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Spoilers It's possible that the Cardies were UFP members or allies before the occupation of Bajor.

Unimatrix Q

Unimatrix Q

Commodore
Commodore
As hinted by the fact that according to Season 2 of Discovery, Captain Pike received the Cardassian Proficient Service Medallion.

We've seen in Picard that Jean Luc during his career in starfleet received a lot of awards from Federation members and allies.

In the Kelvin timeline a drink called "Cardassian Sunrise" was served on Earth around this time.
 
Vger23 said:
Cardies is an insensitive racist term, and I’m offended by its use here.
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Sorry about that. I actually wanted to write Cardassians but it wasn't possible for the title because of the lenght limitations.

I actually made a thread about this issue some time ago. But apparently no one fixed it.
 
Unimatrix Q said:
We've seen in Picard that Jean Luc during his career in starfleet received a lot of awards from Federation members and allies.
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The Cardassians annexed Bajor "60 years ago" in "Emissary", set in 2369. So the annex would've been 2309. Picard was the "Class of '27" when he went to Starfleet Academy. Referenced in both "The First Duty" and "Tapestry".

So, if the Cardassians were part of the Federation before, then it was never during Picard's early career.

BUT, if the Cardassians were part of the Federation before that, and pulled out, then that would be the source of the Border Wars. The thing is: I can't imagine a world like Cardassia ever being considered for Federation Membership. Its values seemed completely contrary to the Federation.
 
Lord Garth said:
The Cardassians annexed Bajor "60 years ago" in "Emissary", set in 2369. So the annex would've been 2309. Picard was the "Class of '27" when he went to Starfleet Academy. Referenced in both "The First Duty" and "Tapestry".

So, if the Cardassians were part of the Federation before, then it was never during Picard's early career.

BUT, if the Cardassians were part of the Federation before that, and pulled out, then that would be the source of the Border Wars. The thing is: I can't imagine a world like Cardassia ever being considered for Federation Membership. Its values seemed completely contrary to the Federation.
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Like Hungary and Poland and the EU?
 
TE="Lord Garth, post: 13713639, member: 25139"]The Cardassians annexed Bajor "60 years ago" in "Emissary", set in 2369. So the annex would've been 2309. Picard was the "Class of '27" when he went to Starfleet Academy. Referenced in both "The First Duty" and "Tapestry".

So, if the Cardassians were part of the Federation before, then it was never during Picard's early career.

BUT, if the Cardassians were part of the Federation before that, and pulled out, then that would be the source of the Border Wars. The thing is: I can't imagine a world like Cardassia ever being considered for Federation Membership. Its values seemed completely contrary to the Federation.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, i guess the same. I could imagine that the Union was a democracy during at least a part of the 23rd century and the rise of fascism happened shortly before the border wars. As hinted by what Madred told Picard about his youth in "Chains of Command".

Another possibility is that it will be hinted at or shown in SNW.
 
Soldiers (by any term) can present day recieve decorations from foreign nations. The Cardassians could award a medal to a Starfleet officer, without having to be a Federation member.

Plus, STD is obviously a alternate universe and as such Cardassi could have been one of the Federation's founding members.
 
I just chalk this up as a continuity error, IIRC the awards weren't read off in the dialogue, so the episode writers probably didn't write them, they probably left it up to the FX people. The FX team probably just browsed the military awards section of memory-alpha or something.

Tenacity said:
Plus, STD is obviously a alternate universe
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No it isn't. And it's DSC or DIS not STD.
 
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican_Service_Medal
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican_Border_Service_Medal

Here are two medals with "Mexican" in the name, yet Mexico was never part of the US.

Service medals can be named after regions and locations that are not part of the awarding government.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Army_of_Occupation_of_Germany_Medal named after Germany

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/China_Service_Medal. China

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_Service_Medal. Vietnam
 
So Pike just killed Cardies proficiently and got a medal for it?

Sounds about right. Then again, "values" don't seem to feature prominently in UFP membership criteria, especially not back in the TOS days. Cardassia could well have been in and out like an alley cat, leaving in a huff when the Feds found another source for Unobtainium-47 and were no longer willing to make concessions to longstanding Cardassian cultural traditions such as oppression and torture.

Timo Saloniemi
 
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Proficient_Service_Medallion

This is what is being referenced here.

The Bio in Discovery doesn't say 'Cardassian Proficient Service Medallion', all it just says 'Proficient Service Medallion', So it's entirely possible both the Cardassians and Starfleet have a medal with the same name. It's a pretty generic name.
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Christopher_Pike#Awards_and_honors

However, right below it on his Bio is "Legate's Crest of Valor" which is a Cardassian award
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Legate's_Crest_of_Valor

Also the Carrington Award is mentioned which is a medical award. Really does add to my theory that the artists just grabbed a list of awards off Memory-Alpha without looking at the context. That also matches with his short bio on the left side of the screen which was copied from M-A and just reworded to the present tense.

Also small thing, his mug shot, it looks like he has the Discovery badge on, not the Enterprise badge.

SJEdy12.png
 
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Tuskin38 said:
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Proficient_Service_Medallion

This is what is being referenced here.

The Bio in Discovery doesn't say 'Cardassian Proficient Service Medallion', all it just says 'Proficient Service Medallion', So it's entirely possible both the Cardassians and Starfleet have a medal with the same name. It's a pretty generic name.
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Christopher_Pike#Awards_and_honors

However, right below it on his Bio is "Legate's Crest of Valor" which is a Cardassian award
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Legate's_Crest_of_Valor

Also the Carrington Award is mentioned which is a medical award. Really does add to my theory that the artists just grabbed a list of awards off Memory-Alpha without looking at the context. That also matches with his short bio on the left side of the screen which was copied from M-A and just reworded to the present tense.

Also small thing, his mug shot, it looks like he has the Discovery badge on, not the Enterprise badge.

SJEdy12.png
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Had totally forgotten about the Legate's Crest of Valor, which is even a stronger hint for at least a cordial relationship between Cardassia and the Federation at this time imo :cardie::beer:
 
Timo said:
So Pike just killed Cardies proficiently and got a medal for it?

Sounds about right. Then again, "values" don't seem to feature prominently in UFP membership criteria, especially not back in the TOS days. Cardassia could well have been in and out like an alley cat, leaving in a huff when the Feds found another source for Unobtainium-47 and were no longer willing to make concessions to longstanding Cardassian cultural traditions such as oppression and torture.

Timo Saloniemi
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Why during the times of TOS? If we can believe what both Picard and Gul Madred said in "Chain of Command", there is a high probability that Cardassia was a democracy during these times, without any oppression at all.
 
How so? All Madred is saying is that Cardassia was poor back then (whenever that was, this depending on how long Cardassians live and how rapidly they age).

And probably still is, for those who don't get "rescued" into the military life and begin a life of oppressing and pillaging and never going hungry. Democracy has nothing to do with that.

DS9 tells a more detailed story about Cardassian history: their current style of government is 500 years old. Is this when "the military took over", then? Is this when the oppressing began? Or did that happen even earlier on?

Cardassia being different during TOS isn't really supported by anything much. And "oppressive" is an internal matter, not easily visible to the outside, it seems: Bajorans were among those who initially believed their "We're here only to help" claims.

Timo Saloniemi
 
Timo said:
How so? All Madred is saying is that Cardassia was poor back then (whenever that was, this depending on how long Cardassians live and how rapidly they age).

And probably still is, for those who don't get "rescued" into the military life and begin a life of oppressing and pillaging and never going hungry. Democracy has nothing to do with that.

DS9 tells a more detailed story about Cardassian history: their current style of government is 500 years old. Is this when "the military took over", then? Is this when the oppressing began? Or did that happen even earlier on?

Cardassia being different during TOS isn't really supported by anything much. And "oppressive" is an internal matter, not easily visible to the outside, it seems: Bajorans were among those who initially believed their "We're here only to help" claims.

Timo Saloniemi
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You got some really good points here. But how could Picard know about that the Cardassians "were a peaceful people with a rich spiritual life", without any exposure to their history and culture.

And according to Madred the big change happened fairly recently.

So my guess is, that the system of government and some of their organisations were already there but not the totalitarism and the oppression.

Their government might have been kinda like it was later, when the Detapa council came into power before Dukat's coup.
 
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