Even I was kinda surprised by how bleak that was. And this was after seeing a brain-washed Bucky crush the skull of his war-time friend.
I do not like MCU films
- Thread starter Dales
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Even I was kinda surprised by how bleak that was. And this was after seeing a brain-washed Bucky crush the skull of his war-time friend.
The problem is that the WSC's act did not become a controversy in the movies to follow--even to those who were aware what happened (Fury, the Avengers, et al.). The films just move from one big stunt show to another with no consistency. The WSC should have been on the grill as much as the superheroes were in Civil War.
Villains cannot be ignored in favor of getting to the next episode of Power Rangers--Marvel Style. If the internal storylines are to be believed, major events cannot be swept aside. Without villains, heroes have no purpose. Basic storytelling.
The internal conflict did not last long. Stark was an ass, then let it all go with a simple message from Cap. The rest of the characters did not need to be involved at all, for all it did not matter to the Bucky story.
There's nothing wondrous about cartoon fights with flying robots, bad humor, a pointless, emotion-free death of Quicksilver and another big spectacle to end the film, and more Easter eggs about Infinity. AoU had no more substance or logic than a 1980s cartoon.
You're not making much of case.
Yup, pure light hearted fun!
Ah ...... OK I get that now.
Admittedly, people's major issues were not necessarily with Mark Miller's main run (although it wasn't exactly liked either, thanks to ooc moments, Miller's politics coming through, an anticlimax etc.) It was the tie-ins that seemed to induce the rage.
Particularly this one, whose end game was meant to be confirming that Cap was on the wrong side:
I personally don't know what people complained about, i think it aged rather well...
Thanks for explaining. I have to admit I've never really been into comics so thank you for explaining.
That's not even remotely true. Take a look into several of the discussions on this site alone that delved into Civil War, you'll see we all went round after round after round debating which side was in the right and many people where not at all willing to give Cap a pass just because Bucky was framed. Some of those were among the longest threads I've seen on this forum.
A terrorist attack to start the fun bucky chase and Tony flipping out in a fight where everyone is innocent and no one gets hurt. That's not deviating much from lighthearted territory.
I did read the response and even participated and it was nothing like the civil war comics - even on this forum. The few people talking about the accords had to read so far into so few scenes they were talking about stuff not present in the movie. Hardly any discussion on the side characters because none of them really did anything aside from Spiderman being funny and Ant Man being funny. It was a stretch for anyone to take sides between iron man and captain america when the entire conflict is a villain's plot. The comics were on a whole 'nother level. Not only could you take a side in the beginning, but their actions became debatable during the conflict as well.
In the previous movie one of their members/friends died (only because he is co-owned by Fox) and in TCW no one even mentions him! Not even his own SISTER! I guess they thought it would ruin the light-hearted fun.
Like I said, Hydra cover-up and the fact that if they did reveal everything about the WSC then it would also come out that SHIELD was working on the Phase 2 weaponry and Loki only came to Earth due to SHIELD experimenting on the Tesseract, etc. Too much ammo against everyone.
That's the excuse of every lazy writer everywhere. Villains are not the sole reason a hero exists. If Batman was written as less of an archetype then he'd have tons of internal conflict with Alfred, Lucius Fox and Gordon instead of all his stories really being about his villains.
We don't know how Tony feels yet.
There is no pleasing some people. In Iron Man 3, Thor 2 and Winter Soldier people complained the other Avengers should've been involved, now they ARE and the complaint is that they shouldn't have been involved?
The Bucky storyline tied to the Accords as it was the catalyst for the tensions to become something worse. The Accords weren't enough to make them really fight over anything.
Says you. I'll take any of that over pretentious "Crime Drama" stuff or anything else that creatively bankrupt "Grounded" aesthetic gives us.
Clint mentions that he came back to help Wanda because he 'owes' her, after Quicksilver died saving his life.
You know what major character death wasn't mentioned outright by their siblings in a follow-up movie? Loki's. Obviously they were trying to keep AoU more fun and light hearted than The Dark World.
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Clint mentions that he came back to help Wanda because he 'owes' her, after Quicksilver died saving his life.
You know what major character death wasn't mentioned outright by their siblings in a follow-up movie? Loki's. Obviously they were trying to keep AoU more fun and light hearted than The Dark World.
I think he just says he owes her. Nothing else. I was expecting someone to make one of those Marvel-style stupid jokes about QS' death.
You assumed he was referring to something else? Like Wanda passed him the ketchup one day, and Clint took it very seriously?
Wanda also had a bunch of family photos and childhood knick-knacks around her room. Of course, she never flat out identifies those people in the photos as her family, so I suppose she could have randomly stuck up photos of complete strangers.
Where are people getting the idea that Tony got over his hatred of Bucky? They explicitly say that Bucky has to stay in Wakanda because Tony and the authorities are still after him, Tony seemingly abandoned the other Avengers to prison, and he only (apparently) accepted Cap's offer to be an ally in a potential crisis.
In the end, the only friends and Avengers he had left were Vision and Rhodes. The latter having been paralysed because of Tony's decisions, and the former not looking all that happy with his choice of alignment. It's not 'Steve won the day, but when he wakes up everyone he loves is dead' levels of 'unhappy,' but it's hardly sunshine and roses.
Wanda also had a bunch of family photos and childhood knick-knacks around her room. Of course, she never flat out identifies those people in the photos as her family, so I suppose she could have randomly stuck up photos of complete strangers.
Where are people getting the idea that Tony got over his hatred of Bucky? They explicitly say that Bucky has to stay in Wakanda because Tony and the authorities are still after him, Tony seemingly abandoned the other Avengers to prison, and he only (apparently) accepted Cap's offer to be an ally in a potential crisis.
In the end, the only friends and Avengers he had left were Vision and Rhodes. The latter having been paralysed because of Tony's decisions, and the former not looking all that happy with his choice of alignment. It's not 'Steve won the day, but when he wakes up everyone he loves is dead' levels of 'unhappy,' but it's hardly sunshine and roses.
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Pretty much this. If I want deep, thought provoking, story lines, I'll read "Injustice" or watch "Daredevil."I love how "light-hearted fun" keeps getting trotted out (whether it is true or not) as though it is an insult.
The Marvel films have a variety of genre pieces that I can enjoy, my family can enjoy and are rewatchable. Being able to share them with my daughters, and then explore the different themes as dinner table discussion is something that I have enjoyed.
The idea that all the MCU are quippy and light hearted and decrying their lack of consequences seem to indicate that going in the opposite extreme is the way to go. I always thought that the MCU had its sober moments and could then move on.
I don't need the films to spoon feed me consequences or dark tales. I use films as the beginning of discussion not the final word.
Just trying to follow this guys and it sounds really interesting but one of the acronyms you use. WSC? What's that?
The salt actually. Like I said, I was at least expecting a name check. From Clint, or Vision, or… I don't know… his sister?
"Daredevil"! Now that's a great show! Maybe it's because it was created for/by Netflix and not Disney.
Why didn't Stark recruit Daredevil instead of a "twelve" year old kid is beyond me!
As somone who has dead family members, and doesn't necassarily bring them up in conversation an awful lot, may I ask why you'd expect his sister to just bring him up randomly?
It's not like any of the Avengers besides Wanda and Clint would have reason to be all particularly attached to Pietro. He was their ally for less than a day. They knew Galaga guy longer, and he never tried to kill them.
It's not like any of the Avengers besides Wanda and Clint would have reason to be all particularly attached to Pietro. He was their ally for less than a day. They knew Galaga guy longer, and he never tried to kill them.
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"Daredevil" is a great show and I thoroughly enjoy it. But, I won't watch it with my kids.
Because that would be spoonfeeding.