My Thoughts on Abrams Trek Movie

[Nightcreature]

For a long time, I was against watching this movie but after hearing so many Trek fans praise it as one of the best Trek movies ever and hardily anyone said anything bad about the movie except one of my friends, I decided to give it a chance. Luckily, I watched it in Blu-ray at a friends place so I didn't have to pay for it.

For mainstream movie fans and an introduction Trek movie for potential new fans, it does its job. It's entertaining and moves at a good pace. Star Trek movies have always been more about flash and special effects and awesome looking battles whereas the series is about story and character development. This movie certainly does a fantastic job with the battles and special effects.

I didn't like it.

Reason Number One and the biggest one of all...

They basically wiped out the Romulans in the main timeline for the sake of this movie for no good reason at all!!! So according to the comic, a huge supernova is going to destroy Romulus and the Romulans don't really care?? The Romulans are my favorite race!!

Oh and this red matter thing is pretty bad. It's not really explained well at all. Nero and his crew don't act or look like anything remotely close to how Romulans act. His ship which somehow gets Borg technology looks more like a Shadow vessel from B5.

And than lets look at the whole deal where Spock just ejects Kirk from the ship once he starts acting up instead of putting him in the brig. That would never happen in Starfleet! And on this ice planet basically Hoth II, he just happens to meet old Spock and Scotty at the same time?? What is the probability of that happening???

A few other great points were made by a friend. Kirk didn't do anything in the movie given what we know about him as a legendary captain. It was Chekov's idea to fly into where Jupiter was and hide. Spock was acting rationally the whole time when he suggested they go back to the fleet to get more ships and Kirk threw a few tantrums when Spock went for the rational decision. Also when Spock returns to duty, he should have relieved Kirk and taken command back.

Finally, Uhura and Spock is so wrong! How does a teacher get it on with a student and Spock acting like that of all people?? He wasn't even influenced by Pon Farr?

There is more but too much to put into one post.

 

[Tribbles]

I loved the movie, but I was not a Trek fan before seeing it (I'm very much into TOS now). However, I agree that Spock marooning Kirk seems a little harsh to me, too. Maybe just send him to the brig, Spock? I guess he was thinking that Kirk was not supposed to have been on the ship in the first place.

Just wondering, Nightcreature... would you be okay with Spock/Uhura if they were not teacher and student when they started their relationship?

 

[Broccoli]

They basically wiped out the Romulans in the main timeline for the sake of this movie for no good reason at all!!! So according to the comic, a huge supernova is going to destroy Romulus and the Romulans don't really care?? The Romulans are my favorite race!!

They destroyed Romulas because it was the Nero's motivation. I'd hardly call that "no good reason at all."

Oh and this red matter thing is pretty bad. It's not really explained well at all.

I would agree with this until I looked at the other Star Trek doomsday devices, namely the Genesis Device (where even the explanation is wobbly at best). All we needed to know is that it can make black holes and that is bad.

Nero and his crew don't act or look like anything remotely close to how Romulans act.

Well, they were not the typical Romulans encountered in the past. The Feds have mostly dealt with military Romulans. These guys were miners. Also, they did witness the destruction of their planet. I'm sure that kinda screwed them up a bit.

His ship which somehow gets Borg technology looks more like a Shadow vessel from B5.

The comic isn't canon. However, I will concede that even for a mining ship from the future, it looked silly.

And than lets look at the whole deal where Spock just ejects Kirk from the ship once he starts acting up instead of putting him in the brig.

Yeah, that was bizarre.

And on this ice planet basically Hoth II,

Or Ruthe Pente II or "The Naked Now" planet II

he just happens to meet old Spock and Scotty at the same time?? What is the probability of that happening???

No more probable then Khan (with a vendetta against Kirk) going after the Genesis Device that just happens to be run by Kirk's ex-flame and son with Chekov being one of the main Starfleet contacts.

Kirk didn't do anything in the movie given what we know about him as a legendary captain. It was Chekov's idea to fly into where Jupiter was and hide. Spock was acting rationally the whole time when he suggested they go back to the fleet to get more ships and Kirk threw a few tantrums when Spock went for the rational decision. Also when Spock returns to duty, he should have relieved Kirk and taken command back.

I've seen it argue that because of Kirk, these people were able to brainstorm together to stop Nero, saving Earth, and rescuing Pike. Being a good leader doesn't automatically mean you call all the shots. It also means you bring together those with the ideas to formulate the best plan possible. Later, of course, Kirk then became the pointman in executing that plan with Spock.

Finally, Uhura and Spock is so wrong! How does a teacher get it on with a student and Spock acting like that of all people?? He wasn't even influenced by Pon Farr?

ymmv.

 

[Nightcreature]

Thanks for responding.

Not really Silver TriBells. Spock was completely out of character to be acting the way he was in this movie. In short, I didn't buy it. Spock/Uhura just wouldn't happen and Uhura has a better chance getting with anyone else Kirk, Scotty, Chekov, Sulu, McCoy than Spock. There is also Pon Farr to consider.

However, I am glad this movie is introducing new Trek fans to TOS and later Star Trek series. I hope you enjoy it.

 

[Nightcreature]

They destroyed Romulas because it was the Nero's motivation. I'd hardly call that "no good reason at all."

Way to wipe out of the best races Star Trek ever created and the way it was done was terrible.

I would agree with this until I looked at the other Star Trek doomsday devices, namely the Genesis Device (where even the explanation is wobbly at best). All we needed to know is that it can make black holes and that is bad.

Actually, I thought Carol Marcus did a fine job in explaining how Genesis works. Look at her presentation again in Star Trek II - my favorite Trek movie too.

Well, they were not the typical Romulans encountered in the past. The Feds have mostly dealt with military Romulans. These guys were miners. Also, they did witness the destruction of their planet. I'm sure that kinda screwed them up a bit.

Miners that somehow got access to Borg technology?? Hmmm... I don't buy it.

The comic isn't canon. However, I will concede that even for a mining ship from the future, it looked silly.

Thank you!

Yeah, that was bizarre.

Thank you!

No more probable then Khan (with a vendetta against Kirk) going after the Genesis Device that just happens to be run by Kirk's ex-flame and son with Chekov being one of the main Starfleet contacts.

Kirk had ex-flames all over the galaxy and his son had little to do with Khan's vendetta. I don't think Khan ever found out about Kirk's son to use it against him. And Chekov serving on the Reliant is more probable than what happened to Kirk on the ice planet.

I've seen it argue that because of Kirk, these people were able to brainstorm together to stop Nero, saving Earth, and rescuing Pike. Being a good leader doesn't automatically mean you call all the shots. It also means you bring together those with the ideas to formulate the best plan possible. Later, of course, Kirk then became the pointman in executing that plan with Spock.

Except that in any normal TOS episode or movie, Kirk would have come up with the idea himself as he is the legendary captain. Instead, Chekov does and when has Chekov come up with anything in TOS??

ymmv.

No.

 

[Aragorn]

ymmv.

No.

Well I guess this says it all, doesn't it?

 

[quazar]

Wow, I don't see how one could claim to like Star Trek and then bash the new film. It's flippin perfect. Your nitpicks are rubbish. No offense.

 

[Vigilance]

For a long time, I was against watching this movie but after hearing so many Trek fans praise it as one of the best Trek movies ever and hardily anyone said anything bad about the movie except one of my friends, I decided to give it a chance. Luckily, I watched it in Blu-ray at a friends place so I didn't have to pay for it.

For mainstream movie fans and an introduction Trek movie for potential new fans, it does its job. It's entertaining and moves at a good pace. Star Trek movies have always been more about flash and special effects and awesome looking battles whereas the series is about story and character development. This movie certainly does a fantastic job with the battles and special effects.

I didn't like it.

Reason Number One and the biggest one of all...

They basically wiped out the Romulans in the main timeline for the sake of this movie for no good reason at all!!! So according to the comic, a huge supernova is going to destroy Romulus and the Romulans don't really care?? The Romulans are my favorite race!!

I'm sure the Romulans cared. Not the same as being able to do anything about it.

And if they ever do another series in the TNG timeline again, they'd have to deal with Romulus' situation. I'm sure there are survivors.

Sounds like story possibilities to me.

I also like the way it obliquely links Vulcan and Romulus yet again. Romulans wiped out in one reality, Vulcans in the other.

Nero and his crew don't act or look like anything remotely close to how Romulans act.

Huh. So you know how all Romulans act do you? That seems a little presumptive.

I have met many more humans than Romulans, and I certainly don't look at a person and say "that's not how humans act!"

And than lets look at the whole deal where Spock just ejects Kirk from the ship once he starts acting up instead of putting him in the brig. That would never happen in Starfleet! And on this ice planet basically Hoth II, he just happens to meet old Spock and Scotty at the same time?? What is the probability of that happening???

Spock was too emotional to be in command. He overreacted to Kirk's outburst because he was losing it.

They tell you this in the movie.

A few other great points were made by a friend. Kirk didn't do anything in the movie given what we know about him as a legendary captain. It was Chekov's idea to fly into where Jupiter was and hide. Spock was acting rationally the whole time when he suggested they go back to the fleet to get more ships and Kirk threw a few tantrums when Spock went for the rational decision. Also when Spock returns to duty, he should have relieved Kirk and taken command back.

I would call what Kirk did "leading". He had a direction, "save Earth". The fact that other crew members were essential to accomplishing that goal is a feature of the movie, not a bug.

As for Spock taking command again, he had clearly demonstrated that he wasn't the man for the job.

Finally, Uhura and Spock is so wrong! How does a teacher get it on with a student and Spock acting like that of all people?? He wasn't even influenced by Pon Farr?

They were both consenting adults. I don't really see how her being his student makes it wrong somehow.

There is more but too much to put into one post.

Wow, more huh.

What a shock.

And btw, it isn't just new trek fans who like this movie. I loved it, been watching trek since the 70's.

 

[Devon]

They basically wiped out the Romulans

They wiped out Romulus, not all Romulans.

in the main timeline for the sake of this movie for no good reason at all!!!

C'est le vie.

So according to the comic,

Which isn't the movie, so don't hold anything in the comic against it.

a huge supernova is going to destroy Romulus and the Romulans don't really care?? The Romulans are my favorite race!!

I think it was that the Romulan government weren't convinced.

Oh and this red matter thing is pretty bad.

How so?

It's not really explained well at all.

Well if you put two and two together, we can conclude that it is a compound that creates black holes upon detonation. Why on Earth would you need it explained to you? Did you not figure out on your own what it did?

Nero and his crew don't act or look like anything remotely close to how Romulans act.

Correction = They don't act how you thought they should act. Of course, are you going to tell me that all humans act the same?

His ship which somehow gets Borg technology looks more like a Shadow vessel from B5.

Comics, not this movie. Which are you criticizing?

And than lets look at the whole deal where Spock just ejects Kirk from the ship once he starts acting up instead of putting him in the brig. That would never happen in Starfleet!

Would and did happen. Kirk even notes in his log (this is where paying attention to the film comes in handy) that this was a direct violation of starfleet code regarding prisoners on a starship.

And on this ice planet basically Hoth II, he just happens to meet old Spock and Scotty at the same time?? What is the probability of that happening???

That was really hilarious.

Kirk didn't do anything in the movie given what we know about him as a legendary captain.

He isn't a legendary Captain yet who hasn't had 3 seasons of TV and 7 films to become that person.

It was Chekov's idea to fly into where Jupiter was and hide. Spock was acting rationally the whole time when he suggested they go back to the fleet to get more ships and Kirk threw a few tantrums when Spock went for the rational decision. Also when Spock returns to duty, he should have relieved Kirk and taken command back.

You should think this through. Had Kirk not gotten command of the ship, Chekov would have never had the idea to fly into Titan's atmosphere, and Earth would be toast. Spock was in the wrong this time.

Finally, Uhura and Spock is so wrong! How does a teacher get it on with a student and Spock acting like that of all people?? He wasn't even influenced by Pon Farr?

Show us the scenes in which Spock and Uhura "got it on?" Or do you have relationships confused with sex?

There is more but too much to put into one post.

Considering this first post, you should probably go back and rethink your criticisms before you go further.

Way to wipe out of the best races Star Trek ever created and the way it was done was terrible.

You should reconsider this. They are gone 130 years into the future of another timeline. In this timeline, in the present, they are still there. Pike even tells this to Nero.

Actually, I thought Carol Marcus did a fine job in explaining how Genesis works. Look at her presentation again in Star Trek II - my favorite Trek movie too.

Her presentation was meaningless when it was overshadowed by the first CGI animation.

Miners that somehow got access to Borg technology?? Hmmm... I don't buy it.

Comic, not the movie.

Kirk had ex-flames all over the galaxy and his son had little to do with Khan's vendetta. I don't think Khan ever found out about Kirk's son to use it against him. And Chekov serving on the Reliant is more probable than what happened to Kirk on the ice planet.

How convenient.

Except that in any normal TOS episode or movie, Kirk would have come up with the idea himself as he is the legendary captain.

Incorrect. In fact off hand in 4 of the films it was Spock who largely was responsible for saving the day! It wasn't Kirk that got them away from Reliant's explosion, it was Spock's thinking that figured it was Whales of the past that were going to save the Earth, it wasn't Kirk's idea to seek a truce with a Klingons and use a Bird of Prety to save himself, and it seemed to be Spock's doing to slap that patch on his uniform (which strangely NO klingons picked up on) that saved him from Rura Penthe.

Instead, Chekov does and when has Chekov come up with anything in TOS??

Irrelevant. He did here, thus you will have a hard time proving that it didn't happen.

Maybe just send him to the brig, Spock? I guess he was thinking that Kirk was not supposed to have been on the ship in the first place.

That, and he knew that Kirk would only figure out a way to escape.

 

[stonester1]

I'm sure the Romulans cared. Not the same as being able to do anything about it.

And if they ever do another series in the TNG timeline again, they'd have to deal with Romulus' situation. I'm sure there are survivors.

They were in charge of an entire Star Empire after all. The loss of the homeworld will be crippling, especially considering the previous crises the Empire has been dealing with. But it won't end them as a people.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

For mainstream movie fans and an introduction Trek movie for potential new fans, it does its job.

If they liked the movie, that's all the fandom that's required. These things aren't recruiting tools for Trek forums and/or conventions, and there's no reason that someone who enjoys this movie should develop an automatic interest in the old stuff.

 

[stonester1]

Although Paramount was clearly interested in reenergizing wide interest in the franchise. They should be from a monetary sense. We should be from fan sense.

I've been hearing that sales of the older stuff has picked up post Abrams film.

If so, mission accomplished all around. And all, a good thing.

 

[Shazam!]

They destroyed Romulas because it was the Nero's motivation. I'd hardly call that "no good reason at all."

Nah, it was terrible. I think it would've been much more powerful to scale it down to just Nero's wife kicking the bucket in some freakish Romulan/Vulcan experiment involving Spock and Nero that sends them back. None of this blowing up planets crap.

 

[Broccoli]

I would agree with this until I looked at the other Star Trek doomsday devices, namely the Genesis Device (where even the explanation is wobbly at best). All we needed to know is that it can make black holes and that is bad.

Actually, I thought Carol Marcus did a fine job in explaining how Genesis works. Look at her presentation again in Star Trek II - my favorite Trek movie too.

Then you are being biased, in this regard. Lets call a spade, a spade. The Genesis Device worked on magic. Marcus's informational video, while it told us what it did, it also caused the movie to come to a screeching halt. Also, lets not forget the whole "protomatter" conversation in ST3. The Red Matter was just as made-up as the Genesis Device and we were given the same basic info about it. It just wasn't as "in-your-face" in ST09. It showed, instead of told.

Miners that somehow got access to Borg technology?? Hmmm... I don't buy it.

The comic isn't canon. You seem agree with this. You can't have it both ways. Even if the comic was canon, and you read it, they explain how they got the tech.

Kirk had ex-flames all over the galaxy and his son had little to do with Khan's vendetta. I don't think Khan ever found out about Kirk's son to use it against him. And Chekov serving on the Reliant is more probable than what happened to Kirk on the ice planet.

And Scotty had nothing to do with Nero's vendetta. Both are still major coincidences thrown in their respective movies to make stuff happen.

ymmv.

No.

However, I don't know why I am continuing to have a friendly debate over the movie as your response here clearly shows you have no interest in discussing the issues in a rational manner, possibly see something from another point of view, and prefer to take an absolutist's stance.

 

[M'Sharak]

I'd like to remind everyone to stick to the points made and leave any more personal insinuations alone.

This point stood out for me:

And on this ice planet basically Hoth II, he just happens to meet old Spock and Scotty at the same time?? What is the probability of that happening???

No more probable then Khan (with a vendetta against Kirk) going after the Genesis Device that just happens to be run by Kirk's ex-flame and son with Chekov being one of the main Starfleet contacts.

Kirk had ex-flames all over the galaxy and his son had little to do with Khan's vendetta. I don't think Khan ever found out about Kirk's son to use it against him. And Chekov serving on the Reliant is more probable than what happened to Kirk on the ice planet.

His son didn't need to have anything to do with Khan's vendetta, nor did Khan need to know anything about him at all; David's mere presence is a huge coincidence, as is that of Carol Marcus. As far as probability goes, how probable is it that a planet in the Ceti Alpha system would be selected in the first place as the test site the Genesis device? On top of that, how probable is it that no one, especially Chekov, would not only not remember that Khan and company had been marooned there, but not realize until too late that they were surveying the wrong planet? No, best not to work the probability angle too hard, using TWoK as your example.

 

[startrekrcks]

I loved everything about the movie could you explain why change is such a bad thing.

 

[Agenda]

And than lets look at the whole deal where Spock just ejects Kirk from the ship once he starts acting up instead of putting him in the brig. That would never happen in Starfleet!

Keep in mind that Spock was emotionally compromised at that moment. The guy just saw his planet blown up and his mother die, so maybe he wasn't in the mood to just put Kirk in the brig.

Finally, Uhura and Spock is so wrong! How does a teacher get it on with a student and Spock acting like that of all people?? He wasn't even influenced by Pon Farr?

I don't know, but it was the best part of the movie.

 

[Tyberius]

Finally, Uhura and Spock is so wrong! How does a teacher get it on with a student and Spock acting like that of all people?? He wasn't even influenced by Pon Farr?

I don't know, but it was the best part of the movie.

And there is nothing to say that serious flirtation or romance did not occur originally between these characters.

 

[donners22]

And there is nothing to say that serious flirtation or romance did not occur originally between these characters.

There's nothing to say that Kirk and Spock didn't engage in BDSM in their off-duty hours either, by those standards, but that doesn't mean that it is at all logical or necessary to include it in a reboot.

 

[Agenda]

And there is nothing to say that serious flirtation or romance did not occur originally between these characters.

There's nothing to say that Kirk and Spock didn't engage in BDSM in their off-duty hours either, by those standards, but that doesn't mean that it is at all logical or necessary to include it in a reboot.

It's logical and necessary from a box office standpoint. Moviegoers like to see hot young people in love.