Madonna vs Micheal Jackson!

[Jayson]

As big as Jackson was in the 80's does he really compare to how big Madonna was, during the same era? If anything, she is proably more famous because her career was never soiled by things like pedophile charges. Madonna has had her share of controversies but nothing that has really done as much harm to her rep as the stuff, Jackson had to face. He was seen as creppy and wierd where she was simply seen as slutty and ecentric.

Jason

 

[Kirk's_Tights]

Both will always be big stars, both had scandals. If you think Madonna has never been involved ina scandal, you should probably do some research. She has been in more news than Michael, easily, between her Sex book, her religious views, her adoptions, her apparent" cheating", her divorce....

MJ wasn't harmed much by his scandals. People still bought his music and he had sold out concerts, plus, it put him in the news at a time when he didn't have any new music out.


Not sure how you think his career was hurt at all. His latest tour sold out almost right away.

 

[Jayson]

Both will always be big stars, both had scandals. If you think Madonna has never been involved ina scandal, you should probably do some research. She has been in more news than Michael, easily, between her Sex book, her religious views, her adoptions, her apparent" cheating", her divorce....

MJ wasn't harmed much by his scandals. People still bought his music and he had sold out concerts, plus, it put him in the news at a time when he didn't have any new music out.


Not sure how you think his career was hurt at all. His latest tour sold out almost right away.

Micheal Jackson was still popular but I think it's safe to say his mainstream appeal in America was damaged. You would never see Micheal Jackson doing something like the Super Bowl half-time show like he once did, once everyone pretty much asumed he was a pedophile. When is the last time he had a big hit? People were intrested in him but saw him as a sideshow freak. Madonna was still putting out hits into the late 90's. For all the scandals she has had I don't think they really hurt her like Jackson's did. Only reason she isn't quite as big as she once was nowdays is because she got old. Also she moved to Britian and thinks she is British. I think people were more turned off by that, than any of the sex scandals and religion thing has been around since the 80's so I don't think that really had much of a impact on her popularity. The only people she pissed off is people who porably would have hated her anyways.

Jason

Jason

 

[Star Wolf]

As big as Jackson was in the 80's does he really compare to how big Madonna was, during the same era? If anything, she is proably more famous because her career was never soiled by things like pedophile charges. Madonna has had her share of controversies but nothing that has really done as much harm to her rep as the stuff, Jackson had to face. He was seen as creppy and wierd where she was simply seen as slutty and ecentric.

Jason

During the 80s Madonna was an upstart dance music singer who hit super status with the sexual tease of her lifestyle. Michael Jackson was the biggest celebrity in the world, King of Pop, breaking the color barrier on MTV, etc. He built up and beyond his child star of the 70s status. Most music acts of the 80s were weird, the hair bands, Madonna and her sex image, Prince with his "am I black or white, straight or gay" image. Only the older holdovers from the 70s like Springsteen or Lionel Ritchie, among the major acts were "normal' people.

 

[Kirk's_Tights]

Micheal Jackson was still popular but I think it's safe to say his mainstream appeal in America was damaged. You would never see Micheal Jackson doing something like the Super Bowl half-time show like he once did, once everyone pretty much asumed he was a pedophile. When is the last time he had a big hit? People were intrested in him but saw him as a sideshow freak. Madonna was still putting out hits into the late 90's. For all the scandals she has had I don't think they really hurt her like Jackson's did. Only reason she isn't quite as big as she once was nowdays is because she got old. Also she moved to Britian and thinks she is British. I think people were more turned off by that, than any of the sex scandals and religion thing has been around since the 80's so I don't think that really had much of a impact on her popularity. The only people she pissed off is people who porably would have hated her anyways.

Jason

Jason

Sorry but I disagree.

MJ doesn't have to make music to be popular. He changed music so regardless of whether or not he made new music or not, he would still be famous. He did enough musically that it didn't matter how much music he made, he was still going to be an icon.

His last album was in 2001. Sure, it's been a while, but it's not like he hasn't done anything musically this decade.


Um, when was the last time Madonna did a Superbowl show? Granted, I don't watch it every year but I don't recall her performing and, regardless, performing at the Superbowl means nothing. They've had tons of garbage bands/artists perform over the years. It doesn't make you "good" if you appear during a Superbowl game and if they had asked Jackson, or if he had asked to appear, there is no doubt in my mind they would allow him to perform and the place would go crazy.

Jackson wasn't hurt badly. Who cares if he released fewer albums than Madonna? That doesn't mean his career was hurt by scandal. He just didn't have material at the time. Bad argument.

No matter what MJ did, he was always in the public eye, from his skin disease to his famous mugshot. He doesn't have to make music all the time to be a huge star. He already solidified his status ages ago. His career spanned over 45 years. I'd hardly say he was ever hurt by anything he did.

Madonna is just as popular as she was in the 80's and her change in music styles has gotten her a lot of new fans. She keeps up with the times and makes music that is popular. Saying she is "old" is stupid. How many women her age are that fit? Not many. Her age means nothing. It's about the music.

Look at Johnny Cash and tell me age has something to do with being popular or not. He was old and still putting out hits. If you seriously disregard someone as being good because they are old, you are not a music fan.

 

[Jayson]

Micheal Jackson was still popular but I think it's safe to say his mainstream appeal in America was damaged. You would never see Micheal Jackson doing something like the Super Bowl half-time show like he once did, once everyone pretty much asumed he was a pedophile. When is the last time he had a big hit? People were intrested in him but saw him as a sideshow freak. Madonna was still putting out hits into the late 90's. For all the scandals she has had I don't think they really hurt her like Jackson's did. Only reason she isn't quite as big as she once was nowdays is because she got old. Also she moved to Britian and thinks she is British. I think people were more turned off by that, than any of the sex scandals and religion thing has been around since the 80's so I don't think that really had much of a impact on her popularity. The only people she pissed off is people who porably would have hated her anyways.

Jason

Jason

Sorry but I disagree.

MJ doesn't have to make music to be popular. He changed music so regardless of whether or not he made new music or not, he would still be famous. He did enough musically that it didn't matter how much music he made, he was still going to be an icon.

His last album was in 2001. Sure, it's been a while, but it's not like he hasn't done anything musically this decade.


Um, when was the last time Madonna did a Superbowl show? Granted, I don't watch it every year but I don't recall her performing and, regardless, performing at the Superbowl means nothing. They've had tons of garbage bands/artists perform over the years. It doesn't make you "good" if you appear during a Superbowl game and if they had asked Jackson, or if he had asked to appear, there is no doubt in my mind they would allow him to perform and the place would go crazy.

Jackson wasn't hurt badly. Who cares if he released fewer albums than Madonna? That doesn't mean his career was hurt by scandal. He just didn't have material at the time. Bad argument.

No matter what MJ did, he was always in the public eye, from his skin disease to his famous mugshot. He doesn't have to make music all the time to be a huge star. He already solidified his status ages ago. His career spanned over 45 years. I'd hardly say he was ever hurt by anything he did.

Madonna is just as popular as she was in the 80's and her change in music styles has gotten her a lot of new fans. She keeps up with the times and makes music that is popular. Saying she is "old" is stupid. How many women her age are that fit? Not many. Her age means nothing. It's about the music.

Look at Johnny Cash and tell me age has something to do with being popular or not. He was old and still putting out hits. If you seriously disregard someone as being good because they are old, you are not a music fan.

I think to alot of people her being old is a issue, because sex appeal was always apart of her appeal. I think she still looks good for her age myself but I do wonder if she got to a age where people no longer wanted to see her doing sexy moves and whatnot on a stage. Guys seem to be able to get away with that more so than females,whether it's fair or not.

I agree that Micheal Jackson is a icon. Madonna is a icon though as well that seemed to be able to hold on to her mainstream appeal somewhat longer than Jackson did in terms of making music the mainstream public wanted to hear, and not just his devoted fanbase. To me though the pedophile charges just kill alot of respect people have for Micheal Jackson. No scandal Madonna had every reached something as horrid as that. I think that scandal overshadowed all his achievements in the 80's. I mean people hasn't forgotten what he did in the 80's but it's hard to move beyond the pedophile stuff. You can't talk about Micheal Jackson without talking about that scandal or should I saw scandals because he had several when it comes to children,

With Madonna the scandals and the music exsit on a more equal-setting. I would even say some of the scandals were to her advantage. Being seen as slutty is not a bad thing I would think, if sex is something your trying to sell. Being a pedophile never helped Jackson out in his career.

Jason

 

[Kirk's_Tights]

No offence but you are rather closed minded on the age issue.


Sex appeal doesn't have to come from a young person. Sean Connery was almost 60 when he was voted sexiest man alive.

http://thebosh.com/upload/2008/07/1...affairs_and_failed_marriages/Raquel-Welch.jpg

Raquel Welch is 68 and still has sex appeal.


Age has nothing to do with being sexy, my dear.

 

[barnaclelapse]

I'd say Jackson will have the more enduring appeal, but I guess he also now has the added benefit of dying young. Jackson definitely had a great mystique about him, but I don't know if that lends itself towards the idea that he was the bigger icon.

I guess history will have to work it out for us.

 

[Jayson]

No offence but you are rather closed minded on the age issue.


Sex appeal doesn't have to come from a young person. Sean Connery was almost 60 when he was voted sexiest man alive.

http://thebosh.com/upload/2008/07/1...affairs_and_failed_marriages/Raquel-Welch.jpg

Raquel Welch is 68 and still has sex appeal.


Age has nothing to do with being sexy, my dear.

I don't think I have the issue. There are plenty of older women I think are sexy. Dr Melphi,Roslin(Battlestar Galatica) etc and even Madonna for the most part, though i do think her looks aren't quite as good as they were just a few years ago. I do think this is a issue for alot of people that isn't me. Look at how many talented actress get stuck playing the "Mom" character or something once they reach a certain age in Hollywood. Remember that movie were Sean Connory's love intrest was Catherine-Zeta Jones.

There seems to be countless movies were some 50-something year old guy is playing oposite of some young 20-something young female. To me that is because older women aren't seen as sexy for the most part, and if one is seen as sexy then there seen as some kind of anomoly.

I think it has to do with the target-audience. I think it's easier for a 33-year old like me to find a 50 year women to be sexy than for a 23-year old male to find a 50-year old women to be sexy. Since movies and music is often geared to the young, older women end up getting the shaft, even more so than older men. Heck I have even noticed this on a personal level. As a fat, nerdy virgin who lives with his mom I can't say I have been living it up with my older-male sex appeal but I have noticed people see me as being younger than I am. One girl was surprised that I was 33 because of my looks and even my best friend says I look like I am in my middle to late 20's.

Jason

 

[Star Wolf]

I'd say Jackson will have the more enduring appeal, but I guess he also now has the added benefit of dying young. Jackson definitely had a great mystique about him, but I don't know if that lends itself towards the idea that he was the bigger icon.

I guess history will have to work it out for us.

The Jackson mystique did not start in the 80s, it started in late 60s for goodness sake. For Madonna's staying power to be properly analyzed compared to jackson we have to wait another decade.

 

[Kirk's_Tights]

I don't think I have the issue. There are plenty of older women I think are sexy. Dr Melphi,Roslin(Battlestar Galatica) etc and even Madonna for the most part, though i do think her looks aren't quite as good as they were just a few years ago. I do think this is a issue for alot of people that isn't me. Look at how many talented actress get stuck playing the "Mom" character or something once they reach a certain age in Hollywood. Remember that movie were Sean Connory's love intrest was Catherine-Zeta Jones.

There seems to be countless movies were some 50-something year old guy is playing oposite of some young 20-something young female. To me that is because older women aren't seen as sexy for the most part, and if one is seen as sexy then there seen as some kind of anomoly.

I think it has to do with the target-audience. I think it's easier for a 33-year old like me to find a 50 year women to be sexy than for a 23-year old male to find a 50-year old women to be sexy. Since movies and music is often geared to the young, older women end up getting the shaft, even more so than older men. Heck I have even noticed this on a personal level. As a fat, nerdy virgin who lives with his mom I can't say I have been living it up with my older-male sex appeal but I have noticed people see me as being younger than I am. One girl was surprised that I was 33 because of my looks and even my best friend says I look like I am in my middle to late 20's.

Jason

I still disagree.

Madonna has countless fans and no one cares how old she is. If they do, they are pretty poor fans. The music matters, not age. You would actually be very surprised how many younger fans find Madonna to be sexy and a whole slew of younger women find guys like Sean Connery, George Clooney, Pierce Brosnan, Brad Pitt, Hugh Jackman (yum yum) and other older gents to have huge sex appeal.

I get what you are trying to say but I still think that age doesn't matter when it comes to sex appeal. A lot of people would prefer young, fresh faces like Scarlett Johansson or somewhat older women like Angelina Jolie, it really ranges. Scarlett is in her early 20's and has sex appeal, Angelina is in her early 30's and has sex appeal, Gwen Stefani is 39 and has sex appeal, Raquel, as mentioned, is 68 and has sex appeal...it goes across the board but I get what you are trying to say here ^_^

In the end, MJ's career has been longer than Madonna's, despite all the fallbacks, and he never fell off the map.

Don't feel bad about looking younger than you are. Not sure if you have visited the picture thread but I am 25 and I look younger.

 

[Jayson]

I don't think I have the issue. There are plenty of older women I think are sexy. Dr Melphi,Roslin(Battlestar Galatica) etc and even Madonna for the most part, though i do think her looks aren't quite as good as they were just a few years ago. I do think this is a issue for alot of people that isn't me. Look at how many talented actress get stuck playing the "Mom" character or something once they reach a certain age in Hollywood. Remember that movie were Sean Connory's love intrest was Catherine-Zeta Jones.

There seems to be countless movies were some 50-something year old guy is playing oposite of some young 20-something young female. To me that is because older women aren't seen as sexy for the most part, and if one is seen as sexy then there seen as some kind of anomoly.

I think it has to do with the target-audience. I think it's easier for a 33-year old like me to find a 50 year women to be sexy than for a 23-year old male to find a 50-year old women to be sexy. Since movies and music is often geared to the young, older women end up getting the shaft, even more so than older men. Heck I have even noticed this on a personal level. As a fat, nerdy virgin who lives with his mom I can't say I have been living it up with my older-male sex appeal but I have noticed people see me as being younger than I am. One girl was surprised that I was 33 because of my looks and even my best friend says I look like I am in my middle to late 20's.

Jason

I still disagree.

Madonna has countless fans and no one cares how old she is. If they do, they are pretty poor fans. The music matters, not age. You would actually be very surprised how many younger fans find Madonna to be sexy and a whole slew of younger women find guys like Sean Connery, George Clooney, Pierce Brosnan, Brad Pitt, Hugh Jackman (yum yum) and other older gents to have huge sex appeal.

I get what you are trying to say but I still think that age doesn't matter when it comes to sex appeal. A lot of people would prefer young, fresh faces like Scarlett Johansson or somewhat older women like Angelina Jolie, it really ranges. Scarlett is in her early 20's and has sex appeal, Angelina is in her early 30's and has sex appeal, Gwen Stefani is 39 and has sex appeal, Raquel, as mentioned, is 68 and has sex appeal...it goes across the board but I get what you are trying to say here ^_^

In the end, MJ's career has been longer than Madonna's, despite all the fallbacks, and he never fell off the map.

Don't feel bad about looking younger than you are. Not sure if you have visited the picture thread but I am 25 and I look younger.

While Madonna has younger fans I'm not sure if there quite as many as they were in the 90's. I think "Ray of Light" was proably the last big hit that made it on the radio and MTv and all that stuff that comes with huge mainstream appeal. With Micheal Jackson I think the last huge hit was even futher in the past and that would be the "Black or White" video.

Oviously this isn't a good way to gage who is more talented, I do think is effective in judging overall popularity at least within America. Things get a little more complicated when your talking about fans away from America. Frankly I don't even know how to judge that audience since i'm not from those countries.

It could be argued that MJ was always more popular oversea's wear as Madonna eventually surpased MJ in America. Kind of like how David Hasseholf is a huge star in Germany but a B-star in America.

You know I have always been curious as to how the scandals played over in other countries. Were as most Americans see MJ as a pedophile is that the case in other countries? I bet the religious stuff wasn't much of a issue for Madonna in England since the English seem to be more secular when it comes to those issue's.

As for me looking younger I don't see it as a problem. I'm just trying to find away to take advantage of it. One of these days it's got to help me get sex before I turn 40

Jason

Jason

 

[DarKush]

I don't think Madonna is bigger than Michael. She is pretty huge and an icon, but she doesn't have almost 40 years at the top of the charts like MJ did from the Jackson 5 to his solo career.

Though I do think that Madonna, and Prince as well, managed their post-80's careers better than MJ did. Madonna has an amazing ability to morph with the times. Her last album, Hard Candy, was pretty good. Prince is still pumping out music, though I don't think its all that commercial or getting radio play, not as much as Madonna's might be. However he's still selling and commanding respect. But with MJ, I think he kept trying to recapture the high of the Thriller album, and even though I enjoyed Bad, Dangerous, HIStory (even Invincible had a couple nice songs), he never really could hold back time. I think Prince and Madonna flowed with time better.

I also think Janet Jackson has a similar issue. She seems to be trying to recapture the glory days of the Janet album in '94, but with diminishing success with each new album.

 

[NileQT87]

Michael is the [slightly] bigger celebrity, but, IMO, not all that much. And Madonna's career is a lot less tarnished than Michael's is. Michael benefits from more pervasive iconography and probably a greater worldwide appeal.

However, preference-wise, Evita and A League Of Their Own give Madonna the edge for me (I admit that they are guilty pleasures). I also find her to have a more preferable voice.

Madonna is really good at reinventing herself and still remaining relevant in different eras. She spans a greater amount of reinventions than Michael, who has his child star and '80s personae which are respected, but the rest is the plastic surgery/pedophilia accusation era. Between the two '80s icons, Madonna is more relevant with the current generation and still appears to be doing something with her career (and it's still popular and commercial).

If you want longevity who remains commercial and still gets the recognition when she puts something out or performs, it's Cher. She's managed to remain relevant in every decade since the '60s.