Ye, but Scotty is stubborn and he is Scottish, that's his character.
How do you feel about "Relics"?
- Thread starter Frontis
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I vaguely remember some fanon that suggested that warp speeds were heavily slowed down while in the gravity well of a star, so warp in the solar system would be super slow compared to what we normally see.
I've read a bit about the production of the episode, and that, coupled with other things I've read about Berman's opinion of TOS, has contributed to my current dislike of this episode. James Doohan is, as always, fantastic as Scotty, but he has little with which to work. While Moore says he came up with the idea that LaForge would be annoyed with Scotty and not know who he is, it seems to me this wasn't Moore's original idea.
It's been 80 or so years, but there's no way that Geordi, a huge engineering geek, wouldn't know who Montgomery Scott. Not to mention that Scotty, along with the rest of the 1701 command crew, took part in events that were far from ordinary and which shaped not only their era but the future as well. Mr. History Buff himself, Picard, would have also been thrilled to get to know Scotty. There's no way he wouldn't have held a dinner for him with the command crew and maybe even a Q&A with the crew somehow.
Granted, that's not exactly the most exciting material, but it could have happened along with the Dyson's sphere and the Jenolan being trapped. As with "Unification" and "Generations," the sense that Rick Berman neither knew or cared about TOS or its legacy is glaring here.
It's also Berman who shot down what Generations should have been by refusing to allow Nimoy to discuss script rewrites and direct the film. It makes zero sense that Generations wasn't "The Search For Kirk" with Spock, McCoy, AND Scotty alive in the 24th century. They should have been front and center in the 24th century portion and the entire command crew (including Sulu) could have been present on the Enterprise-B. This would have, of course, taken too much of the focus away from the TNG cast.
The third through seventh seasons of TNG continue to age poorly for me. The characters are so damned smug and arrogant and self-righteous and this colors how they interact with legends like Spock and Scotty.
It's been 80 or so years, but there's no way that Geordi, a huge engineering geek, wouldn't know who Montgomery Scott. Not to mention that Scotty, along with the rest of the 1701 command crew, took part in events that were far from ordinary and which shaped not only their era but the future as well. Mr. History Buff himself, Picard, would have also been thrilled to get to know Scotty. There's no way he wouldn't have held a dinner for him with the command crew and maybe even a Q&A with the crew somehow.
Granted, that's not exactly the most exciting material, but it could have happened along with the Dyson's sphere and the Jenolan being trapped. As with "Unification" and "Generations," the sense that Rick Berman neither knew or cared about TOS or its legacy is glaring here.
It's also Berman who shot down what Generations should have been by refusing to allow Nimoy to discuss script rewrites and direct the film. It makes zero sense that Generations wasn't "The Search For Kirk" with Spock, McCoy, AND Scotty alive in the 24th century. They should have been front and center in the 24th century portion and the entire command crew (including Sulu) could have been present on the Enterprise-B. This would have, of course, taken too much of the focus away from the TNG cast.
The third through seventh seasons of TNG continue to age poorly for me. The characters are so damned smug and arrogant and self-righteous and this colors how they interact with legends like Spock and Scotty.
Seconded, co-sponsoring every word. I could have written this, although not as elegantly.
The previous idea, is the only way that this isn't a tragic ending for Scotty, growing old and dying alone in the future. What about his sister and her family? Its not like he didn't have anyone. The rest of the bridge crew were still relatively young. They went the rest of their lives, thinking their dear friend Scotty was dead. Thats tragic for not just Scotty himself, but for Uhura, Chekov, etc, as well. Even Spock would have felt the loss immensely. This was not a very well thought out storyline IMO.
I couldn't agree more about TNG - I was recently reminded how much fun the first two seasons actually are, and all of the things I dislike about the later series are firmly in place by late Season 3. After the Best of Both Worlds (tv movie) it is nothing but downhill.
There is a chance he met up with McCoy I guess. And of course Spock.
He meets up with Kirk in the shatnerverse books but obviously not Canon.
He meets up with Kirk in the shatnerverse books but obviously not Canon.
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Now about the Scotty episode. I thought it was kinda corny but his chat with Geordi was nice. I think it was more about fun then the plot making sense and ST was always accused of using fake science anyway.
Do you mean 'Reunification.'? absolutely loved that Spock 2 parter. It was actually a good story and not just a glamorized cameo. And f@ck all with the quality. Aaand Spock met Data! To each their own.
Now about the Scotty episode. I thought it was kinda corny but his chat with Geordi was nice. I think it was more about fun then the plot making sense and ST was always accused of using fake science anyway.
Agreed on all accounts, especially in regards to Geordi.
These days I work entirely online as a teacher using Zoom. If some guy from 100 years ago turned up in my office and started to extol the virtues of a blackboard, chalk and corporal punishment… Then I’d most likely tell him to fuck off and let me get on with my job, just as LaForge does.
If Moore said he had the idea, why exactly should we doubt that? He’s certainly not shy about criticising his own work or the people he worked with at the time. If it was an idea that was forced upon him, I’m certain he’d have said so by now.
"Super slow" is still faster than light.
Let me tell you the Tragic Tale of Gillian of the Whales.
That's interesting in a way. Almost all of Scott's meddling is about what he sees as technically wrong. Which from an engineering point is stupid. "This doesn't work the same way anymore. It's been 70+ years." It's the part of the episode that rubs me the wrong way the most. Geordi behaves rationally and Scott does not. (I would have loved to have seen Scotty telling someone that it was all "just SPACE!")
Someone from 100 years ago or even 50 years ago would have a lot of culture shock today. It's kind of illuminating that Scotty doesn't have any. (If I'm not remembering those parts of the episode then endless apologies.) Because as far as TNG was concerned Star Trek was always just Star Trek.
Yeah but Scotty was well used to being catapulted into the strange and new.Culture shock was less a factor than a feeling of being old and past it.Remember the guy had been on his way to a retirement colony so probably wasn’t in the best of form anyway.
To be superseded once is bad enough but to then be removed even further into the future must have been devastating.
I cannot remember if he had a scene with Troi...ironically a scene in which her counselling skills would be appropriate.
To be superseded once is bad enough but to then be removed even further into the future must have been devastating.
I cannot remember if he had a scene with Troi...ironically a scene in which her counselling skills would be appropriate.
Unless it was Picard they actively avoided that sort of thing.
there was a scene either written or filmed, it's in the novelization.
"Never get drunk unless you're willing to pay for it the next day" was his best line in this episode.
Keep your "Needs of the whoever outweighs" fiddle faddle. THIS is wisdom.
My only real beef with this episode was that it treated the exchange between Scotty and Kirk in TSFS as if it were a serious thing and not a joke between colleagues and friends. In TSFS, Scotty and Kirk were clearly having fun with one another. But "Relics" makes it sound like Scotty really does routinely lie about his repair estimates and is shocked that LaForge doesn't as well. It just doesn't track with Scotty's actual character.
Come to think of it, I'm also not much for the ending. The idea that Scotty just gets handed a shuttlecraft and then goes off to wander the galaxy aimlessly just doesn't hit me right either.
I don't know. I love Ron Moore. And I know he's a huge TOS fan. But it just didn't seem like he really understood Scotty when writing this episode.
Come to think of it, I'm also not much for the ending. The idea that Scotty just gets handed a shuttlecraft and then goes off to wander the galaxy aimlessly just doesn't hit me right either.
I don't know. I love Ron Moore. And I know he's a huge TOS fan. But it just didn't seem like he really understood Scotty when writing this episode.
Man, this is so true.
Scott had been a cartoon since 3, certainly 4. So it would have been hard to buck that trend.
He was so freaking COOL in TMP. Almost as cool as Jimmy Doohan.
I don't know. Certainly in TFF Scotty was turned into a cartoonish character for comedy. But I think in TVH, he was shown to be a valuable and important part of the team. The supporting characters all actually had much more to do in TVH than they usually do, Scotty included. Unlike TFF, I felt like the humor came from the situations and not from laughing at the characters.
I always wanted Scotty and his shuttlecraft to show up at deep space nine....
That would have been a really interesting place for him to set up residence to be honest.
He'd have fit right in! O'Brien would probably have worshipped him and the two would become fast friends. I can see them drinking with Bashir in Quark's quite often. It would have also been something to see Scotty and Worf reunited...they didn't quite hit it off in "Relics" after all.
Speaking of DS9 they seemed to be in awe of the TOS crew where TNG were like whatever with Spock, Kirk and Scotty. Jadzia was completely starstruck with the crew especially Kirk. At least Jadzia anyway. But they at least seemed to know who they were. TNG knew of Spock because he was teaching younger Romulans about Vulcan morals and culture. They seemed standoffish with the exception of Data who can't be. It was far better and respectful story than Scotty got despite because he wasn't made fun of it was simply the air that they had in 'Reunification'. Spock even referred to Picards "cowboy diplomacy" and compared him to Kirk which I always thought they were opposites to most. Again. I don't need any ass kissing the semi-butting of heads in 'Reunification' was interesting and it didn't seem to be done for the sake of snobbery but for the story. Those are my feelings any way.
Now about Geordi and Scotty in Engineering I didn't get the impression that he was trying to take over he was more like "Ok, what are we doing here now." They had a nice little discussion in Ten Forward. But maybe my mind is misremembering.
Now about Geordi and Scotty in Engineering I didn't get the impression that he was trying to take over he was more like "Ok, what are we doing here now." They had a nice little discussion in Ten Forward. But maybe my mind is misremembering.
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