kay, i give up

[Admiral Shran]

As a guy with an ENT-inspired screen-name and someone who has had more than his fair share of fun mocking TOS, I'll say.... You have got to give it more than four episodes.

Which ones did you watch? If you watched The Man Trap, Charlie X, Where No Man Has Gone Before and The Naked Time (the order in which they were first aired), you've done yourself a disservice by giving up already.

TOS may be my least favorite Trek series, but they are numerous excellent episodes in there. But those early, early ones aren't indicative of the rest.

 

[Captrek]

Try these:

Balance of Terror
The Galileo Seven
The Menagerie
Arena
Space Seed
The City on the Edge of Forever
The Devil in the Dark
Errand of Mercy
Amok Time
Mirror, Mirror
Journey to Babel
The Doomsday Machine
The Trouble With Tribbles
A Piece of the Action
The Tholian Web

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

i cant do it. watched 4 episodes of TOS.

could not get into it. i fall asleep watching them.

moved to TNG.

That's not allowed. Despite its overwhelming success spanning over four decades and the international recognition of its characters, some fans of TOS are deeply insecure about the series and will mock and ridicule you for expressing a contrary opinion.

 

[Greg Cox]

If that's not going on the A/B thing can feel like they just didn't have enough A to tell so here's some filler. In the middle of a war or hugely important episode it's insulting.

Yeah, you have to be careful with A/B plots that you don't end up with some sort of bizarre disconnect between events of wildly different magnitude.

I still remember an episode of NORTHERN EXPOSURE where Maggie's house burns down, but Joel hardly seems to notice because he's off stuck in his own silly "B" plot about a golf game. My girlfriend never forgave Joel for that, even though it wasn't really the poor character's fault; his apparent indifference was just the result of a badly integrated B plot.

 

[Herkimer Jitty]

And people wonder where the "ADHD Generation" comments come from...

Oh, I'm sure plenty of people thought Star Trek was boring in 1966.

Probably the reason Lost in Space didn't politley keel over and die.

 

[T'Bonz]

My parents watched Lost in Space, but mocked Star Trek. As an adult, I find this incomprehensible.

 

[Winterwind]

Even as a child I'd have found that incomprehensible.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

My parents watched Lost in Space, but mocked Star Trek. As an adult, I find this incomprehensible.

!!!

That's totally uhh...

When I was a kid Lost in Space was considered to be the kiddy show, good for vegetating in front of after school and Star Trek was considered to be the show you took seriously.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

And here I find the condensed running times of modern Trek to force such a truncated feeling story-telling style.

Pacing of action and dialogue is much faster in most modern shows, so that wouldn't be a problem if Trek had adapted its production style to changing times. The real problem was modern Trek's aping of the TOS style.

 

[GNDN]

And here I find the condensed running times of modern Trek to force such a truncated feeling story-telling style.

Pacing of action and dialogue is much faster in most modern shows, so that wouldn't be a problem if Trek had adapted its production style to changing times. The real problem was modern Trek's aping of the TOS style.

Fair enough, but I'd still prefer 50 minutes of story to 40, generally speaking.

 

[Forbin]

And here I find the condensed running times of modern Trek to force such a truncated feeling story-telling style.

Worse, the A/B plot structures cut even more time from the main storyline. Can't just focus on the new planet, we've got to find out about Data's cat troubles as well.

While revisiting TNG I found this often drove me nuts. I found myself thinking stick to the main story because there's something worthy and interesting there. I don't give a shit about the cat.

The worst B story ever was Jake and Nog and those fraking self-sealing stem bolts. WHO CAAAARRED!?!?

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

I remember the stem bolt story. I have no idea what the main story of that particular show was.

 

[Goliath]

And here I find the condensed running times of modern Trek to force such a truncated feeling story-telling style.

Pacing of action and dialogue is much faster in most modern shows, so that wouldn't be a problem if Trek had adapted its production style to changing times.

That's true. I've picked up a few DVD sets of crime shows from that period--like Mannix, which was on the air at the same time as TOS--and I've been surprised at just how slow they seemed. The pacing of most episodes of TOS was actually fairly brisk by the standards of the time.

 

[plynch]

And here I find the condensed running times of modern Trek to force such a truncated feeling story-telling style.

Worse, the A/B plot structures cut even more time from the main storyline. Can't just focus on the new planet, we've got to find out about Data's cat troubles as well.

funny and true

And here I find the condensed running times of modern Trek to force such a truncated feeling story-telling style.

Worse, the A/B plot structures cut even more time from the main storyline. Can't just focus on the new planet, we've got to find out about Data's cat troubles as well.

I often find myself appreciating how in Bab 5 which is very A/B the B storyline advances character development and often major plot points. If that's not going on the A/B thing can feel like they just didn't have enough A to tell so here's some filler.

You got it. It is filler. In original Trek you had a writer who had a stories to tell/sell. In BermanTrek you had staff writers who needed to fill x hours of airtime every season to make money for Paramount.

I've heard people extol the B stories for their character development. Sometimes. Often diversion. I actually like sci-fi idea-based, what-if stories. Especially with a moral dilemma. In other words, Star Trek.

If I want character development, frankly there's lots better of that out there in tv/novel/movie land than in BermanTrek. I often find that aspect to be the hokiest/cheesiest/lamest of most eps. Especially, "Oh yeah, this week X is suddenly in love with Y." That is quasi-shark-jump territory.

 

[RandyS]

This thread makes me sad.

Me too, although the "attention span" comments don't surprise me in the least.

I'll be the first to admit that I prefer TNG and DS9 to TOS, but I grew up on TOS and love it too.

 

[ALF]

You should have had a practiced TOS'er hand select those 4 episodes. You may have had a much better impression.

 

[Goliath]

Actually, one of these new "Best of Star Trek: TOS" discs would probably be good enough.

 

[Kelthaz]

I gave up around the same point that you did Neoshade. I watched random episodes of TOS as a kid and greatly enjoyed the show, so I recently tried to do a complete run-through of the show starting with "The Cage" to catch all the episodes that I missed out on. I made it to "Charlie X" where, upon deciding that this had to be the "Threshold" or "These Are The Voyages" of TOS, went online to confirm what people thought about the episode. Needless to say I got a big surprise. After that I decided that TOS clearly wasn't the show for me and stopped watching.

There are a few episodes of TOS that I love ("City on the Edge of Forever", "The Doomsday Machine", "Amok Time", "A Private Little War", "Journey to Babel", and "The Ultimate Computer"), but other than those episodes I find the show almost unwatchable. Neoshade, You might want to give some of those episodes a shot before you completely write off the series.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

And here I find the condensed running times of modern Trek to force such a truncated feeling story-telling style.

Pacing of action and dialogue is much faster in most modern shows, so that wouldn't be a problem if Trek had adapted its production style to changing times.

That's true. I've picked up a few DVD sets of crime shows from that period--like Mannix, which was on the air at the same time as TOS--and I've been surprised at just how slow they seemed. The pacing of most episodes of TOS was actually fairly brisk by the standards of the time.

This is what I don't get. I find TNG to be far slower in pacing, actually very dull at times because of the pacing and bland discussing of stuff. I think TOS has very little padding, it's all story line and action. I can't see how pace could be the OP's problem with TOS.

 

[Admiral Shran]

Worse, the A/B plot structures cut even more time from the main storyline. Can't just focus on the new planet, we've got to find out about Data's cat troubles as well.

While revisiting TNG I found this often drove me nuts. I found myself thinking stick to the main story because there's something worthy and interesting there. I don't give a shit about the cat.

The worst B story ever was Jake and Nog and those fraking self-sealing stem bolts. WHO CAAAARRED!?!?

That one was kind of funny at times.

The worst B story was when Jake and Nog go on a double date while Vedek Bareil is negotiating peace with Cardassia and then FREAKING DIES! Yeah, kind of disconcerting.