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On the Origins of the Mirror Universe

Here's what could have happened. The Germans win WW2. After about 100 or years the enslave overturn and allow for all races to rule but they still really rule the German way because that's the only style they know. Zephram Cochrane comes along builds his warp engine but instead of being known has Cochrane of Alpha Centuri he's known as conquerer of Alpha Centuri and is considered a war hero. And instead of First Contact with the Vulcans he kills the vulcans and steals their technology. And this is pretty much how the Terran empire begins.
 
What about the Terran Empire being a continuation of a Roman Empire that never fell and conquered the entire world. The salutes used by the people in the MU were used by the ancient Romans and copied by the Nazis, terran is a latin word which was the main language of Rome back then and assassinations was almost a culturally accepted way of geting ahead.
 
Zeppster said:
Here's what could have happened. The Germans win WW2. After about 100 or years the enslave overturn and allow for all races to rule but they still really rule the German way because that's the only style they know. Zephram Cochrane comes along builds his warp engine but instead of being known has Cochrane of Alpha Centuri he's known as conquerer of Alpha Centuri and is considered a war hero. And instead of First Contact with the Vulcans he kills the vulcans and steals their technology. And this is pretty much how the Terran empire begins.

Perhaps this is the future that plays out if Edith Keeler isn't killed.
 
My conclusion, based on what we've seen on screen, is that the MU is like the old Earth-3 in DC Comics; it's the place where "good" and "evil" are reversed.

So, since someone mentioned George Washington... in the MU, the American colonies rebel against the British and win their independence. But, instead of being a man of integrity, who refuses to be made a king, Washington is a tyrant who crowns himself the first American emperor. In the American Civil War, the South secedes in an effort to escape from the evils of slavery, but Emperor Lincoln crushes them and makes the American Empire all the more tyrannical... In World War II, then, cruel strongman Franklin Roosevelt leads the American Empire in the conquest of Europe and Asia, including the struggling democracies of Germany and Japan. And so on...
 
My friend said this about the mirror universe.
Khan won the eugenics war, That's where it all started.
I think he's right, think about it.
- W -
* I have thought about it and it's perfectly logical *
 
RookieBatman said:
I was thinking today about the MU, and my thoughts drifted to what might've been the point where Schrodinger's cat lived or died to cause the formation of this parallel universe, and I have a theory which you might find amusing.
First, let me say that I can't quite remember all the symbology of the MU theme sequence in IAMD, so I'm just going to ignore that episode for the purposes of this argument.
Now, it's being discussed in another thread here how the MU seems a lot like a Nazi version of Starfleet. So, basically, my theory is this: what if Edith Keeler surviving (which, as we all know, had a ripple effect that ended with the Nazis winning the war) was the event that caused the MU? In one version of the "City..." script, Harlan Ellison even had an element where some of the crew beamed back to the Enterprise after McCoy (or it might've been Beckwith at the time) went back in time, and the Enterprise crew had changed to a group of space pirates. Not entirely the same as the MU, but in short, Harlan therein postulated (even though that scene was added from some network pressure for more action) that after history was changed, the Enterprise would still be there, but its crew changed to a more belligerent, unruly group. Thus, my new pet theory is that in one quantum reality, Edith Keeler wasn't hit by that truck (whether she was saved by McCoy or just didn't happen to be there at that moment), the Nazis won the war, and the Nazi-dominated Earth gradually grew in to the Empire that we know and love. Possible? Laughable? Discuss.

No, because then when the people on the Guardian of Forever planet trying to contact Starfleet would still have managed to contact Starfleet, namely the MU Starfleet. They could contact no Starfleet at all; which means Edith Keeler was not the split point.
 
LRT said:
My conclusion, based on what we've seen on screen, is that the MU is like the old Earth-3 in DC Comics; it's the place where "good" and "evil" are reversed.

So, since someone mentioned George Washington... in the MU, the American colonies rebel against the British and win their independence. But, instead of being a man of integrity, who refuses to be made a king, Washington is a tyrant who crowns himself the first American emperor. In the American Civil War, the South secedes in an effort to escape from the evils of slavery, but Emperor Lincoln crushes them and makes the American Empire all the more tyrannical... In World War II, then, cruel strongman Franklin Roosevelt leads the American Empire in the conquest of Europe and Asia, including the struggling democracies of Germany and Japan. And so on...

^Heh.

I actually wrote on the MU split-off point from our universe in a story of mine. It's a crossover with Highlander, and The X-Files, and the above seems to be perfectly fit together with that, so I decided to post it for fun:

“How about Hitler?” Dana asked.

“Hitler, one of the greatest saints of his time,” Katherine answered with a grin. “His peaceful battle for equality, solidarity, and tolerance changed the world, even after the second World War was waged against him and his allies. He was particularly critical of the Christian theocracy of the United States of America - allied with the multi-god theocracy of the super power of Egypt, where women were horrendously suppressed - and the male suppression in Amazonia.”

“/Amazonia/!? Egypt the /Super/ /Power/?!” Dana exclaimed in shock, interrupting Katherine.

“I take it Amazonia doesn’t exist in your world? And Egypt isn’t a super power,” Katherine said, and Dana sat back thinking. Katherine continued, keeping an eye on Dana, and she said, “In Europe men and women and many other suppressed groups were all made to be equal to the law by Hitler, the first leader of United Europe back then. In response, in America and Egypt women’s rights movements and similar movements for all the other groups came into existence, and in Amazonia they were men’s rights movements. The two bitter enemies considered equality of the sexes an even greater evil, particularly a step in between to the other side, so they attacked Europe together. Although Europe was defeated, and split in two, one side with Amazonia, and the other with Egypt and America, the damage was really done. Rights movements continued to grow until the leaders of the countries were forced to compromise for fear of civil war: most other groups were given equal rights, even if the genders stayed unequal for a very long time afterwards - for a large part still today.”

“What about Israel?” Dana wondered, thinking about one of the biggest problems on Earth in her universe. Katherine looked blankly at her. “The Jews?”

“Never heard of them,” Katherine answered with eyes.

“Judea? The Hebrews?” Dana asked her.

“Oh, them. One of the groups that got equal rights after the second World War, mostly in the middle-eastern countries, and especially Egypt, they were hardly more than slaves before that,” Katherine explained, equally thinking about the world her counterpart lived in. “They founded the third, but the smallest of the one-god movements after the second World War - although they claim it’s been around since before the bible, that they were the closest to the Sumerians and the Akkadians, before they molded those multiple gods into one. They performed a huge amount of terrorist attacks; but unlike some others, very much all targeted against military targets, and hardly any suicide bombers. That stopped once they were given equal rights though.”

“The third? What /about/ the bible?” Dana asked Katherine. Katherine nodded with a grin. “The Hebrews wrote the Old Testament of the Bible,” Dana said. “With us at least.”

“Not here; although they claim they did. One god religions were a huge amount of different small movements gathered around the Middle East, they didn’t become unified, and the bible written, until after Jesus Christ unified them,” Katherine explained calmly with a smile. “His religion was based upon absolute obedience to the priesthood, retaliating with everything you had; two eyes for one eye, and such. Women were inferior, and the rest. Then six hundred years later there came another prophet, founding the second great one-god religions: Islam. Mohammed, was the prophet’s name, he claimed that Jesus’ message was actually the opposite, just that the ones taking over the movement in the centuries following twisted it to suit their purposes. Islam is based on freedom, tolerance, letting everyone do what they wanted; most of Europe was, especially by the time of Hitler Islamic. It’s why the Christians fled in disgust across the ocean and built their country there.”

“Amazonia,” Dana muttered, as something filtered across her memory that she couldn’t quite grasp. She looked at Katherine, and it was uncanny how much they thought alike despite their huge differences, because without needing to ask Katherine punched in a few commands and a holographic projection of Earth appeared. The globe folded out in a flat map, and the countries appeared. Some were similar, some very much not. Egypt spread out to include Saudi-Arabia, and Iraq. Amazonia of course was the biggest difference, and to the northwest of it: Kurganstan. Amazonia included pieces of Turkey, huge parts of what was once the Soviet Union and later Russia in Dana’s universe, as well as parts of Mongolia and China. Only a strip of the Eastern side of the country wasn’t Amazonia, and it wasn’t called China. There was equally no Chinese wall. That’s when things clicked. “The bible,” Dana said with a grin, “Does it contain a passage Revelations 6:8, and the few passages before?”

Katherine frowned, and said, “The Four Horsemen Saints of the Apocalypse? What about them?” Dana made a go-on gesture, and Katherine spoke, “Harvest, Cure, Peace and Life. They were actually Immortals, like us. Silas, Caspian, Kronos and Methos. For about thousand years they rode together, bringing relief wherever they went. Brokering peace, curing diseases, the legends speak of bringing people back from the dead, raising harvestable crops where harvest just went sour. In that 1,000 years, peace and prosperity flourished everywhere. Asteroids and other natural disasters they helped combat, making sure that mankind wasn’t forced to eat each other, etc, etc, etc. I know Methos is still alive, met the annoying little bastard that enjoys butting heads whenever possible, as well as interfering in other people’s business. Often chops off the head of an Immortal still in the throws of a Quickening. I had the unfortunate luck to meet him, bastard came /this/ close to killing me.” Katherine placed her fingers extremely close together, then continued, “Anyway, the myth goes that should all these four ever die - and in the myth the last one to die is Peace, also called Father Time, Kronos you know, who resides on some high mountain to look over the Earth and time - then the world would surely end. Revelations 6:8 describes how they will come to their ends. What is it?”

Throughout Katherine’s tale, Dana’s smile had grown larger and larger, and now she chuckled and then laughed. “No wonder this Earth is populated by a bunch of wimps,” Dana said with a large grin. “Would you like me to tell our version of Revelations 6:8? ‘And behold, their came a pale horse, its rider’s name was Death, and hell followed with him.’” Katherine actually shuddered at Dana’s delivery of the line, starting to grasp what it meant, along with dual natures of their respective universes - this was its diversion point. “Famine, Pestilence, War, and Death - Silas, Caspian, Kronos, and Methos,” Dana said with a grin. “Kronos, also called ‘The End of Time’. For a thousand years, they raped, pillaged, burned, and killed their way across two continents. Wherever they went, death and hell followed. They destroyed everything in their path; villages, cities, armies, civilizations. It didn’t matter. They used nature’s own devices; sent infected animals in cities, attacked in the wake of asteroid impacts, volcano eruptions, and earthquakes, making their damage worse. Nobody could stand before them, the gods themselves fled Earth in fear of the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse. Among their victims: Egypt, several times over, they slaughtered the Amazons, and most of the Kurgans. /The/ Kurgan in fact was scared to death of Kronos, and resides in here.” Dana pointed to her head.
 
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