Obama pushes for renewed commercial whaling. :)
- Thread starter gturner
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And a shitload of tartar sauce.
Unsurprisingly, the situation is a bit more complicated than FOX News' "Obama leading the effort" narrative suggests (It's been on the table for three years, but apparently they're suddenly environmentalists now at FOX) and has to do in large part with the trade off of protecting whaling hunts for indigenous peoples, but I do hope the negative publicity from environmental groups causes Obama to grow some backbone on this and oppose the measure. With the Gulf oil spill the last thing he needs is more bad PR on the environment.
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I don't understand.
Is it not enough to be a conservative Republican, but you actually have to prove to us that you're pure evil?
I mean, its one thing to have a political agenda based on, well, anything, but it's another thing alltogether to simply get joy from pissing off the enlightened.
You seem to get joy from the pain of the enlightened. You seem to get joy from suffering in the face of the compassionate.
Freud couldn't dream up enough schadenfreude for you.
Is it not enough to be a conservative Republican, but you actually have to prove to us that you're pure evil?
I mean, its one thing to have a political agenda based on, well, anything, but it's another thing alltogether to simply get joy from pissing off the enlightened.
You seem to get joy from the pain of the enlightened. You seem to get joy from suffering in the face of the compassionate.
Freud couldn't dream up enough schadenfreude for you.
No more of this, please.
First off, I don't feel the need to prove I'm evil.
I'll let my record of actions speak for that, instead of empty words.
Second, I don't get joy from the pain of the "enlightened". I get joy from eating the tasty meat of marine mammals!
As for your quotes, Locutus, I don't buy it unless Obama is somehow Dick Cheney's sock puppet (ironically, Dick Cheney can't eat whale meat because of his heart problems).
Nor does the Ted Steven's connection wash. A disgraced politician's shadow extends about 2 millimeters in space and 2 milliseconds in time. I don't think the international community is cowering in fear of the words of a guy who probably works at an Anchorage car wash by now.
So let's rule out the bizarre connections to retired or disgraced politicians, rule out any massive Norwegian and Icelandic political muscle, and posit that somebody was promised a cut of a bunch of new Japanese car plants in their district.
Wow, talk about missing the point, which was that this proposal has been around for over three years and was pushed forward primarily by Stevens before he was disgraced because it benefits his constituents. It wasn't spearheaded or proposed by the Obama Administration as the FOX story led on.
That being said, the Obama Administration has taken ownership of the proposal now and I hope that Obama will not bow to local special interests and will decide not to support the proposal. Even if it might ultimately result in fewer whales killed each year (a dubious idea at best) we should not legitimize the slaughter by making it legal again.
What local special interests could America possibly have in whaling, the Moby Dick re-enactment troup featuring Patrick Stewart as Ahab?
If G.W. Bush still determines US whaling policy then why do we even bother having elections? If US thoughts from a long gone administration pushed by a discredited ex-Senator determines the actions of the 83 nation whaling commission then why do all the other countries' representatives even bother to attend meetings?
No, Chicago must be getting a new Toyota plant.
If things don't work out in the complex, convoluted ways that apologists promise, with more whales feeling the steel and fire of an exploding harpoon in their ribs before they drown, moaning to the rest of the pod, then the fingers will point to Big Blubber or Big Whale Oil and human greed, not the kind hearted Messiah whose only thoughts were to save Gracie (and whose advisors will get sweet kickbacks from a spankin' new auto plant!)
If G.W. Bush still determines US whaling policy then why do we even bother having elections? If US thoughts from a long gone administration pushed by a discredited ex-Senator determines the actions of the 83 nation whaling commission then why do all the other countries' representatives even bother to attend meetings?
No, Chicago must be getting a new Toyota plant.
If things don't work out in the complex, convoluted ways that apologists promise, with more whales feeling the steel and fire of an exploding harpoon in their ribs before they drown, moaning to the rest of the pod, then the fingers will point to Big Blubber or Big Whale Oil and human greed, not the kind hearted Messiah whose only thoughts were to save Gracie (and whose advisors will get sweet kickbacks from a spankin' new auto plant!)
Reading comprehension is obviously not your strong suit. I've said it twice now, but I'll spell it out for you once again. Read the words slowly so you'll understand.
I never said Bush or Stevens are influencing current administration policy. I said that they first suggested and pushed for the proposal that is still on the books from three years ago, and therefore FOX News suggesting that this was an Obama Admin originated plan was erroneous. It does not absolve Obama of the responsibility for it now, it simply corrects a factual error.
As far as local interests involved in whaling go, the previous article already mentioned it, but here's another one:
That was from 2007, not today, since I know this confuses you.
I know making semi-humorous accusations is your shtick, but you need to start backing up your comments with evidence and links (preferably from reputable sources, but we'll take this one step at a time so we don't overwork you) or not make them.
I'll begin to convert my car to run on whale oil.
I think it's you who need to work on your understanding. The Fox News article never said that Obama had originated this plan. The article said the plan was three years old, first surfacing under the Bush Administration, as we all know. What the Fox News article did directly say was that the Obama administration was pushing this plan into adoption, and that as a result of that push the plan was being adopted. Commercial whaling will now become legal.
The question is who I have to thank for the tasty whale steaks that will soon be on my grill.
I really disagreed with Reagan's whaling ban, and it will irk me if I have to warmly thank Obama for the return of teh awesome whale meat, so I really want to be certain of the facts before I have to eat crow (followed by a big slab of whale! Mmmm Mmmmm good!)
Well then, it should be easy enough to post the portion of the article that mentions either "three years old" or "Bush."
Here's what it does say though:
The administration argues that the new deal...
Under Obama's deal...
But since you're obviously going to continue to be obtuse about this, and since it's not really relevant to the story, I'll let you get the last word on the matter.
No shit the administration is currently pushing for it, in large part because of the special interests I mentioned. This was never in dispute and was mentioned in my previous posts.
And it hasn't been adopted yet, unless you've had a flashforward to June 20th. Hopefully the bad PR in the meantime can change their minds on supporting this. Let the Japanese vote against whaling by indigenous peoples for all I care.
I know you're joking, but it won't become legal in the US unless the US reverses its own ban on commercial whaling and importation of whale meat, which isn't going to happen.Commercial whaling will now become legal.
The question is who I have to thank for the tasty whale steaks that will soon be on my grill.
I really disagreed with Reagan's whaling ban, and it will irk me if I have to warmly thank Obama for the return of teh awesome whale meat, so I really want to be certain of the facts before I have to eat crow (followed by a big slab of whale! Mmmm Mmmmm good!)
Well let's look at your article.
Heck, it sounds like Ted Stevens is vastly more influential as a disgraced ex-Senator than he was as a Senator from a near-forgotten state with a tiny population. What's even more bizarre is Steven's Magnuson-Stevens Fishery Conservation Act of 1976 and later, which bans importation and port privleges of anyone engaged in driftnet fishing and acts to preserve marine ecosystems. as amended
Here is Stevens slamming the Japanese for trying to claim their industrialized commercial whale operations should be defined as "aboriginal".
He was actually concerned about the fate of the Inuit culture, and in 2008 proposed this bill to allow the Secretary of Commerce to tightly regulate Inuit aboriginal whaling in the absence of an IWC agreement, as long as it was for subsistence and didn't harm any calves and was not conducted wastefully.
Somehow the Obama administration is trying to make Stevens the fall guy for their decision to renew commercial whaling, but it just won't fly. For example, your article says Monica Medina is pushing the change, but only mentions that she is Mr. Hogarth's successor. It doesn't say who appointed her, and when, which would be Obama in February of 2010. The reason I suspect some strange deals with the Japanese is that nothing in her background indicates that she would be anything but wildly anti-whaling. Yet there she is, pushing for a renewal of commercial whaling. It can't be for Ted Stevens, since he's gone and disgraced. It can't be for the "powerful", poverty stricken, subsistence hunting, thirty member Eskimo whaling team. It can't be because she's a Bush sleeper agent, because Bush opposed commercial whaling.
So either the adminstration has been bought or it's been bamboozled. Regardless, it's us, America's whale-eaters who will benefit.
Heck, it sounds like Ted Stevens is vastly more influential as a disgraced ex-Senator than he was as a Senator from a near-forgotten state with a tiny population. What's even more bizarre is Steven's Magnuson-Stevens Fishery Conservation Act of 1976 and later, which bans importation and port privleges of anyone engaged in driftnet fishing and acts to preserve marine ecosystems. as amended
Here is Stevens slamming the Japanese for trying to claim their industrialized commercial whale operations should be defined as "aboriginal".
He was actually concerned about the fate of the Inuit culture, and in 2008 proposed this bill to allow the Secretary of Commerce to tightly regulate Inuit aboriginal whaling in the absence of an IWC agreement, as long as it was for subsistence and didn't harm any calves and was not conducted wastefully.
Somehow the Obama administration is trying to make Stevens the fall guy for their decision to renew commercial whaling, but it just won't fly. For example, your article says Monica Medina is pushing the change, but only mentions that she is Mr. Hogarth's successor. It doesn't say who appointed her, and when, which would be Obama in February of 2010. The reason I suspect some strange deals with the Japanese is that nothing in her background indicates that she would be anything but wildly anti-whaling. Yet there she is, pushing for a renewal of commercial whaling. It can't be for Ted Stevens, since he's gone and disgraced. It can't be for the "powerful", poverty stricken, subsistence hunting, thirty member Eskimo whaling team. It can't be because she's a Bush sleeper agent, because Bush opposed commercial whaling.
So either the adminstration has been bought or it's been bamboozled. Regardless, it's us, America's whale-eaters who will benefit.
I promised I wouldn't argue this with you any more, because it's utterly pointless to discuss things with someone that can't read an article correctly and flat out lies about what's been said in the hope that repeating the lie often enough will make people believe it, but...
No shit, again. Are you going to continue bringing up things that I already mentioned as if they were some new insight, while continuing to not post the one thing I asked you to show?
However, although Mr Hogarth's successor as US Whaling Commissioner, Monica Medina, has for months also been pushing the deal hard, President Obama has begun to take an interest in the issue and is understood to have expressed disquiet, and Ms Medina's attitude has shifted.
Inuits aren't powerful in terms of money or voting influence, but if you don't think if Obama was willing to risk their traditional whale hunts that there wouldn't be some bad national press generated by that, you're wrong. And that's a big part of this, along with the (misguided, in my opinion) idea that this proposal will save more whales than keeping it illegal.
Back up your comments about secret deals being struck to benefit Obama Admin officials directly.
No shit, again. Are you going to continue bringing up things that I already mentioned as if they were some new insight, while continuing to not post the one thing I asked you to show?
The Obama Administration controls the two news websites that mentioned Stevens? Where is the Obama Administration blaming Stevens, exactly?
You don't think that mentioning that President Obama has shifted her attitude makes it explicitly clear that she's part of his administration? Again, reading comprehension:
However, although Mr Hogarth's successor as US Whaling Commissioner, Monica Medina, has for months also been pushing the deal hard, President Obama has begun to take an interest in the issue and is understood to have expressed disquiet, and Ms Medina's attitude has shifted.
Keep repeating the same shit about Bush or Stevens being blamed like a broken record, maybe someone will buy that that's what I said. All that was said is that it was first proposed under their tenure, which is a fact. Deal with it. It doesn't change the fact that Obama is 100% responsible for it now, which I've said repeatedly and which you've chosen to ignore in your one-track argument.
Inuits aren't powerful in terms of money or voting influence, but if you don't think if Obama was willing to risk their traditional whale hunts that there wouldn't be some bad national press generated by that, you're wrong. And that's a big part of this, along with the (misguided, in my opinion) idea that this proposal will save more whales than keeping it illegal.
Back up your comments about secret deals being struck to benefit Obama Admin officials directly.
Calling someone pure evil and saying they deserve to have people take pleasure in their misfortune ≠ saying they are displaying poor reading comprehension and confusion.
Except when it was done as a joke or sarcastically, the Messiah crap was primarily said by those who wanted to discredit people that were voting for him by saying they were all cult-like sheep.
They repeated the lie so often that they actually started believing that people were frequently saying that for real. Most people who voted for him thought he would be a positive change from George W. Bush, not the he was going to be performing miracles in the White House.
J
Jetfire
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The problem is people expect him to fix things that are a decade old or in some cases decades old and depending on what side of the politics you are on...somethings will take longer to fix and somethings will quickly be dismantled. Being called "The One" doesn't help either.
