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Klingon first contact

indolover

Fleet Captain
When was Klingon first contact with the Federation?

I read once it was in the early 23rd century but how could that be? Broken Bow in Enterprise was decades before that!

And since Qo'nos and Earth/Vulcan can't be that far away (if Archer could travel there) then as Klingons were one of the first space-faring species, surely Klingons had knowledge of humans existing.
 
^When was it stated that the Klingons were one of the first space-faring species?
 
^ Never.

And until "Broken Bow", there was precisely ZERO amount of canon information as to when Klingon first contact was. Absolutely none. No year or stardate was ever given, no specific circumstances were ever mentioned. So ENT violated absolutely nothing - its depiction of Klaang's visit to Earth as first contact, was entirely valid.
 
If memory serves, the only real mention of the Klingon first contact before Enterprise was from Picard in the episode "First Contact". I believe he said that it was "disastrous". I am not sure you could say Archer's contact with them was "disastrous" but cumulatively it was over the next couple of years. By the time the Klingons had mutated themselves with the Augment DNA I am sure they hated us with a passion. :rommie:
 
The guy who wrote that line of Picards' explained that what he meant by "disastrous" was that the Klingons and Feds had several bad contacts over the years that led to hostilities. It wasn't just one bad encounter.

Spock said in TUC that the hostility in TOS had been in place for 70 years, meaning the really bad stuff didn't start until 2223.
 
ENT merely established that the Klingons had contact with Earth, Vulcan, and other worlds prior to the Federation, so it becomes a case of pre-Federation and Federation-era contacts. Apparently, things went from bad to worse between Humans and Klingons after the Federation was formed, which would actually still be keeping within continuity, IMO...
 
and Picard never said it was Feddy contact that was disasterous. it could've been Klingon-Vulcan first contact that was a disaster and that's why Vulcans had their proto-PD...
 
Exactly. Klingon first contact with the Federation probably went something like this:

Ambassador Krude: "Your pitiful Coalition of Planets makes lousy booze!"
Ambassador Skon: "Actually, Your Eminence, it just became the United Federation of Planets - they have entered the last signature now."
Ambassador Krude: "Ahh. Your pitiful United Federation of Planets makes lousy booze, then! But this signing whachamacallem banquet is pretty cool otherwise. What do you call these sturdy and spicy delicacies?"
Ambassador Skon: "We call them candles, Your Eminence. And chandeliers."

Picard says that "we" first contacted Klingons "centuries" prior to the 2360s, and that this contact was disastrous but apparently would have been less so had there been initial clandestine surveillance before open contact. Picard may of course be lying, because he recounts the story in order to convince the aliens of the week that covert surveillance is a good thing. But he'd have little reason to lie about the date, even if he lies about the role of surveillance.

Picard's "we" would probably refer to some species that later became a UFP member, but "centuries ago" might just barely allow for contact between Klingons and the newly founded UFP as well. Of course, several UFP members would already have contacted Klingons prior to that founding event, including Picard's own species, so this would make little sense - except again if we assume Picard is telling a pleasant and useful lie and twisting even the factual bits past breaking point to accommodate the greater lie.

As for when Klingons went starfaring, nobody really knows. Might have been long before Kahless, or long after Kahless. Just because Kahless is depicted as a medieval or even early iron age sort of hero doesn't mean he wouldn't have had a starship; he's being depicted in legend only, after all. Plus there's the bit about the Klingons being enslaved by starfaring aliens called the Hur'Q; Klingons might have traveled to the stars in Hur'Q ships, possibly as galley slaves of some sort, and made their name there well before they gained the ability to build their own starships.

Or for all we know, Klingons and Vulcans met each other a few hundred years before ENT, when Vulcan explorers first reached Qo'noS. Vulcans forgot to do the preliminary survey and ended up having the secret of interstellar travel stolen from them by the Klingons. Klingons became an interstellar menace, while Vulcans subsequently adopted their Prime Directive, and imposed it on humans and eventually the Federation as well.

Timo Saloniemi
 
Possibilities. It's still hard to say when the first official/diplomatic contact took place. Prior to broken bow, it would be easy to imagine that the first Human - Klingon interact to have been between a group of Klingons and some Human "Boomers," either in open space or on a trading world. A boomer wouldn't seem to be the type to rush to make a detailed report.

During Broken Bow, even prior to communicating with their Klingon guest for the first time, one of the Human officials (Starfleet?) already knew that they were in possession of a "Kling'ent."
 
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Possibilities. It's still hard to say when the first official/diplomatic contact took place. Prior to broken bow, it would be easy to imagine that the first Human - Klingon interact to have been between a group of Klingons and some Human "Boomers," either in open space or on a trading world. A boomer wouldn't seem to be the type to rush to make a detailed report.

During Broken Bow, even prior to communicating with their Klingon guest for the first time, one of the Human officials (Starfleet?) already knew that they were in possession of a "Kling'ent."

yeah see i would have to say that since Archer, a captain of a special ship to the federation that he would be told of a war crazy species that don't exactly like humans coming into contact with a earth cargo carrier. You have to remember that klingons don't rob they take and destroy. since the federation has always controlled earth cargo, they would have know if humans made contact.

Plus isn't anyone forgetting that they fastest earth vessels couldn't even go past 4.5 warp and that going into what was then deep space that we humans were far behind technology wise, i mean you don't shoot rockets from your ship and go warp 7. So it would be that first contact wasn't made by humans. Plus humans and klingons have never seen eye to eye, so there really wasn't a first contact, like you see in the movie.
There is your answer there never was first contact. we happen to have meant and started out not liking each other.
 
During Broken Bow, even prior to communicating with their Klingon guest for the first time, one of the Human officials (Starfleet?) already knew that they were in possession of a "Kling'ent."

He'd probably (mis)heard the name from the Vulcans who were also aware of the crash victim, though.

In any case, pre-ENT contact between humans and Klingons doesn't seem to have made the Klingons particularly aware of or interested in mankind. Individual Klingons gradually start to get pissed off with Archer during the course of the show, but there's no actual Klingon-human animosity there even at the end of the fourth season. None of this thus seems to match Picard's story about a first contact that was disastrous for "us" and could have been less disastrous with covert surveillance and cultural understanding.

One wonders if the first contact between humans and Klingons was disastrous for the Klingons instead. Perhaps they only gradually found out that it had been humans who were responsible for the disaster (say, a conquest plan ruined by well-meaning human meddling) - so the relations were halfway amicable during ENT, but deteriorated soon thereafter.

Timo Saloniemi
 
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