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i don't know how i feel about chakotay...

data_lover

data_lover

Lieutenant Commander
Red Shirt
so since im fairly new to voyager (i just started season 2 tonight) but so far im not digging chakotay. he's like a walking native american stereotype factory..."my people believe we can't own land!" "i must sing to the bones of my ancestors!" "let me introduce you to your spirit animal!" will he try to sell me a cigar next? cry about littering? yeah dude, we get it, you're american indian. now where is kim? he needs to feng shui my quarters and teach me to use chopsticks.
 
Re: Digging Chakotay. Excuse me while I sit in the "shallow" end of the pool, but I think it was season 2 when I discovered Chakotay had the most darling dimples... and I haven't lost sight of them since. ;-)

To be serious for a moment... I really liked the Chakotay:Seska dynamic that began in season 1. Loved loved loved its counterpoint with the Chakotay:B'Elanna dynamic. (You'll see what I mean later in season 2 in an ep called "Manuevers". "Don't tense up!")

I even loved the snarkiness of his relationship with Tuvok. Season 1's "State of Flux" is a good example of that. (" You were working for her {Janeway}. Seska was working for them {Cardassians}. Was anyone on board that ship working for me?")

Of course, there's another dynamic that began to emerge in season 2... one I never noticed until "Elogium". I think that might have been the time I noticed those aforementioned dimples.
 
Gotta agree with Guy Gardener on this one. He has a few decent episodes here and there, but otherwise, he's just a yes-man who you'd never know was a main if he didn't have his name in the opening credits.
 
I know how I feel about Chakotay.

He`s the main reason for me that Voyager became the Star Trek series I most like.

JanewayRulez! Agree, agree in all of your words.
 
Yes, frankly Chakotay never was a very good first officer--too passive, trying his best to stay in everyone's favor except Tuvok of course.

But then again the crew did not really need a First Officer--Janeway did both--most of the time anyway. Chakotay for me is more like Dianna Troi in a way--and that is exactly what the crew needed at the time.

You'll note throughout the series that there was indeed a lot of doubt, stress and uncertainty because of their situation and Janeway was not really fit, or inclined to look after the emotional aspect of the crew. She / they knew Chakotay to be someone they can rely on, not as outspoken as Troi was, but he always stood up to that role on the crew.
 
What we know from TNG: The first Officers Job is to manage he crew through the section heads of each department. The XO in conjunction with the councillor oversee set periodic promotions season(s)/crew evaluations. Will Looked after a thousand people while doing this.

What we know from TOS: Spock was able to be science officer and XO because he only had to look after 430 crew.

Chakotay has 1/4 the crew the original Enterprise had, BUT he still didn't see the need to wear a second hat on the bridge like Spock did because he sucks at multitasking.

It's not that Voyager doesn't need an XO, it's just that an XO on Voyager doesn't have enough work to on tap to justify full pay.
 
He grew on me.. but it was mostly me investing in the character and writing my own subtext. So I can't really argue with those that find him blah. Seska was a great story line, and a great character, but she did really show up Chakotay as the passive mark of a narcissistic climber. It was easy to see why Seska chose him.

Still, he IS hot.
 
I didn't care much for the character but, as has been mentioned, he wasn't especially annoying either (See: Neelix.) As it goes they trotted out the Native American bit whenever the plot of the episode called for it. (When they start using that rock of his to do weird things I knew that particular plot point had jumped the shark.)

As a massive "F-You" to the character, and apparently the actor who also thought it was BS, they did what they did in the final season. I mean... wtf man?


-Withers-​
 
Xatso said:
You'll note throughout the series that there was indeed a lot of doubt, stress and uncertainty because of their situation and Janeway was not really fit, or inclined to look after the emotional aspect of the crew. She / they knew Chakotay to be someone they can rely on, not as outspoken as Troi was, but he always stood up to that role on the crew.
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On the other hand Janeway has been referred to as "too mothering".

At any rate, it's the job of the first officer to handle personnel issues.
 
Like Norman Bate's mother before or after he killed her?

She mothered Harry, and she mothered Seven. The rest could burned and she wouldn't have noticed, which is how we eventually got such a good episode like Good Shepherd where she given clear room to note how magnificently negligent and disconnected to her tiny crew she was.

It's a hundred and 50 people in close quarters for seven years and she didn't know who Suder was (well, 2 years.) till he murdered someone, and what about the months leading up to Night when she just sat in her quarters rocking? Yes, entirely Batesian!
 
Chakotay in mind was a good character, if albeit woefully underdeveloped (well we never knew what tribe he was from).

IMO, he was the best XO. In all 5 series, period. The role of an XO in the armed forces is to be the right-hand man to the CO, and thus carry out orders, offer advice/counsel to the CO, and offer alternative courses of action. Essentially he/she would be the CO's assistant.

Riker may have been able to run the Enterprises D and E well, perform performance management duties, etc. but he seldom ever stood up to Picard. As he was the XO, it's his job to point out the CO when he/she is wrong. For me the Picard/Riker relationship was never a realistic one, there was too much respect and not much conflict. No human relationship is ever without conflict, in some form or another.

Chakotay stood up to Janeway, and pointed out when she was in error, and was never afraid to offer alternatives. Riker was simply a yes man, IMO.
 
IMO, he was the best XO. In all 5 series, period.
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That ranks up there with the statement "the characters were better developed on Voyager than on any other Trek" as ballsiest I've read to date. If we're going strictly be adherence to policy and protocol (as they would in the armed forces) Chakotay left Starfleet. He wouldn't even be a member had the circumstances not dictated that such be so. Had Janeway been a more seasoned Captain (even slightly more seasoned) I think he would have been practically worthless to her (more so than he already kind of was as was pointed out by others in this thread.)

Riker may have been able to run the Enterprises D and E well, perform performance management duties, etc. but he seldom ever stood up to Picard.
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I think for every example of Chakotay shouting in monotone (see: Equinox) there are two or three of Riker outright disagreeing with Picard and even going so far as saying so on the bridge.

Chakotay stood up to Janeway, and pointed out when she was in error, and was never afraid to offer alternatives. Riker was simply a yes man, IMO.
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Except that there are at least a few examples of him offering an alternative only to be turned down and then agree that his suggestion was a stupid idea (like his suggestion to break the crew up in the first part of YoH. He suggested it, was shot down by Janeway, and then agreed he never cared for it much either.) If your objection isn't legitimate whats the point of making it?


-Withers-​
 
Chakotay is series of might have beens. TPTB could have played the power on the bridge like this, Janeway could have been the scientist authority figure, Chakotay then could have been the spiritual insightful voice of experience.

If the show had been more of a balance between the many characters , instead of the Kathryn and Seven show, Chakotay would of had more quality screen time.

If the Marquis had been a on going separate group aboard the Voyager, Chakotay would have been shown in a decisive leadership role, keeping the Marquis in line as they continued not to assimilate even over the seven years of the series.
 
I'm also new, watching season 2 now, and lord, I can't stand him. Even Neelix is growing on me more.
 
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