Medical officers in PIC: White or blue?

[JRoss]

Trek has not canonically remained beholden to the three division/color scheme, nor does it need to.

See the TOS films.

Yeah, I liked that the Monster Maroons had four colors, with command in white. Or how in TMP there were actual structural, practical differences in the uniforms so you knew what you were looking at.
Also, even though command in TOS is supposed to be green, only Shatner's uniform showed up green onscreen, so basically four divisions in TOS, too.
And the color meanings change over time. TOS era command is yellow/green, in TNG it's red, and in the 29th century it's blue. By the 32nd century it's back to red.

 

[fireproof78]

I at least appreciated TOS, DSC and Kelvin having a cross to designate medical vs. General Science.

 

[Timo]

Yeah, I liked that the Monster Maroons had four colors, with command in white.

A veritable rainbow, really: they inherited all the TMP colors, ditched orange, changed red to mean Academy, and added at least dark green for the commando team of TFF and dark blue for stewards, of all things, in TUC. Had the story called for it, dentists would probably have gotten a shade of green of their very own...

And the color meanings change over time. TOS era command is yellow/green, in TNG it's red, and in the 29th century it's blue. By the 32nd century it's back to red.

Command is blue in the 2230s, too, as per the 2009 movie. (And before that, it was yellow for starship folks but apparently red for admirals in ENT, in the 2150, although arguably that was a different Starfleet altogether. Except in the finale, I guess.)

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Synodic]

I think they should be white, but will probably be blue with a bit of white. It never made sense for medical to not have some degree of differentiation and I can't imagine them sticking to just blue, considering LD and DIS.

 

[JRoss]

A veritable rainbow, really: they inherited all the TMP colors, ditched orange, changed red to mean Academy, and added at least dark green for the commando team of TFF and dark blue for stewards, of all things, in TUC. Had the story called for it, dentists would probably have gotten a shade of green of their very own...



Command is blue in the 2230s, too, as per the 2009 movie. (And before that, it was yellow for starship folks but apparently red for admirals in ENT, in the 2150, although arguably that was a different Starfleet altogether. Except in the finale, I guess.)

Timo Saloniemi

Oh, okay. Thanks for the clarification. As a kid I hated the monster maroons, and the TMP uniforms. They grew on me so much as I got older.

 

[Mister Spock]

I quite like the delineation of science and medicine as blue and white, respectively. Although I'd maybe compromise by having the medical team wearing white scrubs or tunics whilst working in Sickbay and standard blue uniforms when they're not. Like how Dr. Crusher wore her blue lab coat whilst on duty.

 

[Sci]

All of the uniform colors have white highlights on LD.

Although I agree, if doctors on LD wear blue, then PIC will probably keep to that. I just thought that since PIC is a streaming live-action show like DSC, they'd adopt DSC's white. Which wouldn't look half bad, really...

An interesting thing to consider is that the use of white for medical actually originated, IIRC, in ST09's depiction of the 2230s Starfleet uniforms aboard the USS Kelvin. So depicting 2250s Starfleet medical personnel in white is keeping continuity with ST09's depiction of the 2230s. It's easy enough to assume that Starfleet consolidated medical with science in the 2260s before consolidating everyone together in British Redcoat colors in the 2280s.

 

[CorporalCaptain]

An interesting thing to consider is that the use of white for medical actually originated, IIRC, in ST09's depiction of the 2230s Starfleet uniforms aboard the USS Kelvin. So depicting 2250s Starfleet medical personnel in white is keeping continuity with ST09's depiction of the 2230s. It's easy enough to assume that Starfleet consolidated medical with science in the 2260s before consolidating everyone together in British Redcoat colors in the 2280s.

TMP did it first.

https://movies.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/tmp/themotionpicture1194.jpg

nuTrek also copied Kirk's TMP admiral uniform.

 

[Sci]

TMP did it first.

https://movies.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/tmp/themotionpicture1194.jpg

nuTrek also copied Kirk's TMP admiral uniform.

A fair point, although TMP's uniforms are so anomalous within the evolution of Starfleet uniform design that I tend not to pay too much attention to it.

 

[Zor-El]

I want them to use white but I won't be the least bit upset if they use blue

 

[fireproof78]

A fair point, although TMP's uniforms are so anomalous within the evolution of Starfleet uniform design that I tend not to pay too much attention to it.

The TMP uniforms actually work well if you track from ENT to the USS KELVIN to Discovery.

 

[FederationHistorian]

White probably only came into being to define the Federation medical division, since pre-Federation did not seem to have a designated colour code; Phlox did not wear a Starfleet uniform as CMO and it seems like both red (engineering/security) and blue (sciences) were able to work and assist in sickbay. Wearing white in the 32nd century as seen in the DIS S3 finale seem to be a throwback to the 23rd century since the Federation is re-establishing its identity post-Burn. SNW seems like it will mix both blue and white for the medical division.

I think blue makes for sense for anything set in the second half of the 24th century or the TOS/TAS era. But its not established as the colour code for the medical field after the 24th century.

 

[The Wormhole]

Phlox did not wear a Starfleet uniform as CMO

That's because Phlox was not a Starfleet officer.

it seems like both red (engineering/security) and blue (sciences) were able to work and assist in sickbay.

That just means those particular redshirts had training as a medic. Just like on Voyager where Tom Paris was the most qualified to be a nurse/assistant/corpsman/whatever in sickbay despite wearing red himself.

 

[FederationHistorian]

That's because Phlox was not a Starfleet officer.

And there’s no official record if he ever gained a Starfleet commission.

That just means those particular redshirts had training as a medic. Just like on Voyager where Tom Paris was the most qualified to be a nurse/assistant/corpsman/whatever in sickbay despite wearing red himself.

Which means that era had a lot of medics, which keeps in line with the idea of the early pioneers wearing many hats. And addresses the lack of a larger medical staff at the time.

 

[Shamrock Holmes]

A veritable rainbow, really: they inherited all the TMP colors, ditched orange, changed red to mean Academy, and added at least dark green for the commando team of TFF and dark blue for stewards, of all things, in TUC. Had the story called for it, dentists would probably have gotten a shade of green of their very own...

Actually, the TMP scheme was white (Command), orange (Sciences), green (Medical), red (Engineering), gold (Operations), grey (Security).

The "Monster Maroon" scheme retained white, split green into mid-green (Medical) and dark green (Security), switched orange to grey, adding some of Operations, merged red and the rest of gold into gold and assigned gold to Academy, and added sky blue (Yeomen/Mess) and dark blue (combat, "Federation forces").

 

[CorporalCaptain]

Actually, the TMP scheme was white (Command), orange (Sciences), green (Medical), red (Engineering), gold (Operations), grey (Security).

But in TMP division colors did not imply uniform colors, and the doctors treated patients wearing white uniforms. Picture shown above.

 

[The Wormhole]

And there’s no official record if he ever gained a Starfleet commission.

If he had, he would have been wearing a uniform.

Which means that era had a lot of medics, which keeps in line with the idea of the early pioneers wearing many hats. And addresses the lack of a larger medical staff at the time.

It just means they were just staying consistent with actual naval practices of today. The NX-01 had a crew of eighty or so, on a crew that small of a modern day naval vessel, there's only going to be one dedicated medical officer, with a handful of personnel from around the ship who are also trained medics who can help out in emergencies.

But I suppose "Starfleet isn't military" so we have to disregard that, don't we?

 

[FederationHistorian]

If he had, he would have been wearing a uniform.

Well, its not like there was any follow-up on that, in the Kurtzman shows or the reboot movies. Even Archer’s history after ENT is very vague for the amount of times he gets namedropped, and we know he got promoted to Admiral, became an Ambassador to Andoria, ended up on the Federation Council and later became Federation President.

It just means they were just staying consistent with actual naval practices of today. The NX-01 had a crew of eighty or so, on a crew that small of a modern day naval vessel, there's only going to be one dedicated medical officer, with a handful of personnel from around the ship who are also trained medics who can help out in emergencies.

But I suppose "Starfleet isn't military" so we have to disregard that, don't we?

Well, early Starfleet wasn’t. The MACOs were. Then they merged once the Federation was founded, making Starfleet part-military even though they lead with a message of peaceful exploration.

Doesn’t change the fact that wearing multiple hats was a thing back then. First officer and Vulcan liaison. Comms officer and first contact protocol. Tactical, armoury, chief of security & liaison to Section 31. Pilot, navigator and freighter liaison. Chief engineer and second officer. Being the CMO, the dentist, and the veterinarian. Captain and unofficial ambassador.

 

[The Wormhole]

Well, early Starfleet wasn’t. The MACOs were. Then they merged once the Federation was founded, making Starfleet part-military even though they lead with a message of peaceful exploration.

Whether or not Starfleet is or isn't a military will never be satisfactorily settled and is besides the point here. The point is, the situation with the medical staff on the NX-01 is consistent with the medical staff of ships in present day with comparable crew sizes and should be interpreted as nothing more than a reflection of reality rather than any deeper in-story meaning.