How do Admirals and Starships work in Starfleet

[Luckyflux]

Just been curious about the rank of Admiral and how it pertains to Starships. Presumably a person is a Captain before they are an Admiral. As a Captain, they have command of a vessel. But then after promotion you lose the Command of the ship and take a desk job.

But Admiral Riker had his own Starship (I know Admiral Riker was from an alternate timeline).

Do Admirals get their own Starship? When they travel, do they "fly" the ship as in are they the Commanding Officer, or are they like a VIP, but have no Command rank on the ship?

If an Admiral is in command aboard their own vessel and they encounter the Enterprise-D....who is in charge Picard or the Admiral? Does it depend on the mission?

If an Admiral does get their own ship, how do they choose it? It's not like they just roll ships off the production line in Detroit, surely there are a limited supply of ships, so how does an Admiral get a ship, if they are not part of a fleet or battle group or exploratory expedition?

Can an Admiral just take any old ship to shuttle his Orion Slave Girls back and forth while Mrs Admiral is "out the airlock"?

 

[Hartzilla2007]

If an Admiral is in command aboard their own vessel and they encounter the Enterprise-D....who is in charge Picard or the Admiral? Does it depend on the mission?

The Admiral becuase Picard is a Captain.

 

[CorporalClegg]

I would assume it similar to the modern military.

A captain is in command of his ship. A Flag officer can, for instances, tell him where to go, but he decides how to get there. (In a nutshell.)

Now, a Flag does have the ability to take direct command of a ship, but that's pretty much reserved for special situations as it tends to promote distention and poor morale.

It's sort of like a film set. The Exec producer can set guidelines for what should be done, how things are run, what should and shouldn't be in the film, etc, but in the end, it's still the director's film.

 

[captcalhoun]

Riker had command of the E-D in AGT because it was his flagship. as in the old sense of the term, whereby flag officers had ship that flew their flag in battle as they commanded the fleet.

Riker picked the E-D as his flagship for sentimental reasons and to prevent it being mothballed.

if an admiral and picard met on equal vessels, the admiral would assume command. if they met and the admiral was on a smaller, less powerful vessel, say a Nova, the admiral would 'transfer his flag' to Picard's more powerful ship and assume mission command aboard the Enterprise. Pressman was MC in 'Pegasus', while Picard retained command of the ship.

 

[Luckyflux]

^ In the case of Admiral Riker, I understand that he took the Ent-D because it was to be decommissioned. If that were not the case, and the Ent-D was to stay as a Starfleet vessel, would he still get to pick that particular ship for his own ship? Or would he have to choose "off the lot" of available ships that are scheduled to be decommissioned but have not yet?

In the case of Pressman, he was Admiral yet did not have his own vessel. Why is that? Do all Admirals get to choose their own ship (as did Ad Riker)? Or don't they get a ship? That blonde, bitchy Admiral (Neycheav spelling?), she didn't have her own vessel?

I am wondering is Armiral Riker the only Admiral that has command of his/her own ship? And that was an Alternate Future. Actually speaking of Alternate Universes, wasn't Admiral Picard in command of a Starfleet ship in Barash's made up universe?

I am thinking that Admirals don't get their own ship and Admiral Riker was an Alternate Universe exception.

 

[USS Excelsior]

Or that the Enterprise-D wasn't currently on a mission with it's own Captain and it was available to venture out on one of the Admiral's missions.

 

[EmperorTiberius]

The one from Insurrection didn't have his own ship either. They seem to move around on whatever ship is available, like a VIP, but they still have command of the mission.

 

[Sci]

If the Federation Starfleet is anything like modern navies, an admiral can plant his flag on any ship he wants so long as he's not on permanent assignment as C.O. of a specific installation.

 

[Timo]

Indeed, the exact wording in "AGT.." is this:

Riker: "They tried to decommission her about five years ago. One of the advantages of being an Admiral is you get to choose your own ship."

This should probably be read as meaning that Riker can go and pick a ship, any ship, and make use of her; then return, and later go pick another ship, any ship, and make use of her as well. There won't be any single starship assigned to Riker at any time.

So, Riker listened to Picard's rantings and ravings, turned him down, then heard he'd gone to the RNZ in a medical ship, got worried, and told his underlings he needed a ship ASAP. He got the Enterprise, either because he was fond of her, or because she was especially available to him - but he could also have gotten the Concord or the Insufferable if he so wanted.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Luckyflux]

Timo, is that how it works then? Admirals don't get assigned a ship nor do they get a ship as their own. But if they need a ship, they can obtain almost any vessel and assume the Mission Command (but not ship command)?

So no ships for Admirals? That sux....

 

[Kaziarl]

Timo, is that how it works then? Admirals don't get assigned a ship nor do they get a ship as their own. But if they need a ship, they can obtain almost any vessel and assume the Mission Command (but not ship command)?

So no ships for Admirals? That sux....

Well, Kirk did warn Picard to not let them promote him, transfer him, or anything that would take him "Off the bridge of that ship." so it seems to be the case that they don't get command of the ship itself.

My guess is for day to day business as usual stuff, the Captain calls the shots. But in situations that call for it, the admiral can take charge.

 

[EmperorTiberius]

Timo, is that how it works then? Admirals don't get assigned a ship nor do they get a ship as their own. But if they need a ship, they can obtain almost any vessel and assume the Mission Command (but not ship command)?

So no ships for Admirals? That sux....

It certainly sux, but that's how it seems to work most of the time. When you think about it, an admiral would spend most of the time attending meetings in person and through subspace, studying the strategic and operational situations, directing starships, and receiving briefings from them, and deciding what to do next. Why would you waste a perfectly good starship and have it sit at the starbase, when you can have it our on different missions?

There have been occasions when admirals did seem to be in command though:
The one in BOTW was battling Borg from his chair, Riker had E-D, and even Ross seemed to be in command in the Captain's ready room in Inter Arma..

 

[J.T.B.]

Timo, is that how it works then? Admirals don't get assigned a ship nor do they get a ship as their own. But if they need a ship, they can obtain almost any vessel and assume the Mission Command (but not ship command)?

So no ships for Admirals? That sux....

The naval practice has been pretty much the same for a couple of hundred years, and I'd imagine Starfleet wouldn't be much different.

An admiral has a specific job. It might be an administrative or staff job, it might be command of a major installation, or it might be command of a group of operating vessels. If the admiral's assignment includes commanding at sea, he/she will set up "headquarters" in one of the vessels under his/her command. It is usually the biggest or one of the biggest, because the admiral and staff need extra office and living space, but the admiral has some discretion in choosing the flagship. In World War II Admiral Spruance liked to use the old cruiser Indianapolis for his flagship so he could move around the area freely without taking a more important ship like a carrier or a battleship that might be needed more where it was.

Aboard the flagship, the relationship of the admiral to the captain is supposed to be the same as that with the other ship captains under the admiral's command. That is, the admiral can tell the captain what to do with the ship but generally not how to do it, and doesn't interfere with how the captain runs his vessel. Of course some admirals do interfere a little and there's not much the captain can do about it.

--Justin

 

[Rulius]

Not all Captains would be in command of a ship; paper-pusher types wouldn't.. look at whats -his-name..Commodore Stocker; useless on a ship.

 

[Anwar]

Riker was the Admiral in charge of a Starbase in the AGT future. Presumably said Starbase would have it's own vessels docked there with the Captains taking orders from him, one of which vessels would be his personal flagship for when he wanted to go out on his own.

 

[Star Wolf]

Timo, is that how it works then? Admirals don't get assigned a ship nor do they get a ship as their own. But if they need a ship, they can obtain almost any vessel and assume the Mission Command (but not ship command)?

So no ships for Admirals? That sux....

It certainly sux, but that's how it seems to work most of the time. When you think about it, an admiral would spend most of the time attending meetings in person and through subspace, studying the strategic and operational situations, directing starships, and receiving briefings from them, and deciding what to do next. Why would you waste a perfectly good starship and have it sit at the starbase, when you can have it our on different missions?

There have been occasions when admirals did seem to be in command though:
The one in BOTW was battling Borg from his chair, Riker had E-D, and even Ross seemed to be in command in the Captain's ready room in Inter Arma..

And to throw a monkey wrench into things Voyage to The Bottom Of The Sea, the admiral seemed to be in command if memory serves. Or Sink The Bismark as soon as Prince Eugen was detached there was no more admiral work for the admiral and he was making tactical decisions for Bismark

 

[Cr031k]

Admirals In command..... Umm.... Have any of you kids even seen Star trek TMP to Voyage home???


Just curious.

Kinda answers it for ya.

 

[Sci]

Admirals In command..... Umm.... Have any of you kids even seen Star trek TMP to Voyage home???

I don't know, cadet. Have we?

TMP to TVH establish primarily that Gene Roddenberry and the Trek writers didn't know how real admirals operate.

 

[Cr031k]

Admirals In command..... Umm.... Have any of you kids even seen Star trek TMP to Voyage home???

I don't know, cadet. Have we?

TMP to TVH establish primarily that Gene Roddenberry and the Trek writers didn't know how real admirals operate.

Yes Vice Admiral, However......Still Canon. Everyone seems to be focused on Next Gen Admirals but the question was not just 24th century Admirals.

How do real fictional admirals operate in fictional canon Vice Admiral? Not knowing what G.R. or trek writers were doing is a matter of your opinion, not established fact.

 

[Sci]

Admirals In command..... Umm.... Have any of you kids even seen Star trek TMP to Voyage home???

I don't know, cadet. Have we?

TMP to TVH establish primarily that Gene Roddenberry and the Trek writers didn't know how real admirals operate.

Yes Vice Admiral, However......Still Canon. Everyone seems to be focused on Next Gen Admirals but the question was not just 24th century Admirals.

How do real admirals operate Vice Admiral?

Several posters have talked about how real admirals operate in this thread.

And you'd do well not to call people who have been posting here much longer than you have "you kids."