest characters Nog, Rom and Garak, got lots more DS9 episodes each than Jake Sisko, who actually had his name in the opening credits.

As for Tilly, I read that Mary Wiseman had notified of another job she wanted to do (ie. headlining in a stage play, "At the Wedding", an off-Broadway premiere), causing a clash with DSC. That other job's dates had changed due to Covid lockdowns.
https://www.digitalspy.com/tv/ustv/a38485258/star-trek-discovery-season-4-tilly-exit/

Maybe she got a better contract with fewer dates? Who knows.

https://www.playbill.com/article/bryna-turners-at-the-wedding-will-premiere-off-broadway-this-winter

Tig Notaro is immuno-compromised and was concerned about Covid, and so requested that she have as few trips to Canada as possible for filming. I bet they filmed a few advance scenes for future use in later episodes while she was there for other scenes.

 

[TimeIsAPredator]

Adira had their boyfriend written off the show as a cast member as soon as he was incorporated. Their role this season mostly seems to be just being awkward.

That one was really strange. Why have a whole story about getting a real body only to send her packing.

 

[Ray Hardgrit]

It seems like they wanted to tell a story show the process of a transgender character being 'seen' and getting a body that's really him, but didn't really have any use for them after that. Either that or Covid put a wrench in their plans.

 

[eschaton]

It seems like they wanted to tell a story show the process of a transgender character being 'seen' and getting a body that's really him, but didn't really have any use for them after that. Either that or Covid put a wrench in their plans.

The weirdest part - again possibly due to COVID - is the two of them never even kissed!!!

Hell, I'm not sure if Michael and Book have kissed this season either.

 

[fireproof78]

And that's....bad?