Yes Please.
Sheesh.
Sheesh.
Oh please. DS9 /Voyager = Paramount Franchise Milk
- Thread starter Will_Riker
- Start date
CaptainHawk1 said:
With all due respect, why not just lock the thread? I mean, honestly, this guy is an obvious troll and the whole thread is just above the level "Starr Track SUx!". I agree that there's no reason to keep this going, but if you as the Moderator don't lock it, I think it's kind of unfair to request or expect people to not to post in an open thread and simply just "let it die."PKTrekGirl said:
Okay, guys...I thought this thread died out.
In any event, unless you have something productive to say, please just let it die. I already said what needed to be said to this guy several days ago.
Thanks.
Just my 2 cents, though, for what it's worth.
-Shawn
Well, there WAS some productive discussion going on. And I am not in the habit of cutting off a thread unless I absolutely have to - usually for things like a flame war.
Sure, it would be easy to lock a thread every time someone said something disagreeable. But that sorta of defeats the purpose of a DISCUSSION board. And it is not something that has ever been done in the DS9 forum, where we have a long and colorful history of mature posting behavior.
And color me wacky, but I cling to the belief that it IS possible for people to OBEY THE BOARD RULES and not FLAME other posters by referring to them as trolls, but instead make the most of the situation and turn any thread into a reasonable discussion. Or here's an idea: opt not to participate at all if they are incapable of that.
Or are are you saying that we not capable of handling something as light-weight as this guy in this forum anymore?
Because if so, it is a VERY sad day indeed.
My two cents, that was a resolved issue. The acount was removed that was compromised. How that joker got my password is a mystery. But hackers are definately underhanded..
I am not apologizing for aything that that person said or did... However, it was dealt with quickly thanks to another moderator.
I agree... - Kill the thread.
It started all wrong and does not deserve to continue, and whoever that person is, and if you are watching... Your post and unrest is history. Now go away.
Nathaniel --
I am not apologizing for aything that that person said or did... However, it was dealt with quickly thanks to another moderator.
I agree... - Kill the thread.
It started all wrong and does not deserve to continue, and whoever that person is, and if you are watching... Your post and unrest is history. Now go away.
Nathaniel --
CaptainHawk1
Commodore
How long has this bbs been around... what, 10 years now? It doesn't take a whole lot of skill for any of us to spot obvious trolling and I would contend that part of a moderator's duties would include nipping nonsense like this whole thread in the bud before it gets out of control. Obviously, this is at your discretion, but I really don't thnk that I'm off base when I suggest that this thread went well beyond something being said that was disagreeable. You yourself pointed to the fact that it was an abvious attempt at trolling. So why keep feeding the trolls?PKTrekGirl said:
CaptainHawk1 said:
With all due respect, why not just lock the thread? I mean, honestly, this guy is an obvious troll and the whole thread is just above the level "Starr Track SUx!". I agree that there's no reason to keep this going, but if you as the Moderator don't lock it, I think it's kind of unfair to request or expect people to not to post in an open thread and simply just "let it die."PKTrekGirl said:
Okay, guys...I thought this thread died out.
In any event, unless you have something productive to say, please just let it die. I already said what needed to be said to this guy several days ago.
Thanks.
Just my 2 cents, though, for what it's worth.
-Shawn
Well, there WAS some productive discussion going on. And I am not in the habit of cutting off a thread unless I absolutely have to - usually for things like a flame war.
Sure, it would be easy to lock a thread every time someone said something disagreeable. But that sorta of defeats the purpose of a DISCUSSION board. And it is not something that has ever been done in the DS9 forum, where we have a long and colorful history of mature posting behavior.
The sarcasm aside, I assume you are refering to me calling the poster a troll. Calling a spade a spade is not flaming and besides that, I echoed your exact words. There's an awfully fine line that's walked when it's suggested that calling someone a troll is a considered flaming but the act of accusing someone of trolling (i.e., being a troll) is not considered a flame.
And this was my point in my original post. In one breath you're suggesting that people just let this thread die to which I say, if indeed this thread is so unworthy of any more attention due to said trolling that we all agree upon (the content of the post and the fact that the account was hacked say it all not to mention that it was a complete hit and run, drive by posting) then it should be locked. In the next breath (what I just quoted) you're suggesting that we make the most of the trolling situation and turn it into a reasonable discussion. So which is it? It's not worthy of anyone's attention and should die or all threads, even the obvious attempts at trolling, can be turned into a worthwhile debate? Again, this is said with all due respect, but it appears to me that you want to have it both ways and that was my original point. Requesting from members that they a let a trolling thread die but not locking it is sending a mixed message that the thread has some value and should remain open.
The problem I have with this is that you seem to have decided that you're the arbiter of what is and isn't a reasonable discussion and it appears that you're telling me to basically shut up if I don't agree with you. I hope I'm wrong about that and I apologize in advance if I misunderstood that. The fact is that when it comes to statements about board policy that don't involve your opinion or the opinion of any other Moderators and are simply statements of policies, I'm never going to debate that. However, if any Moderator is going to interject their personal interpretation or opinion on policy or even just on the subject at hand in the thread, then they should expect some scrutiny from other members of the board who may not agree with them or would request clarification. In my mind the reasonable discussion this has turned into is what should and shouldn't be done regarding trolling and what the Moderator's role is and isn't. In someone else's mind, it's something else. This is the problem with unchecked trolling. It becomes a free-for-all.
This is not what I'm saying at all. What I'm saying is that there's no reason that the other members of the board should have to put up with nonsense like this. I'm also saying that I feel that there needs to be consistency with the Moderators when dealing with said issues and from my perspective, I simply didn't see it this time.
I am very aware that being a Moderator is not an easy task and it is one that is done voluntarily. That being said, I've been a member of the Trekbbs for 7+ years now and I have seen my share of Moderators who have come and gone who threw their weight around. Now I'm not suggesting at all that you're doing that, but I would like to make it clear that simply because a member questions the opinions of a moderator that it doesn't mean that we don't respect them or their opinions.
Take care.
-Shawn
^ That is most certainly NOT what I said. What I said was that ANYONE who is unwilling to participate in an on-topic discussion in a positive manner should not post in a thread. This goes for ALL of the off-topic comments in this thread. And there were several.
Which is exactly WHY I made the comment I did on 7/20/07.
You are taking this WAY too personally. It is not YOU I was specifically referring to - it was everyone. You included, but certainly not you exclusively.
And as for 'putting up with nonsense'...well, as I said, if you or anyone else doesn't like a topic, then the solution is simple, or should be simple, anyway: don't read it or post in it. This holds true not only in this case, but in any number of cases, all around this board. And once again, I am not just referring to you here, but to EVERYONE - including myself.
There are any number of threads that you or I might deem 'nonsense' at any given time on this board - I could give you 10 or 12 that are open in only the Misc forum right this moment! And don't even get me started on TNZ! But the reason I left this thread open was precisely BECAUSE I was trying to allow for other people's views on the TOPIC. *Not* on the original poster, mind you (because as you know, commentary about a POSTER is considered trolling), but on the TOPIC itself.
In other words, the reason I left this thread open was because I do NOT consider my feelings to be the only thing that matter.
Further, if you have been posting on this board for 7+ years, you ought to know that different mods have different philosophies about moderating, and different styles.
If you were a regular in this forum, you would know that I have never been a hard-ass who closes every thread as soon as I decide I don't 'like' it anymore....or there is the slightest sign of tension. I have been very flexible in this forum and have allowed for ALL opinions about the show - NOT just the ones I agree with, and not just the ones that are positive. Further, I have always given EVERYONE a chance to explain their views on a topic before writing them off or whatever - especially new posters who do not know the rules. The guy in question was a cadet. Maybe he didn't know the rules yet? But I at least wanted to give him a chance to explain himself before slamming his first thread on this board shut. And I did this by reminding him of the rules, and encouraging him to post support for his remarks. I did this in my very first post in this thread, way back on 7/13/07, and within hours of his initial post.
THAT is what I am supposed to do. Apply the rules, but give people - especially new people, a chance.
It was not the original poster, but various OTHER posters - who not at all incidentally should have known better - who continued with the potshots. After my 'friendly', the original poster opted not to expand on his thoughts and the thread was dropped. And then several days later, it was OTHER posters who brought it to life again with unnecessary potshots. The thread was DEAD. So why did you guys drag it up again and pump life into it if it was so offensive to you? If you have been on this board 7+ years, you ought to know that bringing up a dead thread for no productive purpose is not cool.
Up until now, I have seen no reason to mod this forum like, say, the ENT forum mods have had to mod ENT - monitoring posters closely for any little thing and closing threads the second things get tense. That sort of moderating has been necessary at times in ENT or in some other forums, but that is not the case here. The posters in this forum have EARNED the benefit of the doubt from me, as they have traditionally handled pretty much any topic in a mature manner...and made lemonade out of pretty much any lemon thrown their way.
This forum has never required the sort of moderation that you seem to be insisting on. And it has been my goal to allow freedom in here - because the posters who post in here have EARNED my trust over the 4 1/2 years I've been a mod in here.
And what I said at the very end of my last post still holds true. If the posters in this forum are no longer worthy of the trust I have put in them - the trust that they EARNED over several years, then yes - it IS a very sad day for me indeed.
You may not like that this is a sad thing for me...but I hope that you can appreciate that I am also entitled to my feelings.
Now, if you would like to discuss this further, please PM me about it.
This thread is not the place to discuss moderator actions in any event.
Which is exactly WHY I made the comment I did on 7/20/07.
You are taking this WAY too personally. It is not YOU I was specifically referring to - it was everyone. You included, but certainly not you exclusively.
And as for 'putting up with nonsense'...well, as I said, if you or anyone else doesn't like a topic, then the solution is simple, or should be simple, anyway: don't read it or post in it. This holds true not only in this case, but in any number of cases, all around this board. And once again, I am not just referring to you here, but to EVERYONE - including myself.
There are any number of threads that you or I might deem 'nonsense' at any given time on this board - I could give you 10 or 12 that are open in only the Misc forum right this moment! And don't even get me started on TNZ! But the reason I left this thread open was precisely BECAUSE I was trying to allow for other people's views on the TOPIC. *Not* on the original poster, mind you (because as you know, commentary about a POSTER is considered trolling), but on the TOPIC itself.
In other words, the reason I left this thread open was because I do NOT consider my feelings to be the only thing that matter.
Further, if you have been posting on this board for 7+ years, you ought to know that different mods have different philosophies about moderating, and different styles.
If you were a regular in this forum, you would know that I have never been a hard-ass who closes every thread as soon as I decide I don't 'like' it anymore....or there is the slightest sign of tension. I have been very flexible in this forum and have allowed for ALL opinions about the show - NOT just the ones I agree with, and not just the ones that are positive. Further, I have always given EVERYONE a chance to explain their views on a topic before writing them off or whatever - especially new posters who do not know the rules. The guy in question was a cadet. Maybe he didn't know the rules yet? But I at least wanted to give him a chance to explain himself before slamming his first thread on this board shut. And I did this by reminding him of the rules, and encouraging him to post support for his remarks. I did this in my very first post in this thread, way back on 7/13/07, and within hours of his initial post.
THAT is what I am supposed to do. Apply the rules, but give people - especially new people, a chance.
It was not the original poster, but various OTHER posters - who not at all incidentally should have known better - who continued with the potshots. After my 'friendly', the original poster opted not to expand on his thoughts and the thread was dropped. And then several days later, it was OTHER posters who brought it to life again with unnecessary potshots. The thread was DEAD. So why did you guys drag it up again and pump life into it if it was so offensive to you? If you have been on this board 7+ years, you ought to know that bringing up a dead thread for no productive purpose is not cool.
Up until now, I have seen no reason to mod this forum like, say, the ENT forum mods have had to mod ENT - monitoring posters closely for any little thing and closing threads the second things get tense. That sort of moderating has been necessary at times in ENT or in some other forums, but that is not the case here. The posters in this forum have EARNED the benefit of the doubt from me, as they have traditionally handled pretty much any topic in a mature manner...and made lemonade out of pretty much any lemon thrown their way.
This forum has never required the sort of moderation that you seem to be insisting on. And it has been my goal to allow freedom in here - because the posters who post in here have EARNED my trust over the 4 1/2 years I've been a mod in here.
And what I said at the very end of my last post still holds true. If the posters in this forum are no longer worthy of the trust I have put in them - the trust that they EARNED over several years, then yes - it IS a very sad day for me indeed.
You may not like that this is a sad thing for me...but I hope that you can appreciate that I am also entitled to my feelings.
Now, if you would like to discuss this further, please PM me about it.
This thread is not the place to discuss moderator actions in any event.
CaptainHawk1
Commodore
I certainly see where you're coming and we can agree to disagree on some things.
However, what you and I can certainly agree on is the fact that the DS9 forum does not have the type of problems that the other forums have and I think that's because we generally have less to prove.
You're absolutely correct that the level of decorum here is a lot higher than the other forums.
-Shawn :smoke:
However, what you and I can certainly agree on is the fact that the DS9 forum does not have the type of problems that the other forums have and I think that's because we generally have less to prove.
You're absolutely correct that the level of decorum here is a lot higher than the other forums.
-Shawn :smoke:
