I hope old Spock...

[Discofan]

...told his younger self about V'ger and the "Whale Probe", both those crises (threatening twice the total destruction of life on Earth) were solved by the skin of their teeth by the combined ingenuity of Kirk and Spock and neither case should be affected by the change in the timeline, IE V'ger is still headed for Earth in search of its creator and the Whale Probe is still wondering why it hasn't received any whale call for more than two hundred years...

Don't you agree?

 

[BillJ]

The Abrams films are a reboot, just like Discovery.

 

[Tuskin38]

The Abrams films are a reboot, just like Discovery.

The probe that would become v’ger would have been launched before the divergence in the timeline

 

[The Old Mixer]

A reboot pretending to be an alternate timeline.

 

[Tuskin38]

Except it isn't. It's just an alternate timeline.

 

[urbandefault]

It doesn't have to all connect together -- it's just make believe.

 

[BillJ]

Except it isn't. It's just an alternate timeline.

Much like Michael Burnham and all the TOS nods, it was something designed to give their version credibility with the fan base. Whether one wants to admit it or not, both are reinterpretations of the original material.

 

[Tuskin38]

That's just an opinion though.
I won't derail the this thread with anymore comments on the matter, we've got enough of those over in the DSC subforum.

 

[BillJ]

That's just an opinion though.
I won't derail the this thread with anymore comments on the matter, we've got enough of those over in the DSC subforum.

The idea of it being a new interpretation really isn't an opinion. The presence of new actors, writers and directors makes Discovery a wholly new interpretation of the originals.

 

[F. King Daniel]

Nero sheer force of rage stopped V'Ger in the comics.

I'm not even joking.

 

[Timo]

So... V'Ger and the Whale Probe.

We know the former would be motivated to return to Earth in any timeline - we gain insight into its motivations in the movie. We also learn it would be darn near unstoppable. The only thing keeping it from hitting Earth in twenty-two, seventy-something sharp (the jury is still out on the exact year) would be if it saw something really interesting on the way there and stopped to assimilate. Or failed to see something interesting and thus arrived sooner than in the ST:TMP timeline. So yeah, advance warning about how to best deal with it would seem appropriate.

The latter we know nothing about. Might be the visit to Earth was on a total whim, and would not happen in most timelines. But while we know nothing, Spock might know a bit more. After all, he speaks Whale now. Or at least has successfully melded with whales that later appeared to be in conversation with the Probe. A second meld might have convinced him that the Probe would not be a threat in most timelines, including the one he retired to and got buried in.

What else is out there? Monsters easily dealt with - any two-bit skipper could have blown the Space Amoeba to bits, and people other than Kirk would probably fare better with the Doomsday Machine or the Dikironium Cloud.

...But what about Lazarus? I mean, two whole universes at stake and all. Could Lazarus have handled Lazarus, had Kirk not interfered?

The rest is details. People die, other people do their jobs for them. Trek time is robust like that, as demonstrated often enough.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[USS Firefly]

Except it isn't. It's just an alternate timeline.

I agree because we have prime Spock in it it isn't a reboot but a continuation

 

[Nyotarules]

In this timeline
V'Ger had no desire to join or return to its creator, it decided Life on Earth was too damn boring
The Whale probe went to Risa instead, more fun to had there and prettier whales.
Just as in the old timeline
The USS Franklin returned from its exploratory mission and Captain Edison resigned from Starfleet and joined Earth First an offshoot of Terra Prime. They received 666 votes at the Earth Presidential elections of 2170 and Jaylah was spared the hideous Earth music that sounded like bees.

 

[Terok Nor]

I know they tried to make out the timelines diverged at the point where the Narada emerged and destroyed the Kelvin in the 2009 movie but I prefer to go with Pegg's theory that the timeline changed backwards and forwards when the Narada appeared. It simplifies every inconsistency and writes off stuff like V'Ger and the Whale Probe. It's a totally different reality like the Mirror Universe. Works for me even if it's not what they were going for.

 

[USS Triumphant]

...But what about Lazarus?

But what of Lazarus? But what...of Lazarus?

Sorry. Seemed obligatory.

It simplifies every inconsistency and writes off stuff like V'Ger and the Whale Probe. It's a totally different reality like the Mirror Universe. Works for me even if it's not what they were going for.

We don't actually know that the Mirror Universe Starfleet *didn't* have to deal with Mirror V'Ger and the Mirror Whale Probe. Which is interesting to contemplate - at least to me.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I prefer to go with Pegg's theory that the timeline changed backwards and forwards when the Narada appeared.

I don't agree. It just doesn't make logical sense to suggest that time travel can alter the past as well as the future.

Now, if Pegg had said that the Kelvinverse was ALWAYS different, I could defintely get behind that. But he didn't say that, did he? (And until any of this makes it into a film, it's irrelevant anyway.)

 

[USS Triumphant]

I don't agree. It just doesn't make logical sense to suggest that time travel can alter the past as well as the future.

I understand why you say that, obviously, because we're very used to observing cause and then effect on the level we operate at in our day to day lives. However, my (admittedly layman's) understanding is that time is mathematically directionless (operations work the same done backward or forward) at the quantum mechanical level. The current science supports what Pegg said.

You know what's more important and doesn't, though? The rest of canonical time travel in Trek.

 

[Discofan]

I understand why you say that, obviously, because we're very used to observing cause and then effect on the level we operate at in our day to day lives. However, my (admittedly layman's) understanding is that time is mathematically directionless (operations work the same done backward or forward) at the quantum mechanical level. The current science supports what Pegg said.

You know what's more important and doesn't, though? The rest of canonical time travel in Trek.

I can see how things could have been changed in the past as well. Take Gillian Taylor, she moved from 20th century Earth to 23rd century Earth, but now since things are different, she's no longer in 23rd century Earth! So where is she? Did she simply vanish from the timeline or is she back to the 20th living the rest of her life as if the events of TVH never happened? I'll say it's likely the latter. So we have here one example or how events from the 20th century could be affected by the Kelvin intervention.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I can see how things could have been changed in the past as well. Take Gillian Taylor, she moved from 20th century Earth to 23rd century Earth, but now since things are different, she's no longer in 23rd century Earth! So where is she? Did she simply vanish from the timeline or is she back to the 20th living the rest of her life as if the events of TVH never happened? I'll say it's likely the latter. So we have here one example or how events from the 20th century could be affected by the Kelvin intervention.

The prime timeline still exists, alongside the Kelvin one. Nothing has been erased. Gillian is still in the prime 23rd century.

 

[USS Triumphant]

The prime timeline still exists, alongside the Kelvin one. Nothing has been erased. Gillian is still in the prime 23rd century.

And Data's head is still buried underneath San Francisco in both Prime AND Kelvin timelines, since his head was sent back to a point that long predates the divergence.