How Much of the Original Series Enterprise Is Left In the TMP era refit?

Discussion in 'Trek Tech' started by Samuel, Apr 25, 2018.

  1. Tenacity

    Tenacity Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Hard part of this question is that we never saw most of the TOS Enterprise's interior.

    So things like the big rec room (less windows).
    The big cargo bay could have been there in the TOS ship.
    Docking ports behind protective covers.
    Malnuvering thrusters, without the "look here I am" paint job.
    The "warp core" too, just never seen.
    The torpedo room could have been near identical, just moved to a new location.
     
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  2. Praetor

    Praetor Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Pressure compartments. The way I see it, they disassembled her into her individual components, then into her individual pressure compartments. Then they rebuilt each pressure compartment, and reassembled them more or less as before. Oingo boingo, new-ish starship.

    Now how much of each pressure compartment retained original materials? I plead the fifth. :rommie:
     
  3. uniderth

    uniderth Commodore Commodore

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    My personal theory is that some time after the end of season three the Enterprise had some incident where the secondary hull was destroyed and then replaced with the Phase II version. It was the Phase II version that got refit, not the original. This makes it much easier to reconcile the drastic changes.

    Also, if you blow up and replace the primary hull some time between WNMHGB and the start season one; then you can more easily reconcile Morrow's statement about the enterprise being twenty years old.
     
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  4. BillJ

    BillJ Canon Warrior Premium Member

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    Uhura's ear piece.

    EDIT: That joke was already used by @Bry_Sinclair. Guess I should've read the thread first!
     
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  5. Mytran

    Mytran Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Ooh I like that! Furthers my theory that the saucer was the most unaltered part of the refit :techman:
     
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  6. BillJ

    BillJ Canon Warrior Premium Member

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    I doubt there was much left. Maybe the computer core? Which would explain why they were still using schematics of the pre-refit.
     
  7. Kor

    Kor Admiral Admiral

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    It still had the bowling alley from TOS in its original technical configuration.

    Prove me wrong. :shrug:

    Kor
     
  8. Galileo7

    Galileo7 Commodore Commodore

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    Sadly, what was remaining of TOS 1701 that was actually used in the 1701-Refit reminds me of... :guffaw:



    I wonder if Starfleet ever considered recovering a piece of the 1701-Refit in SFS , so yet another "refit" could be built around that piece. Too late Planet Genesis destruction ended that option. ;)
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2018
  9. ItIsGreen

    ItIsGreen Captain Captain

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  10. yotsuya

    yotsuya Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I am a history buff and my love of ships extends both forward and back from here. The only time we see the structure of Star Trek ships is when they are destroyed. None more clear than the Enterprise herself in ST:III. From that I have extrapolated that Federation starships are built much like old wooden sailing ships. There is a frame and the hull plates are attached to that. What they did in the refit is to strip off all the hull plates and enlarge the frame making the saucer and secondary hulls larger. The saucer now has room for another ring of quarters, more room for stores. The secondary hull has more room for cargo. So at the core, the frames and decks would remain essentially unchanged while the interior would get a facelift (they did this to all of the pre-Nimitz class carriers and it extended to redoing all the of watertight doors so they opened down to the deck) and the engineering systems would be completely replaced. So the answer to what is left is most of the ship has not been replaced. The frame is intact except at the ends where it has been extended or cut to match the new hull shape. After more than 20 years of space travel, battles, damage, repairs, wear and tear, a new hull might be just what the old girl needed. The USS Constitution used to get a major overhaul about every 30 years. Now she gets them every 20.

    As for the pressure compartment idea... I see this working well with that because the pressure compartments don't have to be construction units. I think every room on a starship is its own pressure compartment and they join together to make sections of stronger integrity that are monitored. I think the refit would have necessitated reconfiguring the pressure compartments, especially in the secondary hull. Though we really never got to see much that can be confirmed to be down there except for the shuttle bay and the observation deck. I like to imagine that main engineering is down there, far enough in front of the pylons to allow for the arrival of Sarek and Amanda as seen in Journey to Babel to exit from the forward end of the hanger (the side makes no sense - the far wall is blank which is more in keeping with the clamshell doors than the either side of the hanger).

    And we are given the time frame of 18 months. Assuming that it takes a lot longer than that to build a ship (I put it at about 5 years based on a smaller ship and the Galaxy class taking 10 years), that means the refit was a very surface change - and changed the surface of the ship itself. Mostly cosmetic and drive train, while most of the ship remained as it was. And from Kirk's confusion finding his way, they did some reconfiguring of the interior spaces as part of it.
     
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  11. Praetor

    Praetor Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The timeframe issue is a very good point. The tech manuals suggest it takes quite a while to build a starship, yet the refit to make an "almost totally different Enterprise" somehow took place in eighteen months?

    Paint and upholstery only. :rommie:
     
  12. Samuel

    Samuel Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    One of the Lost Years novels, might've been Flag Full of Stars suggested that Starfleet really hauled ass in getting the Enterprise back into service due to escalating tensions with the Klingons. To this end they soft landed the saucer near Starfleet headquarters in order to perform a lot of the work in "shirt sleeve" conditions.
     
  13. F. King Daniel

    F. King Daniel Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    "This is an almost totally new Enterprise! You don't know her a tenth as well as I do." - Decker to Kirk.

    I guess maybe some superstructure remains, more or less, depending on whether she was upgraded from this:
    [​IMG]
    Or this:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    Or whatever you imagine.:shrug:
     
  14. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Admiral Admiral

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    Much of the R&D for the refit may have been done years earlier, and it was just a case of physically implementing them on the Enterprise after Kirk's mission. In such a scenario, the upgrade and redesign for the ship could have been in the works during TOS.
     
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  15. Tenacity

    Tenacity Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    R&D is probably a on-going process. At a certain point what was going to be installed in the refit was decided upon, but R&D continued unabated.

    By the time the Enterprise refit was ready to launch, some of it's new systems might have already been superseded.
     
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  16. Mytran

    Mytran Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Which would help explain why it became a training ship such a short time later; the Enterprise was a fabulous testbed and helped pave the way for the next generation of starships, but ultimately could never take her place among them :wah:
     
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  17. Forbin

    Forbin Admiral Admiral

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    Somewhat reflective of the Space Shuttle Enterprise. Tho she was intended to be fitted out as an operational spaceship, she was ultimately only used for atmospheric glide tests, and never achieved the adventure and glory of her sisters.
     
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  18. uniderth

    uniderth Commodore Commodore

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    Yet.

    Come on. I can dream can't I.
     
  19. XCV330

    XCV330 Premium Member

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    She could ride piggyback on that new SLS rocket. :D
     
  20. C.E. Evans

    C.E. Evans Admiral Admiral

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    That's the R&D period. What follows next is the testing of the new systems and design features to see if they actually work in the finished design. Otherwise, all designs undergo continual tweaks and improvements until they go out of production. The longevity of designs like the Miranda- and Excelsior-classes may be due to their ability to easily incorporate new systems and keep up with subsequent designs.