Misjudged?

[JeffinOakland]

I'm rewatching the pilot and I'm struck by how obnoxious Neelix is. I know the writers told him to ham it up but I think they misjudged how unlikable he would be. I think they had hoped he would be the "outsider" commentator on human behavior like Spock/Data/Odo and Quark but that never materialized because it was impossible to respect his opinion. What do you think?

 

[Catarina]

Oh it was obvious he was realllly obnoxious. I don't need a flash back to jog that.
Like, how soon do we kill him off obnoxious. Oh damn, he has entire episodes, the writers like him, but he's obnoxious.

I think it was a huge misjudgement. I usually see the good in people. I just couldn't with Neelix. Michael Westmore seemed eager to show off his latest design. You might say even smug like we'd give him a thumbs up for blending two cartoon characters together to create Neelix.

However, I'd say around season 5 that all changed. more so season 6-7. He demonstrated giving. And his tone changed to almost a sadness as he expressed that he didn't feel appreciated ( Haunting on Deck twelve he expressed how he valued appreciation which meant in reality it lacked a bit)

first season he was bitter and cynical about the crew. Now he loves them and hopes they see that and he longs for it to be reciprocated. It might be why he was so quick to be with his own kind but that wasn't the original question so I'll stop there

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

I think he should've been more of a "lovable scoundrel" type, like Mr Solo. Personally Neelix is bothersome and irritating, though he's not my most unliked character on the show.

He probably was meant to have that angle to him, and does show it a few times (like wanting to leave after Kes is rescued and not going into the living nebula), though I suspect his "alien" ways were meant to fall more into line with the enlightenment of Starfleet.

 

[Amaris]

I like Neelix because I love Ethan Phillips. I think he's okay in the show, but he could often be quite annoying. That said, Tuvok was often downright cruel in how he treated the Talaxian.

 

[Catarina]

I don't think Neelix was assigned that role. come to think of it, I think seven was. She in away became an observer of humanity and a voice as she studied them and sometimes tossed it in their faces. it's 3 am here I might be off the ball on this theory.
Neelix was suppose to be their eyes into the delta quadrant and when that task ran out, he was there because of Janeway's loyalty to him and learning he was valued. I think that hit home with him and he really embraced his role on the ship (as annoying and meddlesome as i might have found it at times)

 

[Catarina]

Ethan Phillips has such a great energy about him. I felt it should have been utilized sooner. Maybe it wasn't meant to be. Maybe it was the point to reveal him in layers and become a sympathetic character but wasn't entirely realized until the end. we didn't get to see him around the clock. Perhaps there were glimpses worth giving him chances for and we the audience finally got to see why he wasn't out an airlock first change (figuratively speaking.)

 

[OtherGene]

I thought Ethan Phillips was great in his First Contact cameo. I have to say I enjoyed that cameo more than his early performances on Voyager. By the end I was more or less happy with the character but, more than any other, he took the longest to bed in with me (maybe Malcom on Enterprise took longer).

 

[CorporalClegg]

I loved Neelix after he stopped being a creep.

 

[Doctor Clu]

I used to call Neelix "Birdman". I remember watching the show originally (Voyager) and thinking how annoying he was and that they should kill him off. When you binge watch a show later it is funny how you see things differently. I've done that recently with Voyager. With the current movies being so extremely different Voyager is a welcome flash back to more familiar times in Trek. Neelix as a binge watch episode after episode is a cantankerous, well meaning, multitalented guy. Almost a vaudeville kinda touch to him. A oddball among Federation and former Maquis. In the end, I didn't find him any more odd than any of the rest of the odd crew of Voyager.

 

[JeffinOakland]

I don't think Neelix was assigned that role. come to think of it, I think seven was. She in away became an observer of humanity and a voice as she studied them and sometimes tossed it in their faces. it's 3 am here I might be off the ball on this theory.
Neelix was suppose to be their eyes into the delta quadrant and when that task ran out, he was there because of Janeway's loyalty to him and learning he was valued. I think that hit home with him and he really embraced his role on the ship (as annoying and meddlesome as i might have found it at times)

The character 7of9 was created to act as the outsider commentator in part, I think, because neither of the original outsiders (Kes or Neelix) developed into that role.

 

[JeffinOakland]

I like Neelix because I love Ethan Phillips. I think he's okay in the show, but he could often be quite annoying. That said, Tuvok was often downright cruel in how he treated the Talaxian.

I thought Neelix was very rude and intolerant of Tuvok in a speciest sort of way. I identify more w Tuvok than Neelix because Vulcans are more introverted like me and Neelix was extremely extroverted. One thing that annoys most introverts is when extroverts tell them to "lighten up" "have fun" "express yourself". Neelix needed to be more respectful of Tuvok's Vulcan nature.

 

[maneth]

Neelix was a bit of a creep, especially until Kes left. I never liked him much. In fact, I would have preferred Tuvix to both Neelix and Tuvok, even if Tuvok is my favorite male on the show.

 

[Paradise City]

He becomes a court jester figure once Voyager leaves the territory he is familiar with. The writers have some problems trying to give him a solid role, making the character a little too lightweight. Although he has some good individual episodes later on; particularly the episode where he confronts Tuvok on the nature of their relationship.

 

[Terok Nor]

Ethan Phillips is a good actor but I detest the character of Neelix. Such an overbearing, ingratious (is that a word?), obnoxious, creepy asshole. I can't believe he lasted almost the entire run of the series. He should have been offed instead of Kes. He was truly worthless in every way imaginable. Keeping the even more creepy Tuvix around might have been fun for a while until he snapped and started murdering the crew in their sleep and had to be put down.

 

[Catarina]

Keeping the even more creepy Tuvix around might have been fun for a while until he snapped and started murdering the crew in their sleep and had to be put down.

I can't believe I thought this, but at the time of the airing i believe Neelix was written in the worse way and Tuvok was underdeveloped that I wouldn't have missed with for the Tuvix. yikes that I thought that.

 

[stardream]

I thought the Doctor was supposed to be the 'outsider'?

Early Neelix I could do without. He got on my nerves big time and the whole 'Neelix can't cook' thing got old (although it might have been nice if there had been a scene where it was discovered that what he cooked would have tasted good...to anther Talaxian).

Along about the time of Fair Trade things changed. He settled down and wasn't quite so annoying although he did have his moments.

 

[JeffinOakland]

The Dr started out as comic relief and developed into a sympathetic character. He was always too self-absorbed with
his self-improvement to bother to observe humans.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

I used to call Neelix "Birdman". I remember watching the show originally (Voyager) and thinking how annoying he was and that they should kill him off. When you binge watch a show later it is funny how you see things differently. I've done that recently with Voyager. With the current movies being so extremely different Voyager is a welcome flash back to more familiar times in Trek. Neelix as a binge watch episode after episode is a cantankerous, well meaning, multitalented guy. Almost a vaudeville kinda touch to him. A oddball among Federation and former Maquis. In the end, I didn't find him any more odd than any of the rest of the odd crew of Voyager.

I literally just finished a rewatch of the series yesterday. I didn't find the character so annoying this time as I did when the series was new. I found I didn't really dislike any aspect this time around.

 

[Lynx]

I have to disagree with some points here. I don't find Neelix that obnoxious.

Annoying sometimes, yes. But not obnoxious.

I must also state that I do find Neelix one of the best characters Star Trek ever have come up with!

I guess that some people who are reading this are shaking their heads now. "Has he really gone off the rails totally now?" some people might think. Or "Has this something to do with Kes?"

But I have not gone off the rails and it has almost nothing to do with Kes.

As I see it, Neelix was actually the most "normal" character in Star Trek. An example of a poor guy who has gone through a terrible trauma and is trying desperately to move on and live despite that.

As I've wrote before in another post,
he character had more depth than I think many people realize.

His whole "comical" and somewhat annoying behavior was actually a result of a terrible trauma in which he lost his whole family. To cope with that horrible experience, he took on his duty to help, to cheer people up and to be as useful as possible for the Voyager crew.

OK, he was overdoing a lot of things which gave the opposite result of what he wanted and he screwed up his relationship with Kes. But that was also a result of the trauma which affected him deeply. He was a very complex person.

If Voyager had had a counselor, that person would have had to spend a lot of time with Neelix because the poor guy really did have some "issues".

Neelix desperately tried to "fit in". Obviously he did know deep down inside that his skills were limited so he tried to compensate for that with a lot of ideas and whims, like his self-made role as "Morale Officer", how he became almost obsessed with the idea of being an "investigating journalist", the Talaxian resort he created at the holodek (which Harry and Tom totally changed) and his bragging about his skills as guide while his knowledge about the Delta Quadrant was limited. That was also one of the reasons why he and Kes started to drift apart as soon as they came on board Voyager.

Kes found a purpose for her life on the ship. A new reality, new people, the Hydroponics Bay, her work in sickbay and an ardent will to learn and explore.

Neelix on the other hand found his skills rather limited and therefore did all he could to get attention, like "look at me, I'm good, see what I can accomplish. His jealousy over Kes probably had something to do about being jealous of how good Kes did adapt to the new life and become an useful member of the crew while he did find himself limited. Not to mention that his control over Kes started to vanish as soon as they joined the Voyager crew.

I also think that he still had bad memories about what happened to his family so in an attempt to keep those feelings away he tried to be positive, cheerful and tried to cheer up everyone on the ship, like "I want happiness around me so smile!".

Of corse he over-did almost everything he was involved in. His pestering of Tuvok was actually horrible and annoying (but fun to watch) and I can understand Tuvok's frustration over those current attacks from Neelix. But his intentions were good.

Just because of all this, I find Neelix interesting, likeable and a good written character (except for how they dumped him at the end, a stupid decision from the writers). I think Neelix is the only character ever i've found both likeable and somewhat annoying at the same time.