Khan's Reaction Shot

[Jeyl]

Did you ever get the feeling that there was always something missing in Star Trek II? Something that would have made the film more complete?

Of course!

Khan seeing the Enterprise warp out just before he dies! If you look at it in a certain way, movie audiences have had to endure the notion that Khan thought he actually defeated Kirk in the movie as he dies, but thanks to this incredible video made by planetiowa, everything fits together so wonderfully!

As planetiowa states,

I maintain that the audience would've appreciated knowing that Khan realized he lost before he died. Actually, an older version of the script has him dying BEFORE he see the Enterprise escape. Would you have liked a shot like this? This is just a forum about whether the inclusion of a shot like this would've pleased viewers.

I created this because I've always felt cheated. I WANTED to see Khan realize he failed before he died. One version of the script makes it clear he died thinking he'd won. That's bad drama in my book. I firmly believe the movie would've been better with a shot like this.

He's right! Just watch the clip if you don't believe me. It WILL convince you!

 

[Robert Maxwell]

I don't see what's wrong with him thinking he won. It's ironic. He dies, believing he brought his mortal enemy down with him. Still, Khan's actions ended up costing Kirk his best friend, and later, his son (though he got Spock back). And then it cost him the Enterprise. All told, Khan didn't beat Kirk, but he did screw his life up pretty badly.

 

[Jeyl]

I don't see what's wrong with him thinking he won. It's ironic. He dies, believing he brought his mortal enemy down with him. Still, Khan's actions ended up costing Kirk his best friend, and later, his son (though he got Spock back). And then it cost him the Enterprise. All told, Khan didn't beat Kirk, but he did screw his life up pretty badly.

You're wrong. It needs the shot. Most movie audiences don't understand the concept of irony.

 

[Karnbeln]

I'd prefer to think Khan gave his last breath activating the device. He could not have seen the Enterprise warp away.

To each his own, I guess, but Khan beating defeated is enough for me, I don't need to see him drug through the mud.

 

[Shatmandu]

The yell at the end sounds like your buddy is shitting a Coke can.

Other than that, I like the change.

Joe, Pepsi

 

[QuasarVM]

I don't see what's wrong with him thinking he won. It's ironic. He dies, believing he brought his mortal enemy down with him. Still, Khan's actions ended up costing Kirk his best friend, and later, his son (though he got Spock back). And then it cost him the Enterprise. All told, Khan didn't beat Kirk, but he did screw his life up pretty badly.

You're wrong. It needs the shot. Most movie audiences don't understand the concept of irony.

I am the Great Sage (Bird) of Star Trek (of the Galaxy)...holder of all Trek wisdom and YOU are wrong! It was brilliantly staged, directed, and shot and lit and edited AS-IS!

You make your own little version and watch it to your heart's content, but it's not the official PERFECT version!

So there! You're WRONG! Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. Completely. Utterly. Irrevocably. Indisputably. Undeniably WRONG!*

Why? Because I said so and as the font of all Trek knowledge, I am always right.

In fact, you couldn't be any more wrong if you came out of your mama bass-ackwards or said two plus two equals NINE!




*Same goes if you think pit bulls make great family pets!

 

[cardinal biggles]

I don't see what's wrong with the film as it is, but what do I know? I'm just an ignorant forum moderator.

 

[Jeyl]

Obviously you Star Trek fans don't have the intellect or capacity to understand REAL good story telling. This film is incomplete without the reaction shot. Not including that shot is like taking all the great endings of every movie out and replacing it with something inferior.

And I know I'm right about this. Planetiowa even states that "It seemed it was 50/50 about whether the reaction scene was needed. I NEED IT!."

I support Planetiowa to the fullest extent. You can read my comments about his video under the user name Kalaida. I have no doubt that my comments will inform and enlighten those who has doubts that this must be how TWOK should be presented.

 

[cardinal biggles]

Yeah, okay, whatever.

 

[QuasarVM]

I don't see what's wrong with the film as it is, but what do I know? I'm just an ignorant forum moderator.

Not at all. You are most wise! And your moderating is...dare I say it?...Fair and Balanced...

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

Obviously you Star Trek fans don't have the intellect or capacity to understand REAL good story telling. This film is incomplete without the reaction shot. Not including that shot is like taking all the great endings of every movie out and replacing it with something inferior.

And I know I'm right about this. Planetiowa even states that "It seemed it was 50/50 about whether the reaction scene was needed. I NEED IT!."

I support Planetiowa to the fullest extent. You can read my comments about his video under the user name Kalaida. I have no doubt that my comments will inform and enlighten those who has doubts that this must be how TWOK should be presented.

Spoken like someone who doesn't have the intellect or capacity to understand REAL good storytelling.

Moreover, your statements are contradictory. Here's what Kalaida says:

Uh, no. The reaction shot is not needed. I don't know where you're getting the idea that this improves the film, because it doesn't. You might say it even detracts from the suspense of the Enterprise finally escaping the explosion

and again later

Well I think the film is just fine without as it is. Remember, the whole point of him dying without seeing the Enterprise escape was to show that he thought he destroyed the Enterprise. This gives Khan's character a really fitting departure because he had suffered for so many years that the only satisfaction he could obtain is by destroying Kirk. And now that he dies thinking he took the Enterprise with him, he can finally rest in peace with the satisfaction he waited so long to obtain.

Taken from:http://www.youtube.com/comment_servlet?all_comments&v=uGokpLRVWWc&fromurl=/watch%3Fv%3DuGokpLRVWWc%26feature%3Drelated

Seems this fella thinks it's fine WITHOUT it. You say that it's fine WITH it. So if you are this fella, then you changed your mind. But as you quote it's 50/50.

You feel you need it, others don't.

I don't. It's superfluous.

Then again, I'm laughing at the superior intellect on storytelling.

 

[Jeyl]

Seems this fella thinks it's fine WITHOUT it. You say that it's fine WITH it.

Your observations are indeed correct. Kalaida and myself are the same person. This was just one of those silly things I thought about doing as sort of an April Fools joke.

OF COURSE the film is perfect without Khan's reaction shot! The mere thought adding a reaction shot would bring great shame upon the movie and furies from the fans. I just wanted to see what everyone here would say to a fan who hopelessly thinks the film works better this way. Suffice to say, the outcome was a complete and utter success. I'm definitely in the right forums with the right Star Trek fans.

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

Seems this fella thinks it's fine WITHOUT it. You say that it's fine WITH it.

Your observations are indeed correct. Kalaida and myself are the same person. This was just one of those silly things I thought about doing as sort of an April Fools joke.

OF COURSE the film is perfect without Khan's reaction shot! The mere thought adding a reaction shot would bring great shame upon the movie and furies from the fans. I just wanted to see what everyone here would say to a fan who hopelessly thinks the film works better this way. Suffice to say, the outcome was a complete and utter success. I'm definitely in the right forums with the right Star Trek fans.

I was beginning to get that feeling...

 

[Captain Mike]

I'd prefer to think Khan gave his last breath activating the device. He could not have seen the Enterprise warp away.

To each his own, I guess, but Khan beating defeated is enough for me, I don't need to see him drug through the mud.

I agree,..."From Hell's heart I stab at thee.....For hate's sake I "spit" my last breath tthheeee", is meaning his last breath had left him as he spoke that. End of story IMHO.

 

[RoJoHen]

The yell at the end sounds like your buddy is shitting a Coke can.

This is true.

 

[c0rnedfr0g]

I would imagine the viewscreen would be down by that point, or at least Khan wouldn't have the strength to activate it.

 

[sbk1234]

I would have liked that cut in there. Of course, I won't lose any sleep over the edit we got, because TWOK is fucking brilliant! Anything can be improved upon, but a damn fine film is still a damn fine film.

 

[Neopeius]

Hey um...

why didn't the Enterprise just blow up the Genesis device?

Oh, never mind.

 

[Search4]

Sorry, not buying the whole coke can thing.

Khan sees the Enterprise leave, and starts yelling "KKKKIIIIIIIRRRRRKKKK!!!"

 

[miraclefan]

Hey um...

why didn't the Enterprise just blow up the Genesis device?

Oh, never mind.

Because, if it did explode prematurely the explosion would still be at full strength, and then the enterprise would have gotten caught in the explosion?