My copy of Shada arrived today

[23skidoo]

So, I have the Tom Baker VHS reconstruction, and the Paul McGann/Lalla Ward Audio Play version. Is there anything different/extra in the Lalla Ward reading the Book version that would convince me to buy it, when I already ahve the other two versions, which I love?

The reconstruction was only part of the story, as you know. The McGann version was a reimagining/retelling which was adapted and changed considerably to allow for the Eighth Doctor. Roberts's novel is a 300+-page expansion of Adams' original story. I think it's a no-brainer, personally, whether you choose the (unabridged, I believe) reading by Ward, or the book itself. This is the whole enchilada as opposed to a taster plate in terms of the Baker reconstruction and a whole different recipe in terms of the McGann version.

Also, this is the first "new" Fourth Doctor novel to be published in about 7 or 8 years and marks a return to publishing novels in general based on pre-revival Doctors which BBC Books had retired back in 2005. That's a major selling feature in and of itself.

Alex

 

[Pindar]

It is unabridged, 10 cd's totalling about 11 hours.

 

[23skidoo]

It is unabridged, 10 cd's totalling about 11 hours.

So that's another selling feature - 11 hours of Lalla. Not too shabby...

Alex

 

[Rarewolf]

Lalla hasn't done any Target readings that I'm aware of, so this is quite a rare event (I actually had expected them to get Tom Baker).

Nope that's correct the only Romana 2 Target story done to date is Creature From The Pit, which Tom read.

It would have been good to finally hear Tom read the other lines, but Lalla (and John Leeson) seem to have Shada on the brain.

This is the 4th Shada Lalla has done - the original, the McGann, the Ian Levine animation preceed it, whilst John Leeson clocks up Big Finish, Animation and Book.

Which is equally impressive, considering he didn't play K9 that season!

 

[CaptainMatt]

Thats right, David Brierly was the voice of K-9 for Season Seventeen and even then he did not appear in every serial.

 

[Pindar]

It is unabridged, 10 cd's totalling about 11 hours.

So that's another selling feature - 11 hours of Lalla. Not too shabby...

Alex

It also has John Leeson doing K-9

 

[23skidoo]

Thats right, David Brierly was the voice of K-9 for Season Seventeen and even then he did not appear in every serial.

I was reading an article on Shada and JNT tried several times - even after Baker left - to remount it as a special so that the story could be completed. Brierly was contacted about recording new lines as K-9, even though Leeson had come back by this point, for continuity reasons. Sadly, the actor is now deceased, so he wouldn't have been available to do the Shada audio book (he was around back in 2003 when they did the webcast, though, but they used Leeson for that).

Nope that's correct the only Romana 2 Target story done to date is Creature From The Pit, which Tom read.

I get the feeling they're recording these pretty much in random order - maybe in the order they get the rights or something. With Shada now published all eyes are on whether BBC Books gets the greenlight to do City of Death next, so there might be another chance for Lalla to do that one. (Hopefully there'll be a book and not just an audio as is the case with October's release of Resurrection of the Daleks.) I looked ahead and the next Target fourth Doctor release is Androids of Tara in July and they haven't announced who'll be doing that one (hopefully Mary Tamm since it was very much her story).

Alex

 

[CaptainMatt]

Well, I just ordered the Shada hardback off e-bay so I am looking forward to that, as I am most assuredly a 4th Doctor-Romana II fan.

 

[Rarewolf]

[I looked ahead and the next Target fourth Doctor release is Androids of Tara in July and they haven't announced who'll be doing that one (hopefully Mary Tamm since it was very much her story).

Alex

The reader has been announced, it's John Leeson.

Androids Of Tara is a new adaption like Stones Of Blood. I suppose they might try and do Pirate Planet as there is a rough Key To Time theme going, in the near randomness of it.

Armageddon Factor was a thin book though. Be cool if Bob Baker could do a new adaption.

The producer of the Shada book revealed he is very keen to work with Lalla again.

It's not to do with rights, its just what ever order they feel like doing them in. Just counting the on my CD cabinet there's already passed 40 of them, so it could hit the 1/3 point next year.

 

[23skidoo]

^ I sort of wish they'd stop doing the remakes. I happened to like the original Dicks adaptation, and I honestly didn't like the new version of Stones of Blood and stopped listening about an hour in (mind you that was partly because I didn't care for the reading, which was done by one of the guest stars rather than someone like Tamm or Leeson). The idea of the audios was to make the original Targets available again. And while BBC Books is reprinting some of them, it'll probably be 2030 before they get around to reprinting the Key to Time books!

I sort of feel sorry for Terrance Dicks because these are his works being replaced. And while granted there are some Dicks novelisations which are so short they almost qualify as novellas rather than as novels (indeed some of the Quick Reads releases of recent years are longer), and as such could stand to be redone (Image of the Fendahl comes to mind) I never thought the Key to Time books were given short shrift. When they get around to doing an audio of Ribos Operation they better use the original text otherwise fans of the late Ian Marter will be plenty pissed.

Alex

 

[Rarewolf]

When they get around to doing an audio of Ribos Operation they better use the original text otherwise fans of the late Ian Marter will be plenty pissed.

Surprised you missed it, that was out before Stones, read by John Leeson.

With the two new David Fisher adaptions of his two scripts - its just that - they are his scripts. They could go back to the source rather than employ someone new.

Personallly I'd quite like to hear Bob Baker re-novelise Armageddon Factor, he's never written a Doctor Who novel.

I do wonder how they will tackle some of the smaller classics though. A Boxset perhaps?

 

[23skidoo]

Surprised you missed it, that was out before Stones, read by John Leeson.

I did miss it (scuttles over to Amazon....)

(...scuttles back because I haven't hit Submit Reply yet...)

With the two new David Fisher adaptions of his two scripts - its just that - they are his scripts. They could go back to the source rather than employ someone new.

Personallly I'd quite like to hear Bob Baker re-novelise Armageddon Factor, he's never written a Doctor Who novel.

I do wonder how they will tackle some of the smaller classics though. A Boxset perhaps?

I agree, if they're going to do it, then this is the right way to go about it. Especially in the cases of writers who express regret at not doing so before (which I believe is the case with David Fisher). The only problem is the versions by Dicks, Marter and the other house writers are also a part of the history. I'd actually rather see readings of the original books included as bonus items (maybe MP3 files) so one can compare. I mentioned earlier I wasn't that thrilled with Fisher's adaptation of Stones of Blood. I've seen a few folks comment that they liked Dicks' version better. Just because you can write a good story for TV doesn't necessarily mean you can write a novel. That said, I won't write off Androids of Tara out of hand just because I didn't care for Stones of Blood.

A box set would be a great idea, but probably themed. A natural choice would be the four Trial of a Time Lord novelisations (now that's a candidate for a redo as the original novelisation for Mindwarp is still infamous for its "Peri as WWF wrestling valet for Yrconos" epilogue!) I assume none of them have been done yet (or maybe they have as I know they've done other Colin Baker stories and even some McCoys so they're not sticking with the older books).

Alex

(NOW he scuttles over to Amazon...)

 

[Pindar]

Anyone else finished Shada yet?

I have, it's excellent. I have one criticism, the word naughty is used far too many times but other than that I have no complaints.

 

[23skidoo]

Anyone else finished Shada yet?

I have, it's excellent. I have one criticism, the word naughty is used far too many times but other than that I have no complaints.

Dammit, I want to read the thing, but almost the day I got it I began a string of writing and editing jobs that has barely left me enough time to skim the latest DWM, never mind read Shada. But I did read the first few chapters and decided I like it a lot more than Coming of the Terraphiles (which lost me after 50 pages) so I'll have it read before too long, I'm sure!

Alex

 

[Pindar]

Anyone else finished Shada yet?

I have, it's excellent. I have one criticism, the word naughty is used far too many times but other than that I have no complaints.

Dammit, I want to read the thing, but almost the day I got it I began a string of writing and editing jobs that has barely left me enough time to skim the latest DWM, never mind read Shada. But I did read the first few chapters and decided I like it a lot more than Coming of the Terraphiles (which lost me after 50 pages) so I'll have it read before too long, I'm sure!

Alex

I only got it because you started this thread.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

I did read the first few chapters and decided I like it a lot more than Coming of the Terraphiles (which lost me after 50 pages) so I'll have it read before too long, I'm sure!

Page 50 is about where I was ready to give up on Terraphiles. It wasn't bad to that point, but it wasn't what I was expecting. I was expecting trippy space opera, I wasn't expecting an extended Wodehouse pastiche. I was also expecting the Doctor to be more present; in the first fifty pages, the Doctor and Amy are supporting characters. It's around page 100 that Terraphiles kicks into gear and the Doctor does something more than have an extended vacation. At that point, it becomes very Who-ish.

Why not start the book at that point? Because there's a reason for the first hundred pages. Moorcock is setting up his world and the way it works. It's very Robert Holmesian, in a way, not unlike the first episode of "Caves" where you spend most of your time learning about Androzani Major and Androzani Minor.

I quite like Terraphiles. I struggled with it at first, but once it starts to move, it really moves. And I enjoy the fifth season more because of Terraphiles; Moorcock's book meshes well with the overarching plot of the fifth season and adds some new wrinkles.

 

[23skidoo]

Why not start the book at that point? Because there's a reason for the first hundred pages. Moorcock is setting up his world and the way it works. It's very Robert Holmesian, in a way, not unlike the first episode of "Caves" where you spend most of your time learning about Androzani Major and Androzani Minor.

I've considered that. I've tried 5 times to read the Lord of the Rings too and find Fellowship so boring that a few people have suggested I skip it and just read the other two. You and I aren't the first to note the "first 50" hurdle with this book (which I have to say makes the book a fail, I'm afraid, even if the rest of the book is fine). I'll probably end up doing what you suggest. I feel the book - what I've read of it - also suffers from the fact it was written before Matt Smith's Doctor was really established so I didn't think Moorcock got the voice right for him, at least early on. But that's not a huge deal as the same could be said for all of the Ninth Doctor novels, which would have been written before Eccleston appeared on screen, and they turned out fine in the end.

I guess I just expected Moorcock, being the first huge name in ages (ever?) to write a Who novel to hit the ground running a bit more. I'm not a fan of the "Start the story in the middle, then rewind to 'Three days earlier' and see how we got there" storytelling cliche that has invaded modern television, but I'd actually have gone for that with Terraphiles. Thing is, and I speak here as a professional book editor, it doesn't matter what your intentions are, if the reader is only 50 pages in and decides "I have better things to do with my time" which is exactly what my mindset became, the manuscript is a fail and probably should be rejigged in some way to address the issue, and it usually can be done without sacrificing the actual content. (Having not read the whole book, of course, I don't know if the "Three days earlier" format would have even been possible in Terraphile's case).

Alex

 

[Mr Pointy Ears]

I googled the latest rounds of dr who dvds and the site i got mentioned that Shada will be release along with a special dvd.

 

[23skidoo]

I googled the latest rounds of dr who dvds and the site i got mentioned that Shada will be release along with a special dvd.

Yeah, it might not be till 2013 (and for good reason), but the plan as I understand it is to basically reissue the 1990s VHS release of Shada (which had Tom Baker hosting and explaining what went on in the unfilmed sequences), with some additional material, and release it alongside the 1993 documentary More Than 30 Years in the TARDIS (which is why 2013 the anniversary year is assumed for the release). No word as to whether the documentary will be updated or not. No word either as to whether the animated Shada with Paul McGann will be included, though I'd assume not.

Alex

 

[Rarewolf]

I'd assume not too (they don't own the audio, and Big Finish don't own the visuals!)

Besides which Ian Levine would be livid if they did that.

He spend £25,000 to animate the missing bits properly (and professionally) with most of the original cast providing the vocals. But they won't (or can't) touch it.