Guess it would he very difficult, especially if the Federation, the Klingons or Romulans know about the Dominion. But even if it would happen at a time before they knew about the Dominion, i can hardly imagine this to be a piece of cake...
How would the Dominion replace key persons from fortified worlds for changeling infiltration?
- Thread starter Unimatrix Q
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Well, they can change into anyone or anything. All they'd have to do is change into Chancellor Gowrons latest delivery from Amazon, and they'll be delivered right into his house.
LOL
But how would they transport a captured Gowron to the Gamma Quadrant without anyone finding out. Especially as the Dominion apparently don't uses cloaking devices...
Who's to say they wouldn't just kill him?
I know we saw prison camps, but those they abducted were probably more opportunistic than not.
I know we saw prison camps, but those they abducted were probably more opportunistic than not.
LOL
With that wonderful ultra-long-range transporter they've got.
Which never seemed to see any use outside "Covenant". One wonders if it ever existed: the Dominion could simply have used their cloakships for the purpose, doubly deceiving the Alphans about their capabilities.
The more paranoid the society, the easier the infiltration: become the Assistant Chief of Tal'Shiar, and you can order your body to be shipped to location X in a nondescript box and then have the delivery boy executed, his space van demolished, his company snuffed out, and his home planet sterilized. And then all health checks on yourself discontinued.
Timo Saloniemi
The more paranoid the society, the easier the infiltration: become the Assistant Chief of Tal'Shiar, and you can order your body to be shipped to location X in a nondescript box and then have the delivery boy executed, his space van demolished, his company snuffed out, and his home planet sterilized. And then all health checks on yourself discontinued.
Timo Saloniemi
Eris used the long-range transporter to leave the station at the end of "The Jem'Hadar."
If the Dominion had cloaking devices, they would have been using them a whole lot.
Cloaking is not a perfect technology. Even a cloaked ship leaves some traces that can be detected, just not as precisely as an uncloaked ship, and we never did with the Dominion.
If the Dominion had cloaks, why would we never have seen a cloaked Dominion ship decloak? It seems like you're reaching for a less probable explanation rather than the more probable one that they're using long range transporters when they say they are.
It would have been an interested plot twist for the Dominion to take apart all the cloaked Romulan and Cardassian ships that tried to obliterate the Great Link in "The Die Is Cast" and reverse-engineer the cloak... but as far as presented to us, they never did.
If the Dominion had cloaks, why would we never have seen a cloaked Dominion ship decloak? It seems like you're reaching for a less probable explanation rather than the more probable one that they're using long range transporters when they say they are.
It would have been an interested plot twist for the Dominion to take apart all the cloaked Romulan and Cardassian ships that tried to obliterate the Great Link in "The Die Is Cast" and reverse-engineer the cloak... but as far as presented to us, they never did.
In the episode "Covenant," it's obvious that the Dominion had set up a long-range transporter on Empok Nor. (Kira was kidnapped by Dukat using a Dominion transporter from there.) With all the ships that disappeared in the Gamma Quadrant, 1 of them was probably used by the Dominion to go to Empok Nor to set up the system in the first place.
No evidence whatsoever of a Dominion cloaking device. They went out of their way to use nebulae and other blind spots to launch surprise attacks. If anything, their own cloaks would probably be undermined by their aggressive use of antiproton sweeps. They detected and tracked down the Defiant in no time in "The Search."
No evidence whatsoever of a Dominion cloaking device. They went out of their way to use nebulae and other blind spots to launch surprise attacks. If anything, their own cloaks would probably be undermined by their aggressive use of antiproton sweeps. They detected and tracked down the Defiant in no time in "The Search."
Not sure what would be so hard about it, given that they can change into anything. So first they have to get into his private chambers and incapacitate him. That could be done by the Amazon delivery idea. Then one of the changelings (you need more than 1 for this to work) assumes the form of the key person, while the others get the drugged key person out in some inconspicuous form. (Say as cleaners with some container that hides the drugged person). Then assume the form of a tradesperson who can leave the world, and that way, obtain a small ship. Or, failing that, simply become such a standard ship (we know they can even morph into that, see Laas). If you get inspected, in the worst case hold the body in some transport buffer.
The fortified world would have to be pretty d*mn paranoid to do so many tests the changelings couldn't circumvent it. - for example required standard blood testing of all key persons every 6 hours. I don't think even the Romulans are that paranoid.
The fortified world would have to be pretty d*mn paranoid to do so many tests the changelings couldn't circumvent it. - for example required standard blood testing of all key persons every 6 hours. I don't think even the Romulans are that paranoid.
Thank goodness our writers didn’t fall into that easy trope of having changelings being able to absorb a person’s knowledge as well as mimic their appearance. Several dramatic moments came from Odo or a Founder lacking some critical piece of knowledge about the solid they were replacing.
Which just goes to show that their cloaks were better. Exactly like everything else they had was better. Not fantastically better - simply enough to trump whatever the Feds had.
Because they where not fools? If you operate an invisibility device, obviously you take care not to be seen.
I think the exact opposite.
1) Invisibility is actually a known and defining characteristic of the Jem'Hadar.
2) We never see them use long range transporters - and those are not invisibility devices!
3) We never hear them say they use long range transporters (only Worf says that, and no known events bear this out)
The original idea of Eris disappearing may have been that she committed suicide and the Dominion consists of scary fanatics; later we learn that not all Vorta are fanatics, but also that they are indeed supposed to commit suicide. In the end, we never find out the truth there, but long range transporters aren't a better solution there than regular transporting to a cloakship. And suicide is certainly still an option: the heroes think she will be back, but she won't.
If we want to believe Kira was abducted by the exact same means, though, then suicide is ruled out, but beaming to a nearby ship certainly isn't. It need not even be a cloaked ship, just some random freighter Dukat makes use of as the first link in his abduction chain. Say, that transport to Bajor the heroes speak about.
Characteristically, they considered themselves superior in every respect to the Alphans, at least when it came to technology. And events bore that out: they did have better weapons, better transporters (in terms of shield piercing), better sensors... It was the Alphans who were forced to capture and reverse-engineer to keep up.
Timo Saloniemi
I imagine it to be pretty easy actually, Odo sneaked into a cardassian ship by becoming a bag, a changeling could become a guard's hat or whatever and get in that way, then become part of the floor under the intended victim's bed. When they get them alone kill them, turn into a blender and flush the remains down the toilet or if it's a future toilet press the disintegrate button.
And perhaps they did. It wouldn't exactly be news that the Jem'Hadar can go invisible, now would it?
However, it is standard practice for the Jem'Hadar to fly visible, and fight visible. Any infiltration mission based on pretending to be the Jem'Hadar would have to take that into account. And any mission based on pretending to be a Founder and its retinue would have to involve lots of audacity and, well, visibility...
Timo Saloniemi
They'd waporize the target and then take their shape. Woila, replacement.
^Possibly, but the concern raised by arch101 is a valid one. If you replace, say, one of the highest members of the Romulan government, you also need to be able to play the part, i.e. have enough inside (secret) information to not make other members of the government suspicious about you. Obviously you gain that access the moment you assume that form, but you'll still need time to learn it, which you may not have anymore at that point. So probably before attempting to infiltrate on such a high level, you would have to infiltrate on a somewhat lower level first where less eyes are upon you, to get the information you require.
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