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Marvel's New 52 (or less)

It's an interesting concept, at the very least. It does make me wonder about the time travel aspect, especially since it's said not to be the focus. There are a few possibilities, as it could be the catalyst for some "New-52" style changes, a means of creating another alternate reality, a reset button waiting to happen, or a "timey-wimey" explanation.

I don't know about that. Marvel seems to take pride in the whole idea of "Unlike the Distinguished Competition, we've never rebooted our history

...except for the times they have.

Not only is the sliding time scale arguably a constant, if neccessary, form of reboot, but both Onslaught/Franklin Richards and Peter Parker's deal with Mephisto caused reboots.

Yes, they were arguably partial or in continuity reboots, but the same can be said for Crisis, Zero Hour and/or Flashpoint.
 
^But those were partial reboots at best. The idea behind One More Day was that the timeline wasn't actually altered, Mephisto just erased everyone's memories of certain things. So that Spidey and characters around him were in different situations/relationships, but the rest of Marvel history wasn't really affected.

And then there are things like the John Byrne reboot of Spidey's origin story, which was poorly received and subsequently ignored. When Marvel has tried to do DC-style continuity rewrites, it generally hasn't stuck.
 
^But those were partial reboots at best.

Which I noted and addressed by pointing out that DC's reboots were actually partial as well, especially the latest one where Morrison's Batman and Johns' GL were pretty much carried over completely from pre-Flashpoint

The idea behind One More Day was that the timeline wasn't actually altered, Mephisto just erased everyone's memories of certain things.

Except that in practice Peter was clearly younger and Aunt May didn't die, ie, stuff didn't happen. Therefore, a reboot.

the rest of Marvel history wasn't really affected.

Except where it was. ;)

And then there are things like the John Byrne reboot of Spidey's origin story, which was poorly received and subsequently ignored. When Marvel has tried to do DC-style continuity rewrites

Wait. I thought you said Marvel prided itself on not doing DC-style continuity rewrites?

You've missed your calling. Instead of working on adaptations for Marvel you should be some politicians' press secretary. ;)

it generally hasn't stuck.

When DC has tried DC-style continuity reboots it generally hasn't stuck either. Further evidence that Marvel's reboots are, in fact, not that different than DC's.
 
It's an interesting concept, at the very least. It does make me wonder about the time travel aspect, especially since it's said not to be the focus. There are a few possibilities, as it could be the catalyst for some "New-52" style changes, a means of creating another alternate reality, a reset button waiting to happen, or a "timey-wimey" explanation.

I don't know about that. Marvel seems to take pride in the whole idea of "Unlike the Distinguished Competition, we've never rebooted our history! All those stories from 1962 really happened, except they actually happened in 2002 now!" So I doubt they'd go that route. They are planning to emulate the "New 52" in terms of a big promotional push and revamp to try to attract new readers and lure back old ones (so I read on the comics sites), but without the DC-style continuity restart.

Well, I'd agree. And unless they are looking to create another "Ultimate" Universe, that rules out that possibility. Which leaves us with "reset button" or "timey-wimey."

But, being Marvel, I shouldn't leave out another option: "It's magic! We don't have to explain it!" Though, the argument could be made, that's the "timey-wimey" possibility, just swap out the word "magic" with the phrase, "time travel."
 
^But those were partial reboots at best. The idea behind One More Day was that the timeline wasn't actually altered, Mephisto just erased everyone's memories of certain things. So that Spidey and characters around him were in different situations/relationships, but the rest of Marvel history wasn't really affected.

The whole point of One Moment in Time was to show the precise moment where the timeline was altered (I believe it had something to do with a devil-bird picking a car lock). If Marvel's original intent was that the timeline was unchanged (only recalled differently), they changed course on that rather quickly.
 
Changing course slightly here, but consider this: Marvel has been around now approximately the same amount of time (fifty years) as DC was when it first rebooted. Maybe it is time to clear away some of the half century of detritus
 
^But those were partial reboots at best.

Which I noted and addressed by pointing out that DC's reboots were actually partial as well, especially the latest one where Morrison's Batman and Johns' GL were pretty much carried over completely from pre-Flashpoint

Yes, obviously neither company is completely committed to a single approach, but there is a difference in how they present it and justify it in-universe. DC has repeatedly shown massive events taking place that have rewritten the entire course of history and created new timelines, although some elements usually survive the timeline shift or get reintroduced in some form after a while. Marvel has persisted in the pretense that its continuity is a single continuous whole, although sometimes it modifies parts of it. The difference is in which is the rule and which is the exception.



Except that in practice Peter was clearly younger and Aunt May didn't die, ie, stuff didn't happen. Therefore, a reboot.

In practice, yes, obviously. But I'm talking about the theory, the explanation presented in-universe. The claim was that only certain events were altered while the overall timeline remained intact, as opposed to the DC method where the entire timeline is rewritten wholesale except for certain events that carry over.



And then there are things like the John Byrne reboot of Spidey's origin story, which was poorly received and subsequently ignored. When Marvel has tried to do DC-style continuity rewrites

Wait. I thought you said Marvel prided itself on not doing DC-style continuity rewrites?

You've missed your calling. Instead of working on adaptations for Marvel you should be some politicians' press secretary. ;)

There is no excuse for this kind of childish hostility. Are you honestly trying to engage in a discussion, or are you just looking for excuses to insult and argue with people? If it's the latter, then I have no interest in continuing the discussion.

What I'm saying is that Marvel prefers to present itself as a continuous, unbroken history, partly because the occasional exceptions they've made to that rule have worked out poorly. So I'm not saying they've never tried it. I'm saying that their occasional dabbles with doing it have been poorly received so they prefer not to do it on the whole -- as opposed to DC, which has wholeheartedly embraced the practice of universe-wide continuity reboots on a recurring basis. Yes, of course the two companies do similar things on occasion, but they present them differently and emphasize them differently. As a matter of company identity and image, DC is the company that reboots everything from scratch roughly once a decade while Marvel is the company that pretends its entire history still counts even while continuously rewriting the details.



When DC has tried DC-style continuity reboots it generally hasn't stuck either. Further evidence that Marvel's reboots are, in fact, not that different than DC's.

But it hasn't stuck in a different way. Byrne's Spider-Man reboot only affected that one character and was abandoned within a year and never spoken of again. That did sort of happen with Superman: Birthright, but on the whole, DC's reboots are universe-wide and only get retconned piecemeal after years or decades. There's an obvious difference of degree.
 
Wait. I thought you said Marvel prided itself on not doing DC-style continuity rewrites?

You've missed your calling. Instead of working on adaptations for Marvel you should be some politicians' press secretary. ;)
There is no excuse for this kind of childish hostility. Are you honestly trying to engage in a discussion, or are you just looking for excuses to insult and argue with people? If it's the latter, then I have no interest in continuing the discussion.

The winking thing meant I was just kidding around. I just found it kind of funny you started out this aspect of the discussion by saying "Marvel seems to take pride in the whole idea of 'Unlike the Distinguished Competition, we've never rebooted our history'" (emphasis added) and then, in an effort to explain why I was mistaken, said "When Marvel has tried to do DC-style continuity rewrites..."

No hostility intended whatsoever. It was just my way of pointing out, in what was intended as a humorous manner, that you seemed to have contradicted yourself.

What I'm saying is that Marvel prefers to present itself as a continuous, unbroken history, partly because the occasional exceptions they've made to that rule have worked out poorly....
Which would seem to call Marvel's motives, competency and/or veracity into question. They might be better off, as I said back at the beginning of the thread either doing a whole reboot, and doing it right, than not doing one at all.

Yes, I realize that a slew of new number ones will help the short term bottom line but it won't bring in new readers, or at least keep them. At some point, Marvel needs to either stop churning out the same handful of gimmicks over and over or the company is going to be kaput.
 
So Jean coming back is the Jean from the past or is she going to be reborn?? I am confused on this subject...lol
 
The X-Men who will be starring in Bendis's All-New X-Men are the original five X-Men brought forward in time. Yes, Jean Grey will be the original Jean Grey, i.e. Marvel Girl.
 
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