I did not get the vibe that Jack is somehow being pressured to join Starfleet. Neither Picard nor Beverly would be the type who'd do that. Now that he's in it, I can only assume it's what he wants to do.
Jack Crusher. 2nd Officer of the Enterprise-G
- Thread starter TerryTrek
- Start date
I think it's a 2-way street.
StarFleet can teach him alot of things.
While he can teach StarFleet about civilian life in the UFP and outside of it.
My opinion might change but I just don't get the impression that Jack's all about the Starfleet life.
So it feels very fish out of water to me and not in a good way.
I think it's too early in his rank to be 2nd Officer.I fully admit I'm stretching the limits of reaching, with my constant mentioning of Starfleet Marines. I do get that.
I just like the concept, that's all. I want to believe that Starfleet does indeed have marines.I know they are not, strictly speaking, canon, but they're also not NON-canon.
(in my headcanon, the division color of Starfleet Marines is black in TOS/SNW and light gray in PIC and its ilk.)
and yes, I think that's a posting Jack would do well at. He's clearly got the fighting skills for it.
But second officer? No. I'm not seeing that I just don't see Jack as command material. Not yet anyway.
4th Officer at best IMO, and even that's stretching it.
Right now, he should remain the "Special Consul" to Captain Seven.
I'm with you, I believe StarFleet can't be the ONLY service under the UFP.
There's MUCH more world building to flesh out.
The Dominion War can't be all fought by StarFleet.
There was plenty of ground action.
In my 26th century Head Canon, I flesh out the other services.
I think they should drop the "special counselor" stuff. Give Jack a real posting and be done with it. In fact I wouldn't exactly shed a tear if we never saw any counselors again.
Contrary to popular belief, the third chair on TNG was not meant to be the "counselor's chair" but rather the mission consultant's chair. You'll note Deanna always had to vacate the chair whenever anyone like an Admiral, Ambassador or someone with something to contribute to the plot was on the bridge. Indeed, typically the ship's counselor wouldn't be expected to stand watch on the bridge, Deanna just did it so often because of her empathic abilities.
As for whether or not the Titan did have a counselor aboard, the room where Deanna and Jack went to when she looked into his mind was labeled "Counselor's Office" on the door, so there is supposed to be a counselor aboard the ship. We just never saw them.
I mean, a majority of people serving in Starfleet spent their childhood and teenage years as civilians, either in the Federation or outside. And Starfleet is an organization which answers to a civilian government. I don't see why they would only now at the start of the 25th century need to create a whole new job position dedicated to teaching them the Civilian Way. You don't actually think militaries of today need specialized officers whose job is to teach it's personnel about civilian life in their own homelands, do you?
Not everybody who has joined StarFleet will be as "Well Traveled" as Jack Crusher who speaks multiple alien languages and has experience on plenty of worlds.
There are plenty of new officers who only really experienced life on their planet and are finally getting out into the Stars as a fresh cadet.
@fireproof78
Would you want to see more counselors in Star Trek?
Given that you're a IRL counselor?
I am more interested on who Seven will end up shipping with. What if Chakotay comes on the scene again?
Does anybody know if Axum is still alive? As far as I am aware, he is. Axum may be searching for Seven now that the Collective is no more and he has been freed from its clutches.
There are many potential ‘love triangle’ possibilities.
As for Terry’s original hypothetical situation, I believe that Seven would *definitely* ‘needs of the many’ like Spock. Seven’s actions would still have the same implications and outcomes regardless of her being in command or not when making the decision. Why would she need to step down to rescue Raffi? Being in command, Seven would have the authority to launch a rescue mission of her own, transferring command to her ‘number one’ whilst she is absent. Jack would understand that Seven needs to do this, and I am sure that other members of the Enterprise crew would understand and may even want to tag along to save their friend too.
This is how it would go, in a nutshell:
Seven made her choice. She knew the weight of command and the responsibility that it carried… the sacrifices that it demanded. She refused to allow her personal feelings to cloud her judgment - feelings which she thought had been left in the past. Seven numbly called for the [Terry Matalas can insert the necessary actions to be taken to save the lives of the innocent beings on the planet here 
], fully aware that Raffi's life hung in the balance as a result of her choice and actions, though Seven would *not* abandon her dear friend, even if the odds were not in her favour and any mission to rescue Raffi would now likely fail.
], fully aware that Raffi's life hung in the balance as a result of her choice and actions, though Seven would *not* abandon her dear friend, even if the odds were not in her favour and any mission to rescue Raffi would now likely fail.Immediately after giving the order to [Whatever, blah blah blah], Seven, without hesitation, transfers temporary command to her loyal ‘puppy dog’ trusted first officer, Jack, whilst she prepares to lead the rescue mission. After giving Jack a quick pep talk about his first true experience in command, Seven departs aboard the Galileo X on her seemingly futile mission to rescue Raffi…. but Captain Seven is not alone; Raffi’s mentor, Ambassador Worf, insisted on coming along for the ride too…
I kind of doubt that Jack will still be an ensign if that happens. We don't know how much time will have passed between now and whenever this proposed spinoff will air. For all we know, it could be several years later, enough for Jack to move up the chain of command to be either a lieutenant or lieutenant commander. With the Enterprise-G being a smaller ship than her predecessors, the billet for second officer may only require an officer of at least lieutenant rank possibly.
You can say that about every newcomer in Starfleet, but Jack has already demonstrated traits that makes him worthy of Starfleet by putting others before him during the Changeling-Borg crisis. He confronted the Borg on his own rather than endanger the crew of the Titan or have anyone die for him.
It's just a matter that Jack is indeed a special case. There's no denying that. He isn't just an ordinary guy, even though he has long believed himself to be. His parentage aside, he has already experienced things that most new officers have only learned about in a classroom or a holodeck. That put him ahead of the game when he joined Starfleet, with anything else about the finer points of being an officer he'll learn like every other newbie.
Give him time.
I would not put him in as second officer. That's stretching it.
No, he hasn't. He has demonstrated little save ofr a capacity for getting in trouble, and having to get out of trouble. That he has real world experience does not make him someone I would A) put in Starfleet or B) put as the second officer. He's not someone that I think should be put in as presented at the end of the show.
Time? No, I don't feel the need to give him any more time.
At this point I would lean towards "No." I have not cared for the counselor presentation in Trek. So I'd rather they not lean on that trope any longer.
I could see this developing…. Let’s see where Terry takes it.
"Counselor" has a more than one meaning. Troi is just one type of counselor. Jack would be a different type.
Not really. If Captain Seven wants Jack as her second officer, it's within her right to make it so. Like it was with Janeway and Tom Paris, she's the captain. Seven apparently sees something in Jack you don't or won't.
I--and Starfleet--disagree.
That's your call, of course. The rest of us will continue onwards.
So long as Starfleet makes the call its ok?
I'm sorry that is not sufficient for me. Jack has not demonstrated leadership capabilities. He has a long rap sheet of bucking authority. That's concerning, at best.
Pretty sure I don't have to blindly agree with fictional organizations or captains.
Assigned to the USS CERRITOS.Jack the rebellious officer Starfleet needs. A maverick who marches to beat of his own drum. Bucking the system and showing the brass hats how it's done.
Second contacts are very important.
But a lot of people didn't like that either. Nor Saru naming Ensign Tilly as first officer over more senior candidates.
I think that kind of "leapfrogging" in a lot of cases contradicts one's sense of "fairness", so it often leaves a sour taste in one's mouth.
