Man it sucks having female friends...

[Gov Kodos]

What? I thought you didn't like that ...

My complaint is more about the fact that there are certain things she won't do because her boyfriend is insecure that a woman with perhaps a less insecure boyfriend would do. Having a drink with a friend is not the end of the world, and yes, it's not the end of the world that this particular friend of mine will never have a drink with me, it was just that at that instance when I thought of it it sounded like it would be something fun to do.

Hmm. I prefer socializing with my husband in general, and I'd rather have a drink with him than anyone else (if I did drink). If he wasn't feeling up to it or had work or something like that, I'd maybe have a drink with a guy friend. I'd have to be pretty comfortable with the guy though, and my husband would have to know him as well. It's not something I would do on a regular basis.

Also yes, it is sounding like what you want is a date.

It does. The couples mutual security and attitude to being with others is for them to decide, not you, Aldo. It does sound like a date, as you don't seem to like that they do have, at some level, a status which can and does exclude you. You sound like you wish you could have an equal level of importance to command of her attention. That is what makes this sound like you want a date or a girlfriend, imo.

 

[Aldo]

I can only say what I can say, and that is I really don't want a relationship with this woman, or a date. Yes, I do think highly of her, I look to her as my best friend.

And in my defense, she's not quite my type, I usually go for girls younger than me.

 

[Shatnertage]

I like having male friends that are attached. I get along more easily with guys and I like not having to be concerned about mixed signals.

I find it annoying sometimes that (in my life) such friendships only occur through the filter of the wife, but I guess that's the usual dynamic. I vastly prefer women as friends but now and then I would like to socialize or chat with an attached male but am socially unable to do so without the wife being the conduit to the husband.

Doing the Mr. Mom thing I hang out a lot with other mommies. Especially over the past two weeks, when my wife's been at home with the newborn and I've been taking our older daughter to all of her classes, I'm usually the only dad there. Since most of the moms already know my wife it's pretty easy to talk to everyone, and it's kind of fun. And I usually get to know the husbands through the wives, so it's kind of the opposite of what you're describing.

That being said, I can't imagine going out for drinks socially with an opposite-sex friend if it wasn't part of a bigger group thing. I'm not really going out for drinks these days anyway (unless I have to for a work thing), but even if everyone had the best of intentions, I wouldn't want it to look like I was leaving my wife at home so I could go out drinking with another woman. It just doesn't seem respectful to me.

 

[Aldo]

That makes sense. Sometimes I get so caught up in me I don't consider how the situation could be for her. I see having a drink with a friend, others probably wouldn't see it that way.

 

[Australis]

Bingo.

 

[nevermore]

That being said, I can't imagine going out for drinks socially with an opposite-sex friend if it wasn't part of a bigger group thing. I'm not really going out for drinks these days anyway (unless I have to for a work thing), but even if everyone had the best of intentions, I wouldn't want it to look like I was leaving my wife at home so I could go out drinking with another woman. It just doesn't seem respectful to me.

Seriously? I just went out with two opposite-sex friends, one of whom is in a relationship, and one of whom isn't, and at no point did anything regarding sex or the adequacy of any existing relationships come up. Don't you think that by judging the social viability of a persion based on their gender, you're allowing your own gender and/or sex in general, to define you too much? Is that all you are?

 

[Shatnertage]

Huh?

I just don't think there's any positive spin you can put on going out drinking with another woman (not as part of a group) while your wife's sitting at home. Like I said, no matter what the reality of the situation is, it doesn't really look good. It's not about "social viability" (though to be honest I really don't understand that term), it's about treating the person who you've agreed to share your life with respectfully. And being seen having a ball with other women while she's at home just doesn't seem respectful to me.

I just couldn't see myself doing it, but I'm not about to start telling other people how to handle their marriages. It's just what works for me.

 

[Aldo]

nevermore makes a good point too. What's really coloring a lot of people's view of the situation with me is how I've acted about women in the past. It's true that I usually fall for everyone, especially girls (and women) that I am friends with. This usually ends my friendship with them because I get feelings that are so strong I can't see myself being friends with them any further.

Which is why I usually end up losing a lot of friends, sure some of them were only my friends because I was crushing on them and secretly hoped it would escalate, but there is that rare time where I become friends with someone where friendship is all I honestly and truly want from them.

 

[Goji]

I have typically had more female friends than male friends. I wouldn't say that it sucks, far from it. There have been issues between us, including some that wouldn't have occurred between myself and other guys, but that's just the price of friendship.

The only time things really started to get ugly was when my current girlfriend changed her relationship status on Facebook to reflect us being together... and then all of a sudden a couple of girls I had considered friends started treating me very differently. I hadn't been with a girl during my friendship with either of them (or ever before, really). One eventually got over it, after claiming that she'd had a crush on me for years and it was somehow upsetting that I never read her mind and acted on it and have now chosen a different girl. The other never admitted to liking me and I don't think that she did... I don't know what the hell her problem was and I haven't spoken to her since. She didn't know my girlfriend personally so I guess she simply objected to the idea of me having one at all? Weird.

See, this is why I hate Facebook.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

The only time things really started to get ugly was when my current girlfriend changed her relationship status on Facebook to reflect us being together... and then all of a sudden a couple of girls I had considered friends started treating me very differently. I hadn't been with a girl during my friendship with either of them (or ever before, really). One eventually got over it, after claiming that she'd had a crush on me for years and it was somehow upsetting that I never read her mind and acted on it and have now chosen a different girl. The other never admitted to liking me and I don't think that she did... I don't know what the hell her problem was and I haven't spoken to her since. She didn't know my girlfriend personally so I guess she simply objected to the idea of me having one at all? Weird. .

I've seen this happen a lot. I would guess that these women felt a certain possessiveness about you even if they didn't want a romantic relationship with you. When your girlfriend made it clear that she now had more dibs on you by virtue of it being a romance they felt displaced and pouted over it. This is why sometimes women really like having gay male friends because they can continue to be possessive about them forever and no woman is ever going to come along and claim more rights.

That makes sense. Sometimes I get so caught up in me I don't consider how the situation could be for her. I see having a drink with a friend, others probably wouldn't see it that way.

The other point I would say to you is that when you have kids it can be quite a lot of effort to get out at night to socialize. Sure maybe the dad is at home to be with the kids but there is a TON of other unseen stuff that goes into planning to go out in the evening. The woman may have to change her whole evening schedule around going out, what time she makes dinner, when she makes kids lunches for the next day, when she bathes kids, when she puts on the washing machine.. that might sound like nothing to you but there are a ton of running the house and kids things that women do in the evening that they are going to have shove into an earlier part of the day which already had it's own workload assigned to it.

Frankly, it has to be quite a good offer as far as evening socializing to put in this effort. All YOU have to do is drive over to the place you want to have drinks at so it seems like a small thing but for a busy working mom it can be a huge organizational shuffle.

 

[Kestra]

My best friend in high school was gay though he wasn't out at the time. Things got really weird between us when I got a boyfriend. It can be difficult to suddenly not be the most important person, or to have to share.

 

[Mr Awe]

Perhaps I could add some more substance now:

I've known this girl for about a year now, I've grown very close with her on a platonic level. I tell her everything and she's helped me through some tough times in my life this last year.

Sounds like you should be thankful and appreciative rather than saying it sucks?

Mr Awe

 

[JarodRussell]

With my male friends I talk about sports. With my female friends I talk about sex. With my girlfriend, I do both.

 

[Mr Awe]

That makes sense. Sometimes I get so caught up in me I don't consider how the situation could be for her. I see having a drink with a friend, others probably wouldn't see it that way.

Exactly! Now you're growing up a little!

Mr Awe

 

[An Officer]

Female friends are a blessing and a curse.

 

[Aldo]

Well, moved into my new place on Sunday, and as I mentioned above my friend is a five minute drive away. And as I surmised I've already been over there twice to hang out.

The whole drink thing was based on the assumption that it would just be me and her. I have a friend in Portland who's visiting me on her 21st birthday and Heidi mentioned she wouldn't mind going out for drinks in that context.

 

[Goji]

The only time things really started to get ugly was when my current girlfriend changed her relationship status on Facebook to reflect us being together... and then all of a sudden a couple of girls I had considered friends started treating me very differently. I hadn't been with a girl during my friendship with either of them (or ever before, really). One eventually got over it, after claiming that she'd had a crush on me for years and it was somehow upsetting that I never read her mind and acted on it and have now chosen a different girl. The other never admitted to liking me and I don't think that she did... I don't know what the hell her problem was and I haven't spoken to her since. She didn't know my girlfriend personally so I guess she simply objected to the idea of me having one at all? Weird. .

I've seen this happen a lot. I would guess that these women felt a certain possessiveness about you even if they didn't want a romantic relationship with you. When your girlfriend made it clear that she now had more dibs on you by virtue of it being a romance they felt displaced and pouted over it. This is why sometimes women really like having gay male friends because they can continue to be possessive about them forever and no woman is ever going to come along and claim more rights.

That's... really creepy.

 

[SmoothieX]

With my male friends I talk about sports. With my female friends I talk about sex. With my girlfriend, I do both.

Get back to me when you have sex during halftime of a sporting event you are both watching.

Then the dirty euphamisms follow:
- Splitting the uprights
- Penetrating the defense
- Hitting the tight end
- Illegal touching
- Neutral zone infraction
- Finding the hole
- Pump fake

Need I go on?

 

[JarodRussell]

With my male friends I talk about sports. With my female friends I talk about sex. With my girlfriend, I do both.

Get back to me when you have sex during halftime of a sporting event you are both watching.

Does the locker room count?

 

[amir]

Hmm. I prefer socializing with my husband in general, and I'd rather have a drink with him than anyone else (if I did drink). If he wasn't feeling up to it or had work or something like that, I'd maybe have a drink with a guy friend. I'd have to be pretty comfortable with the guy though, and my husband would have to know him as well. It's not something I would do on a regular basis.

Also yes, it is sounding like what you want is a date.

And that is why it can suck having female friends, as the OP says. If I'm having a quiet weekend, and I want to hang out with a guy friend or two, I totally can just call up and suggest we catch a bite or a movie. Or in your case, a female friend of yours could just call up, and you two could hang out or go somewhere without being mindful of social boundaries.

With opposite gender, there's so much more potential for mixed signals. It is true - and I'll admit to having done it once or twice - that a guy asks a female friend about hanging out, but he wants a date in his heart of hearts. It has also happened that my intentions are genuinely friendly, but after I suggest hanging out and getting a drink, she feels hesitant, and then you realize this and stop suggesting hanging out again and... awkward drifting apart ensues.

I've been in a couple of situations (where I already had a girlfriend, I might add), where a female friend suddenly became much more reserved, and less friendly than she had been prior to getting a boyfriend. I'm not saying it's the fault of women, and it is logical to keep boundaries to prevent much much worse mixups.
But...it can suck sometimes. That is why I try now to avoid being fond of females platonically, until we know each other well enough that I don't have to worry about being "suspected". Guy friend dynamics are so much smoother in some ways, especially since there is much less analysis going on. I just wish as large a percentage of men were effective conversationalists, as compared to women.