My One Question about STXI

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Please Explain: Romulus's sun going supernova. Didn't they see this coming like.. hundreds of years away?! They are an advanced spacefaring race, if their sun was headed this way surely they knew about it? Why did Spock have to warn them? Was this some special DIFFERENT kind of super nova that normal not-Spock scientists couldn't detect?

 

[Silent_Bob]

Please Explain: Romulus's sun going supernova. Didn't they see this coming like.. hundreds of years away?! They are an advanced spacefaring race, if their sun was headed this way surely they knew about it? Why did Spock have to warn them? Was this some special DIFFERENT kind of super nova that normal not-Spock scientists couldn't detect?

It wasnt Romulus's sun. It was the Hobus Star and it was a magic supernova, that can destroy the galaxy!!

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Please Explain: Romulus's sun going supernova. Didn't they see this coming like.. hundreds of years away?! They are an advanced spacefaring race, if their sun was headed this way surely they knew about it? Why did Spock have to warn them? Was this some special DIFFERENT kind of super nova that normal not-Spock scientists couldn't detect?

It wasnt Romulus's sun. It was the Hobus Star and it was a magic supernova, that can destroy the galaxy!!

And it was soooooo far away from Romulus that they didn't notice it but somehow it managed to destroy Romulus?

(I really have to read the book)

 

[Jeri]

Spock had been living in secret on Romulus in a highly dangerous, seditious, illegal effort to reunify Romulus and Vulcan. (See also, STNG:Reunification)

He's the one who put it to them about the Hobus star, since Vulcans had the ship who could stop it (Jellyfish).

So, Romulans did not trust him and had a longstanding mistrust of Vulcans anyway; they wouldn't trust any advice he gave them -- until it was too late. Some few of them did get off (including the self-serving council), but most of them did not.

 

[Silent_Bob]

Please Explain: Romulus's sun going supernova. Didn't they see this coming like.. hundreds of years away?! They are an advanced spacefaring race, if their sun was headed this way surely they knew about it? Why did Spock have to warn them? Was this some special DIFFERENT kind of super nova that normal not-Spock scientists couldn't detect?

It wasnt Romulus's sun. It was the Hobus Star and it was a magic supernova, that can destroy the galaxy!!

And it was soooooo far away from Romulus that they didn't notice it but somehow it managed to destroy Romulus?

(I really have to read the book)

I wouldnt bother, it explains no more than film does. The Hobus star turned into a magic supernova that has a shockwave that not only moves faster than light but experiences no reduction in intensity as it expands.

 

[Jeri]

The trade paperback made from the comics, "Countdown," does explain it.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

The trade paperback made from the comics, "Countdown," does explain it.

And indeed I had better stop reading this BBS and get around to reading it, LOL

 

[indranee]

it's one of the many holes in the story, IMO.

 

[Jeri]

I don't think it's remiss for most viewers; obviously, it is not. Most viewers only needed a villain as a place holder.

The entire movie was about the backstories of the main characters, and viewers were fascinated with those.

I doubt they would have sat still for any back story on the villain. It would have been the wrong thing to do.

 

[Jeri]

And indeed I had better stop reading this BBS and get around to reading it, LOL

Don't stop; you'd be missed.

 

[Zeppster]

If a star is a couple of light years from a planet and not in the solar system it can affect a planet. For example if one of the stars in the Centuri system went nova(which isn't likely) it would affect earth, It wouldn't destroy the earth or anything but it would cause a power outage Supposedly the star on Romulus was probably a blue star(even though it was yellow on screen) that's really the only way it could possibly destroy Romulus if it's close enough. None of it seems likely.

 

[Ovation]

It's no less likely that the Genesis Device (patent pending), the giant probe, V'ger, the Borg, "fluidic space", the Delphic Expanse, Q, Trelane...

The very earliest days of Star Trek tried to be not too far-fetched (warp drive and transporters excepted--but they needed a way to get around) but it didn't take long for extraordinarily fantastical things to start happening in the Trek universe. I didn't mind it, but I didn't expect it to hew closely to "hard sci-fi"--and it hasn't. It's had touches of it, but certainly not as a dominant paradigm.

 

[Sharr Khan]

It's no less likely that the Genesis Device (patent pending), the giant probe, V'ger, the Borg, "fluidic space", the Delphic Expanse, Q, Trelane...

The very earliest days of Star Trek tried to be not too far-fetched (warp drive and transporters excepted--but they needed a way to get around) but it didn't take long for extraordinarily fantastical things to start happening in the Trek universe. I didn't mind it, but I didn't expect it to hew closely to "hard sci-fi"--and it hasn't. It's had touches of it, but certainly not as a dominant paradigm.

Oh would say its always been this way. Both pilots involved super human telapaths and the second a magical space barrier.

Sharr

 

[Phily B]

Countdown sort of explains it all, but doesn't really explain how its going faster than the speed of light. I mean even in the most optimal of positions, the star would've taken quite a while to be a threat to Romulus and Vulcan.

 

[Ovation]

It's no less likely that the Genesis Device (patent pending), the giant probe, V'ger, the Borg, "fluidic space", the Delphic Expanse, Q, Trelane...

The very earliest days of Star Trek tried to be not too far-fetched (warp drive and transporters excepted--but they needed a way to get around) but it didn't take long for extraordinarily fantastical things to start happening in the Trek universe. I didn't mind it, but I didn't expect it to hew closely to "hard sci-fi"--and it hasn't. It's had touches of it, but certainly not as a dominant paradigm.

Oh would say its always been this way. Both pilots involved super human telapaths and the second a magical space barrier.

Sharr

I was thinking of it in terms of ratio of fantastical to less so in relative terms. I find the galactic barrier less implausible than I find Trelane, for example. But a sober look at Trek reveals very little "hard sci-fi" at all. I won't argue with that.

 

[superstring01]

If a star is a couple of light years from a planet and not in the solar system it can affect a planet. For example if one of the stars in the Centuri system went nova(which isn't likely) it would affect earth, It wouldn't destroy the earth or anything but it would cause a power outage Supposedly the star on Romulus was probably a blue star(even though it was yellow on screen) that's really the only way it could possibly destroy Romulus if it's close enough. None of it seems likely.

You are quite incorrect. If any star (capable of going nova) within a thousand lightyears of earth went supernova, or even nova, all life on this planet would be annihilated. When a star goes supernova, it burns more fuel in those few days than it does in all the preceding millions of years (stars that are capable of supernova, generally are super huge and burn for only a few million years). Indeed, when a star supernovas, it burns brighter than all other stars in the galaxy combined. The energy released is massive beyond any comparable maxim. In fact, a thousand LY might be cutting it close. Five thousand (or more) LY is really the safest distance. Understanding that the UFP at this time couldn't be more than a few hundred LY across, and that Romulus couldn't be more than five hundred LY from Earth, this nova actually stands to destroy all life in the UFP, Klingon and Romulan Empires (though, with hundreds of years of escape time for Earth and Qo'nos).

If it wasn't the Romulan star system and a neighboring one--say at between 1 and five LY--Romulus would have anywhere from a year (slightly more, in fact) to five years to evacuate to safe ground.

Figure Romulus's population of 6 billion. Figure every transport and shuttle within the empire, as well as a number from the UFP, and I'd say that the Romulan people stand a pretty good chance of avoiding any casualties, if any from the supernova.

This was, indeed, the biggest plot hole in the movie, especially, since the Romulans would certainly posess the technology to detect any star approaching a nova stage several hundred years off (we have this technology now).

~String

 

[Zeppster]

If a star is a couple of light years from a planet and not in the solar system it can affect a planet. For example if one of the stars in the Centuri system went nova(which isn't likely) it would affect earth, It wouldn't destroy the earth or anything but it would cause a power outage Supposedly the star on Romulus was probably a blue star(even though it was yellow on screen) that's really the only way it could possibly destroy Romulus if it's close enough. None of it seems likely.

You are quite incorrect. If any star (capable of going nova) within a thousand lightyears of earth went supernova, or even nova, all life on this planet would be annihilated. When a star goes supernova, it burns more fuel in those few days than it does in all the preceding millions of years (stars that are capable of supernova, generally are super huge and burn for only a few million years). Indeed, when a star supernovas, it burns brighter than all other stars in the galaxy combined. The energy released is massive beyond any comparable maxim. In fact, a thousand LY might be cutting it close. Five thousand (or more) LY is really the safest distance. Understanding that the UFP at this time couldn't be more than a few hundred LY across, and that Romulus couldn't be more than five hundred LY from Earth, this nova actually stands to destroy all life in the UFP, Klingon and Romulan Empires (though, with hundreds of years of escape time for Earth and Qo'nos).

If it wasn't the Romulan star system and a neighboring one--say at between 1 and five LY--Romulus would have anywhere from a year (slightly more, in fact) to five years to evacuate to safe ground.

Figure Romulus's population of 6 billion. Figure every transport and shuttle within the empire, as well as a number from the UFP, and I'd say that the Romulan people stand a pretty good chance of avoiding any casualties, if any from the supernova.

This was, indeed, the biggest plot hole in the movie, especially, since the Romulans would certainly posess the technology to detect any star approaching a nova stage several hundred years off (we have this technology now).

~String

I did not think that was true. I always figured it would have to be relatively close, I should have put a number like 10 light years. But I guess a few thousand light years is relatively close if you think about it. Most of the stars near Earth are stars in the cooler range from what I've looked up so none of them would cause violent novas if I'm not mistaken.

 

[superstring01]

If a star is a couple of light years from a planet and not in the solar system it can affect a planet. For example if one of the stars in the Centuri system went nova(which isn't likely) it would affect earth, It wouldn't destroy the earth or anything but it would cause a power outage Supposedly the star on Romulus was probably a blue star(even though it was yellow on screen) that's really the only way it could possibly destroy Romulus if it's close enough. None of it seems likely.

You are quite incorrect. If any star (capable of going nova) within a thousand lightyears of earth went supernova, or even nova, all life on this planet would be annihilated. When a star goes supernova, it burns more fuel in those few days than it does in all the preceding millions of years (stars that are capable of supernova, generally are super huge and burn for only a few million years). Indeed, when a star supernovas, it burns brighter than all other stars in the galaxy combined. The energy released is massive beyond any comparable maxim. In fact, a thousand LY might be cutting it close. Five thousand (or more) LY is really the safest distance. Understanding that the UFP at this time couldn't be more than a few hundred LY across, and that Romulus couldn't be more than five hundred LY from Earth, this nova actually stands to destroy all life in the UFP, Klingon and Romulan Empires (though, with hundreds of years of escape time for Earth and Qo'nos).

If it wasn't the Romulan star system and a neighboring one--say at between 1 and five LY--Romulus would have anywhere from a year (slightly more, in fact) to five years to evacuate to safe ground.

Figure Romulus's population of 6 billion. Figure every transport and shuttle within the empire, as well as a number from the UFP, and I'd say that the Romulan people stand a pretty good chance of avoiding any casualties, if any from the supernova.

This was, indeed, the biggest plot hole in the movie, especially, since the Romulans would certainly posess the technology to detect any star approaching a nova stage several hundred years off (we have this technology now).

~String

I did not think that was true. I always figured it would have to be relatively close, I should have put a number like 10 light years. But I guess a few thousand light years is relatively close if you think about it. Most of the stars near Earth are stars in the cooler range from what I've looked up so none of them would cause violent novas if I'm not mistaken.

You're right, most stars near us are the cooler ones. I've heard two different tales about novas and supernovas. I'm not astrophysicist, but there are the "really big ones" and the "normal ones" so I guess I do stand corrected a bit.

Spica (a star system about 250 LY away from Earth) can go nova. The type of nova it could undergo is not powerful enough to hurt the Earth. The really big supernovae (the kind that create gamma ray busts and can destroy all life within several thousand LY) are extremely rare. The nearest star that can undergo that type of supernova is Betelgeuse and it's about 500LY away. When it goes (in a few million years) it can very destroy all life within about 1000 LY. But, by then we'll either be so evolved that it won't matter... or we'll be extinct.

Great conversation, though!

~String

 

[Zeppster]

You are quite incorrect. If any star (capable of going nova) within a thousand lightyears of earth went supernova, or even nova, all life on this planet would be annihilated. When a star goes supernova, it burns more fuel in those few days than it does in all the preceding millions of years (stars that are capable of supernova, generally are super huge and burn for only a few million years). Indeed, when a star supernovas, it burns brighter than all other stars in the galaxy combined. The energy released is massive beyond any comparable maxim. In fact, a thousand LY might be cutting it close. Five thousand (or more) LY is really the safest distance. Understanding that the UFP at this time couldn't be more than a few hundred LY across, and that Romulus couldn't be more than five hundred LY from Earth, this nova actually stands to destroy all life in the UFP, Klingon and Romulan Empires (though, with hundreds of years of escape time for Earth and Qo'nos).

If it wasn't the Romulan star system and a neighboring one--say at between 1 and five LY--Romulus would have anywhere from a year (slightly more, in fact) to five years to evacuate to safe ground.

Figure Romulus's population of 6 billion. Figure every transport and shuttle within the empire, as well as a number from the UFP, and I'd say that the Romulan people stand a pretty good chance of avoiding any casualties, if any from the supernova.

This was, indeed, the biggest plot hole in the movie, especially, since the Romulans would certainly posess the technology to detect any star approaching a nova stage several hundred years off (we have this technology now).

~String

I did not think that was true. I always figured it would have to be relatively close, I should have put a number like 10 light years. But I guess a few thousand light years is relatively close if you think about it. Most of the stars near Earth are stars in the cooler range from what I've looked up so none of them would cause violent novas if I'm not mistaken.

You're right, most stars near us are the cooler ones. I've heard two different tales about novas and supernovas. I'm not astrophysicist, but there are the "really big ones" and the "normal ones" so I guess I do stand corrected a bit.

Spica (a star system about 250 LY away from Earth) can go nova. The type of nova it could undergo is not powerful enough to hurt the Earth. The really big supernovae (the kind that create gamma ray busts and can destroy all life within several thousand LY) are extremely rare. The nearest star that can undergo that type of supernova is Betelgeuse and it's about 500LY away. When it goes (in a few million years) it can very destroy all life within about 1000 LY. But, by then we'll either be so evolved that it won't matter... or we'll be extinct.

Great conversation, though!

~String

Betelgeuse will NOT do this. In fact there's a chance that the star may have already gone nova we just won't know about it because we see it like it was about 650 years ago.


http://www.earthsky.org/radioshows/48792/betelgeuse-could-become-supernova
Schaefer said that even if Betelgeuse became a supernova, it would be too far away to do us any actual harm.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

It's no less likely that the Genesis Device (patent pending), the giant probe, V'ger, the Borg, "fluidic space", the Delphic Expanse, Q, Trelane...

The very earliest days of Star Trek tried to be not too far-fetched (warp drive and transporters excepted--but they needed a way to get around) but it didn't take long for extraordinarily fantastical things to start happening in the Trek universe. I didn't mind it, but I didn't expect it to hew closely to "hard sci-fi"--and it hasn't. It's had touches of it, but certainly not as a dominant paradigm.

Well I don't have a problem with a super-dooper-nova moving at lightspeed and selectively destroying one planet in its trajectory.. I couldn't watch Trek if I had a problem with that. What I don't get is why the Romulans who seem like pretty smart cookies and quite science oriented didn't detect this.

Countdown calls..

:: puts on coffee::

Oh and thanks to posters for reassuring me that the nearest stars to earth aren't planning to do this in the near future.