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Is my friend delusional? Advice needed

C

chrispaps

Lieutenant
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Yesterday, while I was out walking with my friend and his dog, my friend turned to me and said this:

Friend: "Chris (me), you know I would never lie to you right?"
Me: "Yes, I know. Why?"
Friend: "Well, last night, while I was praying, I received a message from Jesus saying that he wants me to deliver you this message"
Me: "What message?"
Friend: "That even though you dont go to church or pray, Jesus is in your heart"

My question to everyone is this: Is my friend delusional? I am an atheist and as such I don't believe in god or prescribe to any religion. However, about a 10 years ago my friend began becoming more and more religious and over the years from time to time would say things to me that sounded a bit preachy. Since then our friendship, although still close, has declined, mainly because we disagree on a lot of things in general and I hate being preached at. However, I do know for certain that my friend is extremely honorable and would never in a million years lie to me. Plus, this is the first time that he has ever told me anything like this. My initial response was to get defensive and I asked him not to sound preachy to me ever again. But since then I have been wondering if my friend may be delusional or slightly psychotic because he genuinely believes that he communicated with Jesus. Am I right in thinking this? Should I be concerned about his state of mind? Should I do something about it?

Please help. I really feel confused about this and need people's advice and opinion. Thanks
 
I don't think "delusional" is the accurate word--and least in a true medical mental health sense.

That response is indicative of most religious types.

EDIT: I don't mean to knock on religious people, per-say. I simply meant that some of things people do for religion seem crazy to others whether it be non-believers or people of a different faith.
 
I don't know you or your friend, but this doesn't sound like cause for alarm. Devoutly religious christians believe that they can communicate with God and vice versa.

I'm not religious, but in a similar vein, I believe that I 'spoke' to my deceased father on a couple of occasions. I don't think that makes me psychotic; others might think differently.

I don't think you have to get all defensive; my reply to your friend would be, "Great, thanks for the message - so I must be doing fine as I am. Cool - I'll just keep not going to church and not believing in god then!"
 
It's possible that as he becomes more religious, he worries more about you and what will happen to you at the end of your earthly life. Sometimes conscious worry can be come subconscious dreams. He may not be lying, but may have truly dreamed that Jesus had a message for his good friend.

I don't think it's anything to be concerned about. It's an indication of the depth of his regard for you. In fact, reacting with some hostility rather than simply accepting the message may increase his worry. It may be best to accept the message for what it is: concern for a friend's well-being. A thank-you and a change of subject is in order.
 
Replace Jesus with any other fantasy or mythological character, and that may help you. If he had said that Santa Claus, Captain Kirk or The Devil spoke to him and said that they were in your heart. How would you react?

You might also want to ask him what it means for him, to say Jesus is in your heart? I assume he means it's a good thing? I would also urge you to tell him what your honest feelings are upon hearing this news from him. If it's the case that you don't believe, and don't particularly want any foreign imaginary entity in your mind/body/soul you should tell him so.
 
I agree with McCoy.

It sounds to me like you and your friend hit one of those inevitable points of contention between people who care about each other but have vastly divergent worldviews.

You worry that your friend is delusional, because his experience in prayer is something which goes against your fundamental rational beliefs. He's having problems because he's got to reconcile his regard for you with his fundamental belief in the necessity of faith. You're both in the position of caring about somebody whom you believe to be utterly wrong about their whole understanding of the world. There's no simple way to navigate that.

I find it can be instinctive to react defensively to stuff like this, because as a non-believer one is so often bombarded with the negative impact of religious influence. I think though that, given the strength of your friend's beliefs, what he said was reasonably respectful. He didn't try to wheedle or convert you.

My own (completely personal) opinion would be that the thing to do here is thank him for his concern for you, and then see if the two of you can't establish some boundaries on the whole awkward religious question. It's not perfect. Sometimes, though, one has to pick one's fights and weigh them up against what a particular friendship can take.
 
It sounds like a cry for help.


In my experience, people turn to "God" because they feel that they cannot cope with life on their own. Let him know that you are there for him and encourage him to cut off communication with his church. Those vultures are likely feeding on his fears and insecurities while he empties his wallet into the coffers.
 
McCoy said:
It's possible that as he becomes more religious, he worries more about you and what will happen to you at the end of your earthly life. Sometimes conscious worry can be come subconscious dreams. He may not be lying, but may have truly dreamed that Jesus had a message for his good friend.

I don't think it's anything to be concerned about. It's an indication of the depth of his regard for you. In fact, reacting with some hostility rather than simply accepting the message may increase his worry. It may be best to accept the message for what it is: concern for a friend's well-being. A thank-you and a change of subject is in order.
Click to expand...


I completely agree. It's a part of Christian teachings to try and help those you genuinely care for, and helping them to the faith is the biggest way in which he can help you.

It's meant as the highest form of regard, not a way to smack you over the head and try to convert you.

Sounds like he put it in a really sweet and caring way.
 
Your friend is not harming anyone and obviously has good intentions. That's more than can be said for a lot of people.
 
I prayed last night, and Jesus said you should send me all your money.
 
Meh, just sounds like something I hear a lot from the Churchies in the family. Harmless enough, unless you doesn't respect your personal beliefs and puts on the full court press to convert/save you.
 
It is proslytizing, and that is damaging to a friendship. So it isn't harmless. It's the same as saying "even though you don't practice Islam, Allah is in your heart." It's like telling a Yankee fan that Boston is in their heart.

Unfortunately a lot of christians of this type will alienate all their friends and family with this crap. It is a strong indicator of a cult mentality. I tend to agree with post #10, but encouraging him to cut ties to his church will only cause him to want to cut you out of his life. Better to take it with a grain of salt, and as you did, tell him to stop proslytizing you.
 
chrispaps said:
Yesterday, while I was out walking with my friend and his dog, my friend turned to me and said this:

Friend: "Chris (me), you know I would never lie to you right?"
Me: "Yes, I know. Why?"
Friend: "Well, last night, while I was praying, I received a message from Jesus saying that he wants me to deliver you this message"
Me: "What message?"
Friend: "That even though you dont go to church or pray, Jesus is in your heart"

My question to everyone is this: Is my friend delusional? I am an atheist and as such I don't believe in god or prescribe to any religion. However, about a 10 years ago my friend began becoming more and more religious and over the years from time to time would say things to me that sounded a bit preachy. Since then our friendship, although still close, has declined, mainly because we disagree on a lot of things in general and I hate being preached at. However, I do know for certain that my friend is extremely honorable and would never in a million years lie to me. Plus, this is the first time that he has ever told me anything like this. My initial response was to get defensive and I asked him not to sound preachy to me ever again. But since then I have been wondering if my friend may be delusional or slightly psychotic because he genuinely believes that he communicated with Jesus. Am I right in thinking this? Should I be concerned about his state of mind? Should I do something about it?

Please help. I really feel confused about this and need people's advice and opinion. Thanks
Click to expand...
Just tell him "Message received." and let it go at that.
 
Without talking about this specific situation, a recent post of mine from another thread might help clarify the distinction between delusions, hallucinations and religious experiences...

Holdfast said:
T'Baio said:
What's the difference between "religious ecstasy" and delusion?
Click to expand...

Short answer: which group of experts in the field you believe.

Longer answer: the answer is that psychiatric diagnostic criteria have a built-in test for cultural context. Culturally accepted phenomena are by definition not delusional in content. Religious experience falls under this exemption. [if the extent of the religious content breaches culturally accepted limits, then yes, it might become delusional in degree]

Deeper, more accurate answer: Why accept this exemption at all? Well, why accept ANY classificatory system in psychiatry? Come to that, why accept any classificatory system in any subject? They're all built upon an agreed frame of reference, which is internally consistent at the time of agreement. So is religion. You might say one is more scientific, and thus more representative of reality. I would answer, why is that actually more important or meaningful? It depends on what you value in life, and whether you believe in the concepts of objective truth and how you define that term.

It all sounds simple and easy to be glib about on the surface, but these are pretty deep and turbulent waters underneath. Most people sail happily on the surface, sure of their own preconceptions about truth and reality.
Click to expand...

Bottom line, psychiatry deliberately (and I think correctly) tries to sidestep these issues, because of a general principle to minimise how many people are given stigmatising labels, and because psychiatry has been used as an agent for social control in the past.
 
It's impossible to know from this one incident if he's delusional or not, but it's unlikely. For a lot of people, prayer is like meditation, so he was probably just experiencing a waking dream with images from his subconscious. If he's not hurting anybody, there's no reason not to be polite and tolerant.
 
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