It really is stupid....

[chardman]

....how so many of the Doctor's enemies in the new series, when they run into him, have absolutely no clue that he's the one who survived the Time War, until he tells them. I mean, sure, he could easily be an incarnation that hasn't experienced those events yet in his personal timeline; but there really aren't that many incarnations of him to keep track of, now are there, and I'm guessing that any culture capable of interstellar travel has invented some equivalent of photography, and written records. Seems that those who've had repeated run-ins with the Doctor in the past probably have fairly detailed records of the various incarnations they'd run into, and where they figure those incarnations are likely to fall in The Doctor's personal timeline. It should therefore be quite easy to figure out that the incarnations in this new series are newer than the pre-timewar incarnations, and therefore must be post-timewar incarnations. But no. Time and again the Doctor as performed by Eccleston, Tennant, and Smith has had to tell the baddies who he is, beginning in the very first episode where No.9 speechifies his timewar-surviving awesomeness to the plastic creature under the Millennium Ferris Wheel, to No.10 suggesting to the Vashta Nerada that since they were in a library, they might want to “look him up”, to No.11 various reminders to virtually all of his adversaries that he's they guy who survived the timewar.

Dear, oh dear, it seems that SOMEONE'S arguments to the contrary are simpleminded, poorly thought out, and, well, not based in reality.




Apologies to the Mods; the original thread was already (rightfully) closed, but the guy's argument was so stupid and full of holes that I felt compelled to respond. This is strictly a one-shot, and I have no intention of making any further issue of it, but will accept a warning if you believe this truly warrants one.

 

[EJA]

My argument is not stupid and is not full of holes. You're just being nasty.

Oh, and when the Sontarans in The Sontaran Stratagem/The Poison Sky first heard the Doctor's name, they were like, "He who led the hordes to Gallifrey! The last of the Time Lords!" They can't have guessed that just by the guy's appearance. And lots of different Doctors have jumped in and out of different time zones, so figuring out which one is the "current" one is no easy task. Take note.

 

[RoJoHen]

Maybe that's why the Doctor likes humans so much. We're too stupid to recognize him for what he is.

The other races were actually involved in and know the outcome of the Time War, so maybe it's possible they know who the Doctor is because of that. He's famous across the cosmos.

 

[EJA]

The Sontarans weren't allowed to participate though, and are peeved about it.

 

[RoJoHen]

Doesn't mean they didn't know about it.

 

[EJA]

Let me propose a scenario: In Year 1, the Andromedans meet the Sixth Doctor. Next year, they travel to Betelgeuse, where the Betelgeuseans have just met the Second Doctor, and show the Andromedans a photo they took of him. So with is the earlier Doctor, and who is the later Doctor, from the Andromedans POV?

 

[MacLeod]

Hasn't it been implied, that not all species were aware of the Time War, and those that did initally think that both sides had been destroyed. Besides with all of time and space whilst he might be encontering species a few years apart in his timeline, for that species a millenia could have past.

 

[chardman]

Well, I said I didn't plan to make further issue, but I take this as a personal challenge.

Sorry EJA, but despite what you said in the other "It really is stupid" thread, almost none of the baddies in NuWho have known that any of the new incarnations of The Doctor survived the Time War, instinctively or otherwise. In almost every case, they've known only after he's pointed it out to them. The very basis of your whole argument is utterly false. It's not just full of holes, but is, in and of itself, one gigantic hole, with no basis in reality. We're I to base an opinion of you on this particular argument alone. I'd be forced to believe that you haven't actually watched a single episode of the post-2005 episodes, as your claimed perceptions are almost exactly the very opposite of what actually occurred.

 

[DWF]

Let me propose a scenario: In Year 1, the Andromedans meet the Sixth Doctor. Next year, they travel to Betelgeuse, where the Betelgeuseans have just met the Second Doctor, and show the Andromedans a photo they took of him. So with is the earlier Doctor, and who is the later Doctor, from the Andromedans POV?

Been there, done that in Timelash but as it's been pointed out it's the Doctor on the new show who's told the lesser races who he is.

 

[EJA]

Does anyone remember Lady Rosanna of the Satyrnine in The Vampires of Venice? As soon as the Doctor told her he was a Time Lord, she remarked that he should be in a museum. He hadn't told her he was the last of his kind.

 

[matthunter]

http://www.trekbbs.com/showpost.php?p=4928305&postcount=46

Consistency of my stool following a Beef Madras, ladies and gentlemen.

 

[chardman]

Does anyone remember Lady Rosanna of the Satyrnine in The Vampires of Venice? As soon as the Doctor told her he was a Time Lord, she remarked that he should be in a museum.

Wow, a vampire chick and the Sontarians. Two whole examples, out of how many episodes? (I gave three counter-examples in my very first post, just off the top of my head.) I'm willing to bet that no matter how many examples you can find to support your position, I could come up with far more examples to support just the opposite.

Fact is, he's told so many people, in so many episodes, that he survived the Timewar and is "The Last of the Timelords™", that it sometimes comes across as braggadocio, and is one of my few complaints about NuWho.

 

[RoJoHen]

Does anyone remember Lady Rosanna of the Satyrnine in The Vampires of Venice? As soon as the Doctor told her he was a Time Lord, she remarked that he should be in a museum. He hadn't told her he was the last of his kind.

Why would he have to? Most of the universe thinks the Time Lords are extinct.

If a creature walked up to me and said, "I'm a T-Rex," I might have the same reaction.

 

[EJA]

Does anyone remember Lady Rosanna of the Satyrnine in The Vampires of Venice? As soon as the Doctor told her he was a Time Lord, she remarked that he should be in a museum. He hadn't told her he was the last of his kind.

Why would he have to? Most of the universe thinks the Time Lords are extinct.

Except all those people living in 2,000,000 AD.

Oh yes, and Mr Finch in School Reunion also knew.

 

[EJA]

I want apologies from you people.

 

[chardman]

Except all those people living in 2,000,000 AD.

Really? They actually established that in 2,000,000 AD that every single sentient species in the universe knows who the Doctor is? Oh right, they didn't.

Again, I'm betting that there are plenty of folks in 2,000,000 AD who wouldn't recognize the doctor on the street, and have never heard of a Timelord or of Gallifrey.

Okay, so now we have the Vamp chick, the Sontarians, and "a group" of folks from roughly 2 million years in the future, to support your notion, and I still have the plastic critter under London, the Vashta Nerada, and virtual every alien race No.11 has bumped into in just about every episode he's been in thus far. IIRC No.10 had to introduce himself to the spider chick who was messing with Donna's wedding. And neither the Plasmavore nor the Judoon searching for it recognized the Doctor for who or what he was in "Smith and Jones", until he made himself known. Same goes for the Sycorax in Tennant's introductory episode, as well as the critters in the school in "School Reunion" (Seeing as Rose & 10 were working for Finch to spy on him, it's a safe bet that Finch didn't have a clue as to who/what the Doc was until 11 actually confronted him.), and, well, the list of folks who have no clue who the Doctor is (til actually told) goes on and on, and is mighty long indeed.

I want apologies from you people.

I am deeply and heartfeltly sorry that you don't know what you're talking about. You have my deepest sympathy and condolences.

 

[matthunter]

I want apologies from you people.

Not going to happen.

The MOST charitable I'm feeling right now, after perusing your profile and its link to your Facebook page, is to tell you that you may in fact be me when I was your age (the bit about the no friends and thinking you're weird, I hope to God I wasn't this tedious though). And the best advice I can give you at this point is to turn off your computer and walk away, because THIS is the reason you describe yourself as "a bit of a weirdo".

Liking Doctor Who is fine. Liking anything to the point where you obsessively start threads saying you hate that it isn't internally consistent and demanding apologies from anyone who points out that you are, in fact, being a tedious prick is NOT HEALTHY, nor is it going to achieve anything of lasting significance.

 

[chardman]

I better stop now before EJA tells me I can get "smashed into a wall by a bus". He does that you know. To people who "hurt" him on websites.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

Does anyone remember Lady Rosanna of the Satyrnine in The Vampires of Venice? As soon as the Doctor told her he was a Time Lord, she remarked that he should be in a museum. He hadn't told her he was the last of his kind.

To say that, she didn't necessarily have to know he was the last or they were extinct. She just hadn't seen or heard about timelords for a really long time.

Unless The Sun had run a piece about the extinction of the timelords at some point....

 

[Winterwind]

I want apologies from you people.

"I'm sorry. I'm so sorry..."