James Cameron's "Avatar" (grading and discussion)

[Trekker4747]

Storywise, well, original it's not. I counted at least 5 movies that it 'borrowed' stuff from

I hate arguments like this. Unless the movie directly rips something off shot by shot, plot point-by-plot point or something like that (ex: Parts: The Clonus Horror and The Island) doesn't every movie borrow from others?

I mean, in all reality there's no original ideas left and creativity anymore is just arranging the borrowed ideas in new and interesting ways.

Movies are more like legos than they are blank canvases.

 

[Hyperspace05]

Is Avatar ultimately a left wing, anti-America, anti-War on Terror movie?

"Anti-american"? Are you for real? Is Pandora being invaded by the U.S.? It is no more "anti-WoT" than it is "anti-colonialism" or "anti-might-makes-right" in general.

 

[Miss Chicken]

I rated it excellent.

Pandora was beautifully created. Just looking at it gave me that feeling of magical wonder that I have rarely experienced as an adult but often felt as a child. The last time I truly fell in love with a mythical world was during the early scenes of Fellowship of the Ring. Seeing FOTR made me feel like I was coming home to a place I loved (as it was so like the Middle Earth I had created in my head), but seeing Oandora was like I was seeing a place beyond my imagination. I loved the attention to detail, and wonder how many little things I missed that I will notice when I see it again.

I don't think it will be anywhere near as wonderful when it isn't viewed in #D or when it is viewed on the small screen. It that way it lacks something that I think that the LOTR movies had.

The story is somewhat predictable but I think I can largely forgive that because the movie was so interesting visually.

 

[Captain Craig]

I got FREE passes for the midnight show, so I went.
Its late, I'll read others later and I'll post more later.
For now.

Visuals=A
Plot/Pacing=C

You can tell James took time to get his F/X down it shows.
However, in that ensuing time he did nothing to perfect his screenplay. If you think the "You're not in Kansas anymore" line was lame then get ready for a string of cliches and patched together scenarios done better in other places. I swear the head bad guy was only missing his moustache to twirl by the end.

Also I can't get 'Billy Jean is not My Lover' out of my head.

Not going in my DVD collection. It's better as Last of the Mohicans, Braveheart and at least one other good movie.

Overrated.

 

[Starbreaker]

Any movie where you're cheering for all the humans to die is good in my book. I didn't go into this movie expecting Citizen Kane, and I loved it. Sure, there are some really cliched parts. I felt like I was watching Dune at times, for example.

I'm worried I'll never be able to recreate the experience on DVD, sadly.

 

[Trubinator]

I'm really torn on this one, a first for Cameron's movies. I thought the visuals were spectacular overall, but at the same time, many shots had a cartoonish look to them. And the dialogue ... boy can the dialogue be cringe-inducingly awful. The overall plot and characterization across the board is pretty poor, and I hated how much the "Na'vi" were made to seem like Indians. But despite it all, the movie had some great action toward the end and some moments of true beauty.

I'm really hesitant to grade it now because I think it would benefit from a second viewing. But I think it's perhaps Cameron's weakest film overall. Maybe A- on visuals and C+ with regard to the other stuff?

 

[Eddie Roth]

So how much did it seem to ape from Dances with Wolves? I've been hearing a lot of comparisons, but I don't know how much of that is true versus how much of that is just online bickering.

Those comparisons weren't "bickering". Dances With Wolves is and remains actually a well-respected film. It's been a comparison, period.

To answer your question, I felt reminded of Dances, too. But you might as well liken it to Romeo and Juliet or even Titanic (which itself borrowed strongly from Shakespeare's play). In the end, expect to get from this film what you got from all other James Cameron movies: Eye-popping sights, elegant and exciting action, and in this case, a remarkable achievement in CGI. Most of the film is, truth be told, an animated one, but you forget that you're seeing computer creations. Now since these aliens look so real, the film gets what all other Cameron movies had as well: heart. It's really amazing how you can make out Zoe Saldana under the CGI and empathize with her and the other CG characters. That is part of the achievement of this film.

 

[Jono]

Someone voted 'terrible' - LOL!

And that someone probably hasn't even seen the movie

I don't remember reading that if you saw this movie meant you had to also like it.

For me the visuals were not enough to make up for the terrible dialogue and plot.

 

[Captain Craig]

I'm awake and have read through some of the other responses.
Seems I'm not alone, the story was mediocore to outright bad.

Some standing up for the movie saying its tough to be original, don't expect Citizen Kane. Fine I get that. I know originality is tough. It's why there are 23 James Bond films, 11 Star Treks and remakes of movies no one cares about like Pelham 123.

At its core Titanic is a forbidden love story. Its Romeo & Juliet for gods sake and its a 3hr pic waiting for the boat to sink. I'm not even a 'love story' movie guy so when I say Titanic's story was good I mean it. It was put together good and I didn't feel like I was watching it for 3hours.
Avatar is NOT using elements we know and crafting a seemless, fun and engaging movie. You can see the seams of this movie and that is bad. Where the characters motivations just aren't good. How plugging those holes with cliches ruins it and you feel like this 2hr 35min film lasts for 4hrs.
If this didn't have the name Cameron and the F/X to sell it this has disaster written all over it...it might still.
My packed house theater of 500 only had about a dozen or so people clap or cheer when it was over. I've been to midnight shows so fatigue wasn't the issue. When people like something they let others know. We were all just glad it was over.

 

[Bishbot]

When people like something they let others know. We were all just glad it was over.

Must be an American thing. The only times I've ever heard clapping and cheering in a British cinema was for all three Star Wars prequels and this was very much at the beginning of the movies. I felt like clapping Avatar actually, I looked around to see if we were going to have a Star Wars moment, but it didn't happen. People seemed happy enough though.

 

[Broccoli]

So how much did it seem to ape from Dances with Wolves? I've been hearing a lot of comparisons, but I don't know how much of that is true versus how much of that is just online bickering.

Those comparisons weren't "bickering". Dances With Wolves is and remains actually a well-respected film. It's been a comparison, period.

The forums that I saw it on were. When elements of the story were first revealed, people online were complaining that this movie was just ripping off Dances with Wolves, but set in space. As I haven't seen the movie yet, I wanted to see how much of that proved true, or if it was just online speculation run amuck.

Also, I know that Dances with Wolves is a respected film. I never suggested otherwise.

 

[Daneel]

Thought I might take in an 11:30 am show at the local IMAX, but when I checked, they were sold out -- for 3 of the 4 IMAX screenings today (and the remaining one was selling out fast). So I'm thinking, if this is any indication, Avatar is going to be pretty big.

Anyway, I do still want to see it in IMAX, so I guess I'll wait a few days.

 

[Robert Maxwell]

To say it rips off Dances with Wolves is giving Dances too much credit. It's not like that film invented the "would-be invader goes native and fights against his own kind" plot. Don't get me wrong, it's a good movie, but it's hardly the only tale of its type.

 

[Eddie Roth]

^^ Who here said anything about "ripping off"? It's simply a similar story, but not moreso than "Gladiator" is similar to "Braveheart". For example.

 

[Trekker4747]

I saw this on today's CRACKED article on Avatar.

It made me laugh greatly.

 

[NX74205]

Dances with Wolves in Space is exactly accurate when one describes this movie, but I for one don't think that that description takes away from the quality of the movie. Replace the Navi for the Sioux and Unobatanium (Really?? Unobtanium, Cameron couldn't come up with a better name?!?) with Gold, and you basically have Dances with Wolves or any movie where another power comes in and tries to remove someone from their home simply because of where they live.

That being said, I for one LOVED this movie and will certainly see it again , maybe not in IMAX 3d but definately in 3d. I felt that James Cameron really created a believable Alien world and he definately got in his usual tropes and swipes at the current state of the world and humanity without any ounce of heavy handedness. Zoe Saldana's character was beautifully realized and I must say that Sam Worthington definately acquited himself well after Terminator Salvation. Don't listen to the haters, go see this movie as soon as possible.

Oh yeah.. James Cameron should direct the Halo movie. Anyon, other than Cameron and I won't see it.

 

[Kegg]

Oh yeah.. James Cameron should direct the Halo movie. Anyon, other than Cameron and I won't see it.

Not even Neill Blomkamp (of District 9 fame, originally attached to do the Halo movie).

 

[Captain Craig]

When people like something they let others know. We were all just glad it was over.

Must be an American thing. The only times I've ever heard clapping and cheering in a British cinema was for all three Star Wars prequels and this was very much at the beginning of the movies. I felt like clapping Avatar actually, I looked around to see if we were going to have a Star Wars moment, but it didn't happen. People seemed happy enough though.

That only happens, in my experience, with opening night/midnight crowds full of people all eager to see the film.

If you went to a regular showing during the afternoon or earlier in the evening then no you wouldn't get the applause affect.

So my qualifer is that only happens with gung-ho audiences showing up at midnight or at sneaks.

 

[Shurik]

Unobatanium (Really?? Unobtanium, Cameron couldn't come up with a better name?!?)

Unobtainium was the name of the stuff that the ship that went to the earth's core in The Core movie was made of, IIRC.

 

[NX74205]

Unobatanium (Really?? Unobtanium, Cameron couldn't come up with a better name?!?)

Unobtainium was the name of the stuff that the ship that went to the earth's core in The Core movie was made of, IIRC.

I only say that since I am an engineer by trade and anytime a customer comes at us with some ridiculous requirement, we always joke that we will just build it out of unobtanium. Meaning that it is impossible to meet said requirements with our current design with any material known to man.

Also, if Neil Blokammp of District 9 fame did the Halo movie, I would see it. My ultimatum on the Halo movie was hyperbole at its best. Blookamp (sp?) is one a handful of actors I would trust with the Halo movie.