is it too techno-babbly?

[rocketscientist]

No, it's a reality. One of the most persistent and widespread criticisms of Voyager from many quarters over several years is the show's excessive reliance on technobabble. Common criticisms are using it to pad running time, using it as an incomprehensible deus ex machina, and sometimes it's accused of misusing scientific terminology (so that it's not entertaining even on that technical level).

Truthfully, it was an issue with TNG as well, though less so; DS9 and ENT seemed to have largely kept it in check (and quite absent from TOS).

I think you summed up the technobabble criticism really well.

In any case, I'm in agreement with others here as not caring for the technobabble much. The original show had comparitavely little. Why? I believe it was partly due to having limited effects and budget. How can they shoot a wave of anti-chronoton particles at the the anomaly to close it if they can't get the effect for it?

The lack of technobabble was also probably due to the time of the original show as well. There weren't many sci-fi shows on at the time, and ST largely set the standard. There wasn't much to compare it against (Lost in Space? Voyager to the Bottom of the Sea?!?!).

In any case, I think that was one of the strengths of the original show. It didn't rely on the technobabble crutch the way that its spin-offs did. It was a leaner show, more theatrical, and, as a consequence, I think that was one of its strengths. It was a lot more theatrical in that regard, and that made the writers, the directors, and the actors work harder to make good drama (and comedy). The proof of the success of that approach is evident: the original show is still syndicated and shown 40 years after its debut. It has been on almost continously since it's premiere.

As someone else here noted, the excessive technobabble began during the Berman era of Trek on TNG. Now, as an engineer, I didn't have a problem with that initially. Taken in moderation, it did add some color to the show and help to differentiate TNG from ST. I'm not sure why there was so much more technobabble in TNG than there was in ST. Maybe it was because they wanted to make TNG more real. Maybe it was because they had better effects. In any case, it was one of those elements of TNG, along with GR perfect people edict, the A+B plot formula, kids and a shrink on the ship, which, imo, really differentiated TNG from ST. IMO, it was a pretty significant difference in the writing of the two shows.

Most of the time, I don't think it hurt TNG that much. But there were some episodes, i.e. the episode Timeless, where time is frozen on the Enterprise and the Romulan ship, where it seemed that's all the episode was about: sfx and technobabble. Even in the worsts episodes of the original ST (episodes like Way to Eden, Lights of Zetar, and the film TFF), there was, at the very least, some good characters beats and scenes.

With VOY, both the sfx and technobabble were ramped up by a couple orders of magnitude from TNG. It was really excessive and I think VOY really suffered from it. The deux ex machina comment is right on. Other examples are the stupid Nexus in TNG and all those other space anomalies Braga kept inventing, 99% of which are pure fantasy and have no basis in real science.

In fact, as Kegek pointed, most of that technobabble in VOY, hell, most of the science depicted, is just pure fantasy.

Some VOY fans have said that VOY is more like the original ST than TNG was because of its premise. One ship all alone in uncharted place, exploring strange new worlds. In premise, yes, it's similar. In execution, however, especially wrt the technobabble, and, to a lesser extent the GR perfect people edict (VOY didn't follow this rule as much as TNG did), VOY, imo, is far more like TNG. I regard it as TNG v2.

So, yeah, I really do think the technobabble was really out of control on VOY. Many times, it really was a story-telling crutch and I do think it sometimes hurt the story. I really still, to this day, don't understand why they relied on it so much in the ST spinoffs, especially TNG and VOY. It just seems largely unnecessary.

Oh, and I'd love someone to do a comparison of a tech-heavy original ST episode with a typical VOY episode. I'd wager the VOY episode would have a lot more technobabble in it by far.

 

[rocketscientist]

This is an issue I feel rather strongly about. Good stories in any genre are about people. CSI, for example, uses more jargon than your average show ("Get the vic's DNA from these epithelials and run it through CODIS") but the writers always show us how the information gained via dry forensic procedure is affecting the characters in a vital and human way. The show is about the people, not the crimesolving technique. Most of the time, Voyager failed in that area. How many episodes were there where the solution to the problem of the week basically boiled down to the characters sitting at a console pressing buttons while spouting incomprehensible (to 99.9% of the population) made-up technobabble? That's bad writing. Period.

In the original Star Trek writer's guide, Gene Roddenberry said that a good Star Trek story should, if stripped of its science fiction elements, be able to be adapted to any other one-hour drama in primetime. How many Voyager stories fit that criteria? How many of them are really about the characters being affected in a real, organic, human way by the events of the episode?

To pick an example at random, take the episode "The Omega Directive". The whole thing is an exercise in technobabble. The only piece of character drama, Seven's reverence for the Omega molecule, is just too damn hard for the average person to relate to. Why should we care about a mostly emotionless cyborg's vaguely religious feelings for a technobabbly subatomic particle that's just a shiny special effect anyway? We're never really given a reason. Seven's dilemma is never made relatable in a human way. Most of Voyager was exactly the same. If you strip the science fiction (or science fantasy, if you prefer) elements from 98% of Voyager's episodes, you're left with nothing more than the plot for a Saturday-morning cartoon at the very most.

I realize my views are in the minority in this forum, but 99% of the viewing public didn't watch the show and were only vaguely aware of it, so I'd say my views are fairly typical in a larger context.

I think your observations have a lot of merit.

I won't say that "The Omega Directive" was totally shot for me, but I do think that, like many of Braga's ideas, it really wasn't that great, it wasn't told that well, and there was too much technobabble in it that just showed how very little he knew or cared about real science.

 

[CorporalClegg]

^
Braga's problem was never his ideas. Most of them were pretty original and generally good. It was the execution that was bad.

 

[GeorgeKirk]

^
Braga's problem was never his ideas. Most of them were pretty original and generally good. It was the execution that was bad.

I agree. Back when TNG was on the air, Braga's name in the Written By credit usually meant we were in for a good episode. And even on Voyager, episodes like Scorpion and Year of Hell were very well done.

The thing about scenes filled with technobabble is that they're much easier to write than scenes with meaningful human drama. Despite the fact that I haven't watched Voyager regularly since the 1st season, I could sit down right now and slam out a technobabble space battle scene without trying very hard at all. On the other hand, I've been working on an Original Series story for the last 3 or 4 months, and I've only written four pages or so. It's hard. Why? Because Original Series stories (good ones, not ones where Kirk, Spock, and McCoy get conked over the head and captured by green bikini-wearing priestesses of a computer god) are extremely light on the technical lingo and much heavier on the human element. You tend to worry a lot more about character motivations, believable behavior, and stuff like that. On Voyager and even late TNG, those things often took a back seat.

 

[Triskelion]

No, it's a reality. One of the most persistent and widespread criticisms of Voyager from many quarters over several years is the show's excessive reliance on technobabble. Common criticisms are using it to pad running time, using it as an incomprehensible deus ex machina, and sometimes it's accused of misusing scientific terminology (so that it's not entertaining even on that technical level).

Truthfully, it was an issue with TNG as well, though less so; DS9 and ENT seemed to have largely kept it in check (and quite absent from TOS).

I think you summed up the technobabble criticism really well.

In any case, I'm in agreement with others here as not caring for the technobabble much. The original show had comparitavely little. Why? I believe it was partly due to having limited effects and budget. How can they shoot a wave of anti-chronoton particles at the the anomaly to close it if they can't get the effect for it?

The lack of technobabble was also probably due to the time of the original show as well. There weren't many sci-fi shows on at the time, and ST largely set the standard. There wasn't much to compare it against (Lost in Space? Voyager to the Bottom of the Sea?!?!).

In any case, I think that was one of the strengths of the original show. It didn't rely on the technobabble crutch the way that its spin-offs did. It was a leaner show, more theatrical, and, as a consequence, I think that was one of its strengths. It was a lot more theatrical in that regard, and that made the writers, the directors, and the actors work harder to make good drama (and comedy). The proof of the success of that approach is evident: the original show is still syndicated and shown 40 years after its debut. It has been on almost continously since it's premiere.

As someone else here noted, the excessive technobabble began during the Berman era of Trek on TNG. Now, as an engineer, I didn't have a problem with that initially. Taken in moderation, it did add some color to the show and help to differentiate TNG from ST. I'm not sure why there was so much more technobabble in TNG than there was in ST. Maybe it was because they wanted to make TNG more real. Maybe it was because they had better effects. In any case, it was one of those elements of TNG, along with GR perfect people edict, the A+B plot formula, kids and a shrink on the ship, which, imo, really differentiated TNG from ST. IMO, it was a pretty significant difference in the writing of the two shows.

Most of the time, I don't think it hurt TNG that much. But there were some episodes, i.e. the episode Timeless, where time is frozen on the Enterprise and the Romulan ship, where it seemed that's all the episode was about: sfx and technobabble. Even in the worsts episodes of the original ST (episodes like Way to Eden, Lights of Zetar, and the film TFF), there was, at the very least, some good characters beats and scenes.

With VOY, both the sfx and technobabble were ramped up by a couple orders of magnitude from TNG. It was really excessive and I think VOY really suffered from it. The deux ex machina comment is right on. Other examples are the stupid Nexus in TNG and all those other space anomalies Braga kept inventing, 99% of which are pure fantasy and have no basis in real science.

In fact, as Kegek pointed, most of that technobabble in VOY, hell, most of the science depicted, is just pure fantasy.

Some VOY fans have said that VOY is more like the original ST than TNG was because of its premise. One ship all alone in uncharted place, exploring strange new worlds. In premise, yes, it's similar. In execution, however, especially wrt the technobabble, and, to a lesser extent the GR perfect people edict (VOY didn't follow this rule as much as TNG did), VOY, imo, is far more like TNG. I regard it as TNG v2.

So, yeah, I really do think the technobabble was really out of control on VOY. Many times, it really was a story-telling crutch and I do think it sometimes hurt the story. I really still, to this day, don't understand why they relied on it so much in the ST spinoffs, especially TNG and VOY. It just seems largely unnecessary.

Oh, and I'd love someone to do a comparison of a tech-heavy original ST episode with a typical VOY episode. I'd wager the VOY episode would have a lot more technobabble in it by far.

rocketscientist,
I think you summed up the TB problem really well. Calling TOS theatrical is right on the money (Kodos comes to mind!).

Your assessment of TNG is on cue too, but what do you mean by the A + B plot formula? Is that chronological or plot/subplot, or do you mean it's predictable?

I blame Levar Burton for making his technobabble sound good. TB for him was a tool that informed his acting. Not the other way around. It wasn't formulaic for him, it was exciting - which, if TB has any realism at least it could reveal engineers getting hot over technical solutions.

 

[Mrs Paris]

^
Braga's problem was never his ideas. Most of them were pretty original and generally good. It was the execution that was bad.

I agree. Back when TNG was on the air, Braga's name in the Written By credit usually meant we were in for a good episode. And even on Voyager, episodes like Scorpion and Year of Hell were very well done.

The thing about scenes filled with technobabble is that they're much easier to write than scenes with meaningful human drama. Despite the fact that I haven't watched Voyager regularly since the 1st season, I could sit down right now and slam out a technobabble space battle scene without trying very hard at all. On the other hand, I've been working on an Original Series story for the last 3 or 4 months, and I've only written four pages or so. It's hard. Why? Because Original Series stories (good ones, not ones where Kirk, Spock, and McCoy get conked over the head and captured by green bikini-wearing priestesses of a computer god) are extremely light on the technical lingo and much heavier on the human element. You tend to worry a lot more about character motivations, believable behavior, and stuff like that. On Voyager and even late TNG, those things often took a back seat.

I disagree, character development was always strong on Voyager. You might not have seen it since you said you haven't watched Voyager regularly

 

[INACTIVESamusAranX]

Ah, Robert bitching about Voyager. Good Times, Good Times.
At least, it payed the bills and if he was so miserable he could have had his character killed off by those damn warp particles.

When it comes to Beltran's criticizm, I think he was absolutely right in his criticizm.

He had a lot of ideas for his character but they didn't listen to him.

Chakotay had a lot of potential as a character. He could have been the best first officer ever, even better than Riker. But they wasted him and turned him into some sort of message boy.

I can clearly understand Beltran's frustration.

That's fine and all, but he needed to get down off that high horse of his...

He had no qualms collecting the paychecks, then turning around and biting the hand that feeds him. The nhe had the nerve to brag about not trying and noting he never read scripts. His attitude smacked of arrogance and hypocrisy to me.

If he truly thought his talent was being wasted, he should of asked to be let go from the show. In fact, I'm surprised he wasn't killed off.

And to finish off my mini-rant, where has Beltran's career gone after VGR?

 

[INACTIVESamusAranX]

As for another thought on VGR's technobabble, I still think it could have used some reduction.

However, when the writers put their minds to it, and reduced the technobabble, Voyager hit it out of the park. In fact, one of my favorite al ltime character driven episodes on Trek is "Lineage".

 

[Mrs Paris]

As for another thought on VGR's technobabble, I still think it could have used some reduction.

However, when the writers put their minds to it, and reduced the technobabble, Voyager hit it out of the park. In fact, one of my favorite al ltime character driven episodes on Trek is "Lineage".

Lineage was fantastic, my second favorite episode!!!

 

[Mrs Paris]

Ah, Robert bitching about Voyager. Good Times, Good Times.
At least, it payed the bills and if he was so miserable he could have had his character killed off by those damn warp particles.

When it comes to Beltran's criticizm, I think he was absolutely right in his criticizm.

He had a lot of ideas for his character but they didn't listen to him.

Chakotay had a lot of potential as a character. He could have been the best first officer ever, even better than Riker. But they wasted him and turned him into some sort of message boy.

I can clearly understand Beltran's frustration.

That's fine and all, but he needed to get down off that high horse of his...

He had no qualms collecting the paychecks, then turning around and biting the hand that feeds him. The nhe had the nerve to brag about not trying and noting he never read scripts. His attitude smacked of arrogance and hypocrisy to me.

If he truly thought his talent was being wasted, he should of asked to be let go from the show. In fact, I'm surprised he wasn't killed off.

And to finish off my mini-rant, where has Beltran's career gone after VGR?

that's exactly the point! He criticized the show, while it was still on the air, while it was still filiming. Its one thing to disagree with some of the decisions being made, and its one thing to criticize the show once you are no longer on it, but to do so while it's still flming and you are cashing the paychecks from it is incredible tacky. I'm actaly surprised he wasn't killed off

 

[Gotham Central]

When it comes to Beltran's criticizm, I think he was absolutely right in his criticizm.

He had a lot of ideas for his character but they didn't listen to him.

Chakotay had a lot of potential as a character. He could have been the best first officer ever, even better than Riker. But they wasted him and turned him into some sort of message boy.

I can clearly understand Beltran's frustration.

That's fine and all, but he needed to get down off that high horse of his...

He had no qualms collecting the paychecks, then turning around and biting the hand that feeds him. The nhe had the nerve to brag about not trying and noting he never read scripts. His attitude smacked of arrogance and hypocrisy to me.

If he truly thought his talent was being wasted, he should of asked to be let go from the show. In fact, I'm surprised he wasn't killed off.

And to finish off my mini-rant, where has Beltran's career gone after VGR?

that's exactly the point! He criticized the show, while it was still on the air, while it was still filiming. Its one thing to disagree with some of the decisions being made, and its one thing to criticize the show once you are no longer on it, but to do so while it's still flming and you are cashing the paychecks from it is incredible tacky. I'm actaly surprised he wasn't killed off

Jolene Balock was even more critical of Enterprise, but she kept her job. One thing you have to remember is that these folks are under contract. If you fire them, then you have to pay them off otherwise they get to stick around. Robert Beltran obviously felt that his legitimate criticism of the show was not being heard by TPTB and so went public. This is essentially the same thing as with Jolene. When you are undercontract, you can't just walk away. I'm sure if Paramount had offered to buy out his remaining time he would have taken the money and not looked back.

 

[Gotham Central]

but on the other hand what if there was no techno babble? If something went wrong and all you saw was someone running with a screwdriver to tighten a few nuts and bolts, that's not interesting for a show set in the future with so many technological advancements

I don't think that you are getting the point. Technobabble should be background color. It should simply enrich the believeability of the main drama. It, however, should never be the primary source of drama and definately not the solution to problems. As people have said, far too often the writers on Voyager would simply have pushing a few buttons solve the problem of the week. That's pretty lame, especially when we know its all made up with no basis in fact.

I can give you one example of technospeak working as a solution but not being a problem. There is an episode of seaQuest DSV where the sub has to rescue a civilian sub stranded in a freshwater sinkhole. Much of the drama in the episode involved the challenges of the differing levels of buoyancy between freshwater and seawater. Their solution involved lots of scientific jargon. The thing is, neither the problem nor the solution was strictly fictional. It was REAL science. They took action that helped to rapidly change the buoyancy of the seaQuest, thus allowing them to save the stranded sub. It was the reality of the siutation that made it work. (indeed my HS physics teacher at the time actually came into class the day after it aired and used it as an example of a real physical property...it ended up on a quiz....damn you seaQuest ).

 

[Mrs Paris]

but on the other hand what if there was no techno babble? If something went wrong and all you saw was someone running with a screwdriver to tighten a few nuts and bolts, that's not interesting for a show set in the future with so many technological advancements

I don't think that you are getting the point. Technobabble should be background color. It should simply enrich the believeability of the main drama. It, however, should never be the primary source of drama and definately not the solution to problems. As people have said, far too often the writers on Voyager would simply have pushing a few buttons solve the problem of the week. That's pretty lame, especially when we know its all made up with no basis in fact.

I can give you one example of technospeak working as a solution but not being a problem. There is an episode of seaQuest DSV where the sub has to rescue a civilian sub stranded in a freshwater sinkhole. Much of the drama in the episode involved the challenges of the differing levels of buoyancy between freshwater and seawater. Their solution involved lots of scientific jargon. The thing is, neither the problem nor the solution was strictly fictional. It was REAL science. They took action that helped to rapidly change the buoyancy of the seaQuest, thus allowing them to save the stranded sub. It was the reality of the siutation that made it work. (indeed my HS physics teacher at the time actually came into class the day after it aired and used it as an example of a real physical property...it ended up on a quiz....damn you seaQuest ).

you might have won your case if you gave an example from Voyager

 

[Navaros]

In any case, I'm in agreement with others here as not caring for the technobabble much. The original show had comparitavely little. Why? I believe it was partly due to having limited effects and budget. How can they shoot a wave of anti-chronoton particles at the the anomaly to close it if they can't get the effect for it?

The lack of technobabble was also probably due to the time of the original show as well. There weren't many sci-fi shows on at the time, and ST largely set the standard. There wasn't much to compare it against (Lost in Space? Voyager to the Bottom of the Sea?!?!).

I do not believe those reasons are the reasons why TOS had no technobabble. I'm sure they could have techno-babbled it up if they wanted to. The reason they didn't IMO is solely because they had the wisdom to know that technobabble is a useless waste of screen-time that makes for bad, hollow, boring television.

To answer the question in the thread title, yes, Voyager is absolutely too techno-babbly, as is TNG. DS9 removed it and thus put the franchise back to TOS' good no-technobabble standards, then VOY put it right back in.

 

[spoon]

The techno babble content was just right for me, it made the show seem more realistic and gave it detail. I mean, they're flying through space in a massive piece of complex technology that they rely upon for their survival. They're scientists and explorers who study the galaxy with their technology. Of course they're going to talk about it. About lines like "Bypass the main plasma conduit!", I don't know what would have worked better. For my tastes, anything else would have seemed too simplistic. Without the techno babble, we'd be complaining about how Janeway always gave orders like "Fix that engine!" or "Make the weapons work better!" and it would seem like technology could be enhanced by the magic of Janeway's voice.

I actually wish the other series had more techno babble. TOS kind of stands alone, though. It was high camp and it doesn't really matter that the technology was a completely mystery.

I agree. For me, I am able to keep track of all the words(by the end I pretty much knew what they were talking about; the terms and vocab they used was pretty consistant throughout the series, I thought) and I liked pretending that it was legit futuristic science and that I could totally do it if I was smart enough. I thought it gave the crewmembers a certain brain power, because they could think so many complicated things in a such a short ammount of time, under a LOT of pressure. Even if it is all fake. I mean, it's what people on Naval ships do all the time, especially when it comes to landing on aircraft carriers. They have alot of jargon and alot of stuff to keep in track. Plus, I thought it maintained the feeling that without constance supervision, the grand starship voyager could just start falling apart. Remember the episode where Seven had to watch the ship all by herself while the entire crew was in stasis? Yea, she nearly went crazy just keeping track of all the maintenance, nevermind the fact that she was alone.

It parallels our modern taste for realism, also. With TOS, it was made in the middle of the sixties where similar entertainment was just coming down from 40 years of flawless heros, and black and white morality. Anything revolutionary(as Star Trek certainly seems to have been) can only go a certain distance a head of everything else, because it only has so much to go on. Thus, while taking a retrospective look at humanity, it still held the "high camp" of the 50s/60s sci-fi genre, which, with the help of Star Trek and other series, has gone beyond The Adventures of Captain Proton. I guess the side-effect of more realism(as real as sci-fi can get) in the star trek universe has been techno-babble. Or, the writers could indeed just be lazy.

Anyway, I take as it comes.

 

[Kio]

For me, I am able to keep track of all the words(by the end I pretty much knew what they were talking about; the terms and vocab they used was pretty consistant throughout the series, I thought)...

Same here. I just didn't hear it as techno babble. With sci fi, I guess I've come to expect a certain amount of vocabulary that's unique to that creation.

It parallels our modern taste for realism, also. With TOS, it was made in the middle of the sixties where similar entertainment was just coming down from 40 years of flawless heros, and black and white morality.

Interesting point. Well, you'd have to discount film noir, but I think your talking about tv alone.

... with the help of Star Trek and other series, has gone beyond The Adventures of Captain Proton.

Speaking of Proton, I just realized that I watched the Proton stories thinking, "How goofy, it could never happen that way. Obviously, people would be on a ship like Voyager." Ok, I don't actually think the future will look anything like Star Trek, but I was that immersed in the story. I wonder what people in the 40s/50s thought of the sci fi of their day. Janeway could be the Captain Proton of sci fi made in the 2060s.

 

[rocketscientist]

but on the other hand what if there was no techno babble? If something went wrong and all you saw was someone running with a screwdriver to tighten a few nuts and bolts, that's not interesting for a show set in the future with so many technological advancements

I don't think that you are getting the point. Technobabble should be background color. It should simply enrich the believeability of the main drama. It, however, should never be the primary source of drama and definately not the solution to problems. As people have said, far too often the writers on Voyager would simply have pushing a few buttons solve the problem of the week. That's pretty lame, especially when we know its all made up with no basis in fact.

I can give you one example of technospeak working as a solution but not being a problem. There is an episode of seaQuest DSV where the sub has to rescue a civilian sub stranded in a freshwater sinkhole. Much of the drama in the episode involved the challenges of the differing levels of buoyancy between freshwater and seawater. Their solution involved lots of scientific jargon. The thing is, neither the problem nor the solution was strictly fictional. It was REAL science. They took action that helped to rapidly change the buoyancy of the seaQuest, thus allowing them to save the stranded sub. It was the reality of the siutation that made it work. (indeed my HS physics teacher at the time actually came into class the day after it aired and used it as an example of a real physical property...it ended up on a quiz....damn you seaQuest ).

That's a great example of incorporating science in a sci-fi program.

I'd be hard-pressed to find an example as good in VOY, since the Braga-science was mostly fantasy.

 

[rocketscientist]

No, it's a reality. One of the most persistent and widespread criticisms of Voyager from many quarters over several years is the show's excessive reliance on technobabble. Common criticisms are using it to pad running time, using it as an incomprehensible deus ex machina, and sometimes it's accused of misusing scientific terminology (so that it's not entertaining even on that technical level).

Truthfully, it was an issue with TNG as well, though less so; DS9 and ENT seemed to have largely kept it in check (and quite absent from TOS).

I think you summed up the technobabble criticism really well.

In any case, I'm in agreement with others here as not caring for the technobabble much. The original show had comparitavely little. Why? I believe it was partly due to having limited effects and budget. How can they shoot a wave of anti-chronoton particles at the the anomaly to close it if they can't get the effect for it?

The lack of technobabble was also probably due to the time of the original show as well. There weren't many sci-fi shows on at the time, and ST largely set the standard. There wasn't much to compare it against (Lost in Space? Voyager to the Bottom of the Sea?!?!).

In any case, I think that was one of the strengths of the original show. It didn't rely on the technobabble crutch the way that its spin-offs did. It was a leaner show, more theatrical, and, as a consequence, I think that was one of its strengths. It was a lot more theatrical in that regard, and that made the writers, the directors, and the actors work harder to make good drama (and comedy). The proof of the success of that approach is evident: the original show is still syndicated and shown 40 years after its debut. It has been on almost continously since it's premiere.

As someone else here noted, the excessive technobabble began during the Berman era of Trek on TNG. Now, as an engineer, I didn't have a problem with that initially. Taken in moderation, it did add some color to the show and help to differentiate TNG from ST. I'm not sure why there was so much more technobabble in TNG than there was in ST. Maybe it was because they wanted to make TNG more real. Maybe it was because they had better effects. In any case, it was one of those elements of TNG, along with GR perfect people edict, the A+B plot formula, kids and a shrink on the ship, which, imo, really differentiated TNG from ST. IMO, it was a pretty significant difference in the writing of the two shows.

Most of the time, I don't think it hurt TNG that much. But there were some episodes, i.e. the episode Timeless, where time is frozen on the Enterprise and the Romulan ship, where it seemed that's all the episode was about: sfx and technobabble. Even in the worsts episodes of the original ST (episodes like Way to Eden, Lights of Zetar, and the film TFF), there was, at the very least, some good characters beats and scenes.

With VOY, both the sfx and technobabble were ramped up by a couple orders of magnitude from TNG. It was really excessive and I think VOY really suffered from it. The deux ex machina comment is right on. Other examples are the stupid Nexus in TNG and all those other space anomalies Braga kept inventing, 99% of which are pure fantasy and have no basis in real science.

In fact, as Kegek pointed, most of that technobabble in VOY, hell, most of the science depicted, is just pure fantasy.

Some VOY fans have said that VOY is more like the original ST than TNG was because of its premise. One ship all alone in uncharted place, exploring strange new worlds. In premise, yes, it's similar. In execution, however, especially wrt the technobabble, and, to a lesser extent the GR perfect people edict (VOY didn't follow this rule as much as TNG did), VOY, imo, is far more like TNG. I regard it as TNG v2.

So, yeah, I really do think the technobabble was really out of control on VOY. Many times, it really was a story-telling crutch and I do think it sometimes hurt the story. I really still, to this day, don't understand why they relied on it so much in the ST spinoffs, especially TNG and VOY. It just seems largely unnecessary.

Oh, and I'd love someone to do a comparison of a tech-heavy original ST episode with a typical VOY episode. I'd wager the VOY episode would have a lot more technobabble in it by far.

rocketscientist,
I think you summed up the TB problem really well. Calling TOS theatrical is right on the money (Kodos comes to mind!).

Thanks very much, Triskelion, I appreciate the compliment. BTW, great username. That's one of my favorite episodes!

I see ST (the original, I don't like the sub-title Paramount tacked on for marketing purposes for DVDs, the original needs no subtitle) maligned by many neo-trekkers, mostly due to its 60s era production or the fact that it was cancelled after 3 seasons, due solely to the older ratings system. I still think there were some things the original show did better than TNG, VOY, and ENT, things that Berman and Braga weren't interested in incorporating in VOY and ENT (though Ron Moore was all for it on TNG and DS9), to those shows detriment imo. The limitations the original show had, well, I think they turned those into strengths.

Your assessment of TNG is on cue too, but what do you mean by the A + B plot formula? Is that chronological or plot/subplot, or do you mean it's predictable?

I was referring to the plot/subplot formula, which, according to Ron Moore, was instituted by Rick Berman. That was one of the things TNG could do with an ensemble cast, have two plots going at the same time. That's fine, but I thought they adhered to that formula a bit too rigidly. Apparently, they really had to work on Berman to let up on that rule when they wanted to do episodes like Family, First Contact, etc. (one plot had to have a problem to solve, Family didn't).

I blame Levar Burton for making his technobabble sound good. TB for him was a tool that informed his acting. Not the other way around. It wasn't formulaic for him, it was exciting - which, if TB has any realism at least it could reveal engineers getting hot over technical solutions.

I agree. Burton's character wasn't as good as the Picard, Data, or Worf, but, due to his skill as an actor, he did a great job selling the technobabble.

 

[rocketscientist]

In any case, I'm in agreement with others here as not caring for the technobabble much. The original show had comparitavely little. Why? I believe it was partly due to having limited effects and budget. How can they shoot a wave of anti-chronoton particles at the the anomaly to close it if they can't get the effect for it?



The lack of technobabble was also probably due to the time of the original show as well. There weren't many sci-fi shows on at the time, and ST largely set the standard. There wasn't much to compare it against (Lost in Space? Voyager to the Bottom of the Sea?!?!).

I do not believe those reasons are the reasons why TOS had no technobabble. I'm sure they could have techno-babbled it up if they wanted to. The reason they didn't IMO is solely because they had the wisdom to know that technobabble is a useless waste of screen-time that makes for bad, hollow, boring television.

You're right! That could be the reason too: they knew better!

To answer the question in the thread title, yes, Voyager is absolutely too techno-babbly, as is TNG. DS9 removed it and thus put the franchise back to TOS' good no-technobabble standards, then VOY put it right back in.

Well, DS9 did have a lot more technobabble than ST did. That said, they never ever let it get in the way of drama or be used as a deux ex machina for their stories like it sometimes did in TNG and happened A LOT in VOY.

In terms of characters and drama, I think DS9 is closer to ST than TNG is, probably due to Ira Steven Beher and, especially, Ron Moore, recognizing the strengths of the original show more than Berman and Braga, who were never ever fans, did.

 

[FalTorPan]

The only technobabble-filled scene that I recall from TOS is in "That Which Survives." The image of Losira appears in the Enterprise's engine room and begins spouting nonsensical technobabble about the matter/antimatter reaction system.