That's the part I hate.
How difficult SHOULD it be to steal a starship?
- Thread starter Angry Fanboy
- Start date
Ok...I'm sorry to hear that.
Well, I'd say it should be at least as hard as stealing a navy vessel of the US navy , 2020. Harder probably, because of superior surveillance and protective technology.
Of course, for storytelling reasons the answer would roll out differently.
Of course, for storytelling reasons the answer would roll out differently.
In The Search Of Spock, Kirk managed to steal the Enterprise. But for any non-Starfleet person it should be impossible.
Starfleet laziness. The voiceprints and access of Kirk's crew should have been deleted and changed the moment they walked off the ship. Though IT Security is a bit different now than it was in 1983.
Nah, Scotty was secretly doing some work behind the scenes to ready the ship for takeover. I never got the impression that they simply walked onto the Enterprise and waltzed off with her straightaway
To some extent I don't mind crewmembers who have served aboard a ship for twenty-something years and know it inside out being able to steal it. But not randoms who have never set foot onboard.
Yup. The moment they were retiring the Enterprise all security codes should have been transferred to Morrow's command, and his crew, and Kirk's rescinded.
Yeah but Morrow is the guy who couldn't even count to 40 so he probably set all the passwords to "1234" or something
It's so obvious it's impossible to guess!Yeah but Morrow is the guy who couldn't even count to 40 so he probably set all the passwords to "1234" or something
Happened on DS9 with a rogue Cardassian program - but that was an outlier rather than the rule.
At any rate, the automated security precautions mentioned should operate fully and the crew would know of a way to manually disable them if such a scenario (where the ship doesn't recognize the crew) occurred.
But to be fair, we've seen Federation ships employing automatic scanning for intruders before and automatically raising forcefields to contain them.
So, Discovery shouldn't have been taken as easily as it was (despite Tilly's lack of experience).
We've seen the writers progressively stopped paying attention to those technologies though... so its a matter of writer oversight (much like everything else) - which also paints Starfleet as excessively incompetent (which we know doesn't really make much sense).
Pure and simple: this is a good example of writer laziness and their inability to write stories with the setting of their own creation.... resulting in dumbing down of the technology in the show for the purpose of drama and nothing else.
That's a general Hollywood issue.
^And a general Star Trek one, as well.
Everyone will always have their own preferences but personally I can way more easily buy the idea that the Emerald Chain might have some supertech that lets them get around basic security measures which they've been keeping secret from the Federation than I will ever be able to reconcile with the blatant incompetence displayed over and over again by the TOS security dept. Especially the part where random visitors are deliberately given access to all ship-related schematics/information as a form of entertainment.
And let's not even talk about the Abrams trek idea of a 'security' regulation which says that in the event of a terrorist attack anywhere in the sol system, starfleet is required to gather ALL starship captains AND their first officers in a single room (and it's always the same room and seems to have no special security precautions of any kind).
Everyone will always have their own preferences but personally I can way more easily buy the idea that the Emerald Chain might have some supertech that lets them get around basic security measures which they've been keeping secret from the Federation than I will ever be able to reconcile with the blatant incompetence displayed over and over again by the TOS security dept. Especially the part where random visitors are deliberately given access to all ship-related schematics/information as a form of entertainment.
And let's not even talk about the Abrams trek idea of a 'security' regulation which says that in the event of a terrorist attack anywhere in the sol system, starfleet is required to gather ALL starship captains AND their first officers in a single room (and it's always the same room and seems to have no special security precautions of any kind).
Khan managed to hijack the Vengeance in Into Darkness, probably because Marcus didn't erase his voice. Specificly for such a powerful warship security should be enormous, but it wasn't...
They just need to use passwords that no alien would ever think of. "b00bz" or "thefonz" or whatever.
Yup.
At this point in time it is a basic Hollywood conceit that security will only work if the plot allows it too. The idea that the Emerald Chain would be able to time their attack to get inside the Discovery through their own tech know how.
Khan had inside information. Something that Trek has used again and again to get around insurmountable security (looks at Voyager).
Or then not so secret - it's just that our barbarian heroes would not have been able to wrap their minds around the tactical implications of personal transporters yet, despite crash courses and whatnot. Their ship may well have the latest in countermeasures, perfectly adequate against EC boarding attempts, but they're simply too stupid to make proper use of those, especially in non-optimal circumstances such as the aftermath of a mini-Burn.
We're not sure whether that happened even once: Khan got "technical manuals", but given his genius, he may have been given the redacted version safe for public consumption - and then used that in order to hack into the secret data.
Where do you get any of that?
- Nobody suggests everybody important in Sol would be in that room
- Nobody suggests it would be the same room every time
- Nobody suggests there would be no precautions
- The man summoning the meeting was apparently also the man behind the attack, Godfather III style, so he could hand-pick the people he wanted dead (Pike first and foremost, to motivate Kirk), and the level of precautions that Harrison could plausibly defeat without making Marcus look suspiciously careless
In any case, that's what you do ITRW, too: you do gather relevant folks to contemplate action. It would be pretty absurd to think that anybody could strike at such a meeting just because somebody has struck elsewhere. And the folks being summoned by Marcus would have little idea of the nature of the installation Harrison had blown up, and would be thinking in terms of generic terrorism against London, or perhaps terrorism targeting the Kelvin Memorial - not in terms of Starfleet Intelligence superagents performing inside jobs against Starfleet's Most Protected.
Timo Saloniemi
From TNG "The High Ground" [http://www.chakoteya.net/NextGen/160.htm]:
Some of the supposedly infallible defenses presented upthread were thought of and refuted.
WORF: Intruders in Engineering
DATA: Casualties reported on deck twelve. Sickbay responding.
PICARD: Seal off all decks. Lock on transporters to the intruder signals.
CREWMAN [OC]: Intruder signals unstable, Captain, I cannot lock on.
DATA: They are moving inter-dimensionally. Neither transporters nor forcefields will contain them, sir.
DATA: Casualties reported on deck twelve. Sickbay responding.
PICARD: Seal off all decks. Lock on transporters to the intruder signals.
CREWMAN [OC]: Intruder signals unstable, Captain, I cannot lock on.
DATA: They are moving inter-dimensionally. Neither transporters nor forcefields will contain them, sir.
Some of the supposedly infallible defenses presented upthread were thought of and refuted.
That's a perfectly fine fan invention to justify it.
"Sir, in event of an attack, protocol mandates that senior commands gather, Captains and first Officers, at Starfleet HQ, right here…in this room."
I never said 'everybody important', I said Captains and First officers which is what the movie says.
We see no precautions at the door and get no hint of there being so much as even serious air defence outside.
But there's no logical reason for a terrorist threat to require input from all the starship captains in system - some of them maybe, but the main people in that room should be admirals and earth security services/starfleet security officers. Adding in first officers makes it completely ridiculous because if there's an actual threat, there's no reason to in any way risk making ships face it with both their command officers out of commission, even if the meeting is expected to be low risk/secure. Anything the first officers can contribute/need to know, the captains can contribute/pass along. And on top of all that, it shouldn't be necessary to put everyone in one room to begin with. We've seen tons of important meetings done over communications systems before.
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