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Marvel Comic's sliding timeline & its problems

EJA

Fleet Captain
I believe it's been mentioned before on this forum how strange and awkward the timeline of events in the universe of Marvel Comics can be, owing mostly to the sliding timeline approach that's often used, shifting events written decades ago closer to current time. I've found a rather interesting page full of information on the subject:

http://marvel.wikia.com/Marvel_Time

The discussion on Magneto's background in relation to the timeline is particularly insightful.
 
Each story takes place as I'm reading it, with the history of the book as a vague idea of the character's past.
 
Yeah, sometimes I wonder about this.

Is the Punisher still a Vietnam vet?
Is Magneto still a Holocaust survivor?
Did Iron Man still get captured in the Korean War? (has this officially become Afghanistan in the comics yet?)

Well you could alter Magneto's origin to the ethnic cleansing in 1990s Yugoslavia, but that would probably make him too young.
The Punisher could be a Gulf War I vet or a Gulf War II vet...
 
They've updated Iron Man's origin story (for the billionth time *sigh*) so it takes place in Afghanistan/middle east with terrorists like in the movie in the Iron Man Extremis story.
 
Yeah, sometimes I wonder about this.

Did Iron Man still get captured in the Korean War? (has this officially become Afghanistan in the comics yet?)

Well you could alter Magneto's origin to the ethnic cleansing in 1990s Yugoslavia, but that would probably make him too young.
It was Vietnam. As for Magneto how about Cambodia, a European expat caught up in the killing fields.
 
i think the idea is to keep the concepts relevant to the modern reader. Time waits for no man.
 
Frank Castle's background has been modified so he now served in a vague military operation somewhere in Southeast Asia, I believe.

Magneto's ties to WW2 are too integral to his character to be changed drastically. He lost his entire family to the carnage. You can say he got zapped by some alien ray that retarded his ageing process for a couple of decades, but that doesn't clear up all the problems, as the article in my first post points out. Even if he didn't physically age, he would still have decades of experience over Xavier when they first met, so it's unlikely he would view Xavier as an intellectual equal at that time.

It's not just Magneto either. Look at characters like Nick Fury and Dum Dum Dugan, who were grown men in WW2. Yes, Fury has had the anti-ageing serum since WW2, but Dugan and co only started receiving it from the 1970s (which, with the sliding timescale, would probably only be around a decade ago from now, at the most). If they were fighting in WW2, they'd have been very old and decrepit by then.

One of the solutions the Marvel Wiki article proposes is that in the Marvel universe, events such as WW2 occur much closer to current times than they do in the real world, i.e. on Earth-616, the Second World War probably took place in the early 1960s. That would solve a number of problems with characters like Magneto and Nick Fury, but a part of me feels ill at ease with the idea of shifting a major event like World War II around in time. Then again, for some stories to work, we have to assume that in the Marvel 'verse the Soviet Union lasted much longer than it did in the real world, in order for characters like the Soviet Super Soldiers/Winter Guard to properly function.
 
I don't like the idea of moving World War II into the 60s.

Slightly off-topic; did 9/11 happen in the DCU? I know Marvel did a bunch of 9/11 comics but the DCU initially pretended it didn't happen, using Our Worlds At War to substitute it (which was already being made before 9/11 happened ironically).
 
Both Magneto and Xavier have been renewed/cloned/impersonated so many times I've lost count :) In fact, one of the major plot threads of the 90's X-men relaunch was that Magneto's DNA was tampered with by Moira Mctaggert, making him more docile (and hence joining the X-men for a while in the 80s).
 
In my view, people are overthinking the problem... and it's something that will actually get better as time moves forward, not worse. How?

An example is in how Captain America is cited as a man out of time, who eventually will be stretched to the breaking point as WWII becomes a distant memory.

But let's turn it into a parallel example. Let's say that instead of Captain America, we're talking about, oh, Captain Sparta. This guy who's a frozen Spartan warrior thawed out in whatever year. No matter if he appears in 2011, or Space Year 2511, the foundations of his character and what he represents will resonate, because the story of his era - romans and spartans and greeks and persians - has become a solid historical and mythological foundation.

It's weird that some folks don't see events like World War II have achieved the same kind of transcendent historical positioning. People aren't going to forget what kind of characterization WWII gave to the world of its era; it's going to remain a studied subject of history. It's iconic. If WWII being distant was enough to break Captain America, it would have already happened by now - 40s and 50s America is dead and buried (in spite of one last gasp of a real world political movement to bring the worst parts of it back from the dead). Kids today with thar cell phones and thar facebooks and thar internet global community awareness shouldn't have any reason to identify with Captain America, yet they do. People still get what the guy stands for and why he can be poignant, when written well at least.

Eventually, Cap (as just one example here) will indeed become more mythological, like a frozen man of Sparta out of time, but that won't ruin the character. He might become a little more like that partial tribute to him, The Old Soldier from Astro City. But if anything that'll just allow the character to become a more powerful figure. (Heck, I'd go full retro, and emphasize Cap's World War II origin with his presentation and dress.)

Same thing applies to Magneto and Xavier, really. It's just that Xavier hasn't been treated quite as mythologically as Magneto, so his position is a bit more strained. That can be fixed though. Xavier and Magneto eventually, should perhaps become two legendary figures from the mists of time, who inspire a kind of awe when they reappear.
 
Frank Castle's background has been modified so he now served in a vague military operation somewhere in Southeast Asia, I believe.

Is that recent? Because just two years ago he was still a Vietnam vet and close to sixty years old, albeit in INCREDIBLE shape (sort of like real life Sylvester Stallone).
 
What about Reed Richards rushing the launch if his spacecraft to beat the dreaded Soviets to study the Cosmic Rays?
 
What about Reed Richards rushing the launch if his spacecraft to beat the dreaded Soviets to study the Cosmic Rays?

Oddly enough, I don't think the Soviet space race angle ever really stuck to the FF. They represent a spirit of adventure, and their space launch doesn't seem to hinge on any particular era.

Their cosmic ray accident doesn't have to be the result of a rushed launch to beat an adversary. It could for example, be due to not wanting to miss a rare opportunity that has a narrow launch window. (Goes even better with who they are; it happens purely due to the quest for knowledge and human advancement.)
 
What about Reed Richards rushing the launch if his spacecraft to beat the dreaded Soviets to study the Cosmic Rays?
It got retconned twice in the first year or two, I think. It was a trip into space, a trip to Mars and a trip to the stars. By the thirtieth anniversary it had become a hyperspace trip to another galaxy.

Also, in 1998 or thereabouts there was a one-off where the Thing apparently finds himself in an alternate world where the FF's flight took place in 1961 and Marvel time was real time; ie certain characters were now in their seventies, Onslaught (1996 or so) had happened years ago when for him it was only months, and Gwen Stacy had disappeared or died in 1973. The Thing even muses that not one of the FF had been around in 1961!
 
I dont see any problems. If you retell the origin, you update the minor details. Seems simple to me. Dates, fashion and current events aren't that important to the characters.

As for Captain America, if Buck Rogers can wake up in the 25th Century and adjust then Steve Rogers can too.
 
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