I guess I'm buying the Star Trek HD-DVD set now

[guardian]

Transformed.............

The answer to your question is...Yes he must be working for Sony!!!

The horsecrap he is peddling is the most obvious kind of 'info-propaganda' you can find.


"Stores are dropping HD DVd left right"

What total bull crap!!

Format neutral Hi Def websites are not predicting a winner anytime soon and there is the possibility both formats may survive.

HIDEFDIGEST's latest article talks of the record-breaking weekend sales of the HD DVD players...

The HD A2 sold almost as many units last weekend than the top selling blu-ray unit has sold since it's inception!!
Netflix reports that HD DVD 'outrents' blu-ray by a margin of 2.4 to 1
blu-ray is of course outselling HD DVD in discs, but of course if you can drop $999 to $499 on a player early in a format war--you got the bucks to buy a bunch discs when your buying that player.

I have only bought a handful of HD DVD discs but i have rented scores and I enjoy the experience.
But you can be sure when the Trek box set (and later the Trek movies) hit HD DVD--I'll be buying them.


But I really regret posting this because you know he's coming back with a load of more manure to justify his position.

 

[Matt]

Outpost4 said:
Yes, the discs have 1080p information.

Explain one thing to me, though. Why would you spend $600-900 for a Blu-Ray burner, plus spend the money on the blank discs themselves, which seem to go for about $20 each, when you could buy a $98 player instead? How does it make sense to spend that many extra hundreds of dollars simply to save an inch of shelf space? Sort of seems space conscious and pound foolish to me.

How you can be so absolutely certain of the outcome of a worldwide technological battle is beyond me. But you go right ahead. Hubris is an old word. Humans have probably exhibited it since the first caveman tried to light a fire using wet wood.

It's funny you mention Betamax. Back when, I recommended all of my family buy a Betamax because I was as certain as you are that Beta would win that technological battle. My family followed my advice and never let me forget it. I hope you don't have to eat the 20 years of crow I ate.

BetaMax was superior, so you were correct.

BluRay is winning the battle. HD-DVD is almost dead.

VHS players were $1000 in the beginning. Both BluRay and HD-DVD players have dropped to 1/2 what they were at launch. In 2008, BluRay players will be $200 and under.

Already the PlayStation 3, which is a 1080p BluRay player, is $299. Plus it plays videogames, has a hard drive, and acts as a Windows Media Connect server.

And any idiot who thinks I'm working for Sony: I'd rather buy an Xbox 360 because it has better and more games. ALSO, read all this and weep.

http://www.news.com/Forrester-Blu-ray-winning-drawn-out-format-war/2100-1041_3-5902753.html

http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=547

Here's an old article from April: http://www.t3.co.uk/news/247/entertainment/other/blu-ray_winning_the_format_war

BluRay has been clearly ahead since at least 2005.

http://www.engadgethd.com/2006/08/16/why-blu-ray-will-win/

http://news.digitaltrends.com/talkback67.html 2005 article

In August, BluRay was around 70% of the HD discs sold.

Now folks, this is nothing worth arguing about. BluRay wins, end of discussion.

 

[NCC621]

Some people are obviously partisan to one format or the other, but it seems to me that the format war is far from over.

I had been holding out for a hybrid player, but now with the prices on both formats dropping so much, I may simply get one of each. At minimum, I'm definitely picking up one of the cheap HD-DVD units (along with Star Trek TOS-R, of course).

 

[Matt]

What part of BluRay has overwhelming market share in US and UK isn't clear? LOL.

4 to 1 advantage in the UK.
70% of sales in the US.

It's over!

 

[Outpost4]

Matt, do you know that just this kind of in-your-face attitude caused avsforum.com to shut down all of their high definition DVD forums for today and at least tomorrow?

link

Your attitude is really harmful.

Not one person has said Blu-ray isn't an outstanding format. Not one person has said that Blu-ray couldn't win this war. Not one person has said a single disparaging word about Blu-ray. Only one person in this entire thread has dumped on any high definition DVD format. You. It is all coming from you. And it doesn't make you look very good.

This is no longer my thread. It's out of my hands. My initial point has been long lost. But if you can't remain civil, I am going to request the moderators close it down.

 

[guardian]

Outpost......

I absolutely agree, you couldn't be more right.

I happened to pick HD DVD because I could afford it now & it think it offers great picture and sound. I have nothing against blu-ray and I hope they both prosper--even though that seems unlikely.

I hoipe people who spent their money on blu-ray are 100% pleased with it.

This partisan in your face bullshit is completely immature and pointless. What will decide the format war is the sales--not pathetic boasting by folks of either format.

 

[Outpost4]

Me - I want to own both. I'll buy Matt's $200 Blu-ray player next year.

It's all Star Trek's fault. Even at $98, I wouldn't have bought the Toshiba HD-A2 player if the Season One discs weren't coming out on HD-DVD.

I'm blaming it all on Gene Roddenberry.

 

[guardian]

On the subject of the great deal and the upcoming TOS HD DVD release-----

My buddy reserved a HD A2 at a local electronics chain. He's had a HDTV for over a year. He went to pick it up and then i met him at his place to hook it up. He says to me, "I think I got the wrong model, we look at the box and its the HD A20 with 1080p
Then he plays his answering machine and the guy from the store says, "we're sorry but the A2 is sold out"

So they had sold him the A20 for the A2 sale price and not even known it!

I told him, "hell they told you they had the A2 in stock you drove 25 miles round trip and you've already opened it. If you return it, they're going to have to sell it as a discount 'open-box' item--just keep it."

I know that was bad, but they told him they were holding him an A2, so it was their fault on two accounts.

He had only decided to get a HiDef player when I told him about the upcoming HD DVD Trek release.

So the marketing of the TOS set has been efective in at least one case!

He the kind of guy with his whole apartment covered in Trek tie-ins and collectibles and he's going to have the box set front and center for quite a while I imagine.

 

[guardian]

Outpost4 said:
Me - I want to own both. I'll buy Matt's $200 Blu-ray player next year.

It's all Star Trek's fault. Even at $98, I wouldn't have bought the Toshiba HD-A2 player if the Season One discs weren't coming out on HD-DVD.

I'm blaming it all on Gene Roddenberry.

Yeah, I'm hoping blu-ray will hit $200 by XMAS 2009 so I can get my Fantastic Four, Spider-Man & X-Men in Hi-def. Luckily, my HDTV has two HDMI inputs!

 

[Mallory]

I would think that discussion of the current format war belongs elsewhere. This thread wasn't started with that debate in mind.

 

[Keith1701]

I still haven't decided as of yet.

 

[Matt]

Mallory said:
I would think that discussion of the current format war belongs elsewhere. This thread wasn't started with that debate in mind.

I was just pointing out the facts. You can have HD Star Trek right now, but the HD-DVD players will be like a Divx disc player in a few years. I'm just trying to save people some money.

But since they're so vehemently against BluRay, I suppose it's their loss in buying an HD-DVD player. I'd hate to lose money like that, and have people say, "I told you so!"

 

[Borjis]

Outpost Congrats on your A2 purchase, its a great machine.

I'm running an A1 myself on a 50" panasonic plasma.

 

[Outpost4]

I've got a plan to see if I can save $26 on this set. We'll see.

deepdiscount.com is having their 20% off sale right now. Their price for the Star Trek HD-DVDs is the same as everyone else's, $133. They don't allow 20% off on pre-orders but the sale supposedly runs through 11/25. The set is released on 11/20. I've cancelled my amazon.com order. On the 20th, I'm going to try ordering the discs through deepdiscount.

At the worst I'll just be delaying my ship date by a day or two and I'll pay the same price as I would for the pre-order. At the best I'll get the set for $107.

The only thing that sucks is you can now buy all three seasons of the regular DVDs for just $110.76 including shipping from deepdiscount. How many of us spent $100 per season for these when they came out?

 

[Turtletrekker]

23skidoo said:
Just remember that the HD-DVD version is a different show.

Steven Of Nine said:
How is it different, other than the effects?

It's not, except in the most meaningless and inconsequential of manner. The stories being told and the actors performances, which are the only things of any actual relevance or importance, are unaffected.

I wonder why music lovers don't raise a bigger stink about music companies putting music that was originally put on vinyl onto CD? Cleaning up imperfections in the sound? And, oh, the HORROR-- Bonus Tracks! That makes it a completely different record! It's an insult to the engineers who worked on the original album and the fans who enjoyed it! We should boycott!

 

[1100 Jason 1001]

Turtletrekker said:
It's not, except in the most meaningless and inconsequential of manner. The stories being told and the actors performances, which are the only things of any actual relevance or importance, are unaffected.

Some people consider the entire show to be relevant and important.

Turtletrekker said:
I wonder why music lovers don't raise a bigger stink about music companies putting music that was originally put on vinyl onto CD? Cleaning up imperfections in the sound? And, oh, the HORROR-- Bonus Tracks! That makes it a completely different record! It's an insult to the engineers who worked on the original album and the fans who enjoyed it! We should boycott!

You're comparing apples to oranges. What they've done to TOS is more like completely replacing entire instruments or vocals in old songs, changing the entire feel and character of the music. Some people might like the new versions. But many will miss the original versions, and wonder why they are not given the choice to experience the music as it was originally recorded.

It's baffling to me how certain people can't understand this, and act so dismissive and arrogant to those who would prefer high-def TOS to retain the original effects.

 

[DontFeedPhil]

Matt said:
Already the PlayStation 3, which is a 1080p BluRay player, is $299.

Really???
I think you got your numbers wrong. The cheapest you can get the low end PS3 is 399. And thats the cheap version.
If your that far off on your numbers I wonder how far off you are on the rest of your Sony Fanboy dream. Someone should have told Paramount they went exclusive with a dead technology...I bet theyre pissed...

 

[Turtletrekker]

1100 Jason 1001 said:

Turtletrekker said:
It's not, except in the most meaningless and inconsequential of manner. The stories being told and the actors performances, which are the only things of any actual relevance or importance, are unaffected.

Some people consider the entire show to be relevant and important.

Good for you, and more power to you. Good thing you have your DVD's. A good intelligent story well acted are the only things that are important to me. As long as that's the case, the actors can point their fingers at the bad guys and simulate the sound effects vocally for all I care about effects.

Turtletrekker said:
I wonder why music lovers don't raise a bigger stink about music companies putting music that was originally put on vinyl onto CD? Cleaning up imperfections in the sound? And, oh, the HORROR-- Bonus Tracks! That makes it a completely different record! It's an insult to the engineers who worked on the original album and the fans who enjoyed it! We should boycott!

You're comparing apples to oranges. What they've done to TOS is more like completely replacing entire instruments or vocals in old songs, changing the entire feel and character of the music. Some people might like the new versions. But many will miss the original versions, and wonder why they are not given the choice to experience the music as it was originally recorded.

Talk about an EXTREME exageration. "Replacing entire instruments or vocals"? Ridiculous, and hardly an apples and oranges comparison as both deal with digital re-mastering and the "alteration" of an original work of art.

It's baffling to me how certain people can't understand this, and act so dismissive and arrogant to those who would prefer high-def TOS to retain the original effects.

And what baffles me is how a vocal minority honestly can't comprehend that TOS would be laughed off the HD screen and disappear from TV sets forever without the re-mastering. And I say this as a fan of 40 years.

I have a friend at work who never watched TOS in his entire life because of what he considered laughable and embarrasing effects, but loves it now. I hadn't watched TOS on TV in over 15 years, ever since I taped the series, but I am now watching it again, despite having bought the DVD's. Neither one of us would be watching the originals on the tube before, but now we both are.

Bringing in new fans and bringing back old fans, that's what its all about. The people who protest and call for boycotts aren't the people who they are doing this for, as they probably wouldn't be watching anyway. Given the existence of DVD's, why should they bother with sitting through commercials and cut-up episodes that don't offer anything new?

I think it better for TOS, TOS fans, and the franchise as a whole to keep TOS out there in the public's eye where it can attract new viewers rather than let it die the slow death you seem to prefer.

Don't fear change, embrace it. It's just about the only thing you can count on.

 

[1100 Jason 1001]

DontFeedPhil said:
Really???
I think you got your numbers wrong. The cheapest you can get the low end PS3 is 399. And thats the cheap version.
If your that far off on your numbers I wonder how far off you are on the rest of your Sony Fanboy dream. Someone should have told Paramount they went exclusive with a dead technology...I bet theyre pissed...

Paramount didn't have to be told; they already knew full well, along with everyone else, that HD DVD was losing to Blu-ray. However, the $150 million Paramount received in the exclusivity deal outweighed any other concern. (It also helps that Paramount's current executive VP and CTO is a former Toshiba employee.)

If not for that gigantic payoff, Paramount would still be releasing on Blu-ray today, along with the majority of other major studios.

 

[1100 Jason 1001]

Turtletrekker said:
Good for you, and more power to you. Good thing you have your DVD's. A good intelligent story well acted are the only things that are important to me. As long as that's the case, the actors can point their fingers at the bad guys and simulate the sound effects vocally for all I care about effects.

You seem to contradict yourself here. You only care if the story is intelligent and well acted, and yet your dislike of the original effects prevented you from watching the show for 15 years?

And yes, I do have the DVDs, in standard definition. However, I would really love to have the show in high definition, with the option of the original effects.

Turtletrekker said:
Talk about an EXTREME exageration. "Replacing entire instruments or vocals"? Ridiculous, and hardly an apples and oranges comparison as both deal with digital re-mastering and the "alteration" of an original work of art.

Completely replacing whole effects shots with entirely brand new digital versions is not simple "remastering," and it is exactly like replacing old instruments with new ones in music. My comparison is straight-forward; yours is not.

Turtletrekker said:
And what baffles me is how a vocal minority honestly can't comprehend that TOS would be laughed off the HD screen and disappear from TV sets forever without the re-mastering. And I say this as a fan of 40 years.

What a bizarre, paranoid vision.

Turtletrekker said:
I have a friend at work who never watched TOS in his entire life because of what he considered laughable and embarrasing effects, but loves it now. I hadn't watched TOS on TV in over 15 years, ever since I taped the series, but I am now watching it again, despite having bought the DVD's. Neither one of us would be watching the originals on the tube before, but now we both are.

Good for you two, I guess. I can only imagine how many classic movies you must be missing out on because of your irrational attitude toward older special effects techniques.

Turtletrekker said:
Bringing in new fans and bringing back old fans, that's what its all about. The people who protest and call for boycotts aren't the people who they are doing this for, as they probably wouldn't be watching anyway. Given the existence of DVD's, why should they bother with sitting through commercials and cut-up episodes that don't offer anything new?

Why would I bother? To see the show in high definition, that's why. I enjoy the increased clarity and superior color reproduction that HD offers. That's what HD is all about. Shiny new digital effects are not a prerequisite for HD, as people like you seem to think.

Turtletrekker said:
I think it better for TOS, TOS fans, and the franchise as a whole to keep TOS out there in the public's eye where it can attract new viewers rather than let it die the slow death you seem to prefer.

I obviously don't want the show to die; on the contrary, I want it to be preserved. That's great if they want to offer a new version for those who are too immature and shallow to look past dated effects. But there's no excuse for them to banish the original version to oblivion. When new formats come along, the original versions of movies and TV shows should always be included, not thoughtlessly cast aside.