Not specifically, but an Enterprise mini-arc did show that the Romulans can operate ships out near human/Vulcan/Andorian space by telepresence from way back on Romulus. They needed some weird special Andorian to do it, but if the basics are there they might've adapted it to work with less specific controllers.
How did Kirk know they were Romulans?
- Thread starter Anticitizen
- Start date
sorry if this has been mentioned before but while what the crew is hearing what the universal translator is giving them i am sure copies of the original broadcast is kept for analysis and review.
it would make sense as the crew abandons ship they take these along with the logs as to keep a record of what happened.
it wouldnt take long for what happened with the kelvin to be connected to the romulans.
really i suspect a real interesting story would be the communication between the empire and the federation after the kelvin incident.
from the dialog with the commander and the centurion the empire was busy fighting other wars during the period prior to balance of terror.
so they might not have been in position to deal with a war with the federation plus being puzzled as hell by the reports they would have gotten about the whole thing.
it would make sense as the crew abandons ship they take these along with the logs as to keep a record of what happened.
it wouldnt take long for what happened with the kelvin to be connected to the romulans.
really i suspect a real interesting story would be the communication between the empire and the federation after the kelvin incident.
from the dialog with the commander and the centurion the empire was busy fighting other wars during the period prior to balance of terror.
so they might not have been in position to deal with a war with the federation plus being puzzled as hell by the reports they would have gotten about the whole thing.
You see, Anticitizen? This is exactly the type of question I would I have expected someone who had ever seen the Original Series, who had read the script prior to production, would ask. Then and there, there would have to be some sort of discussion: Do we really want to pretend that one of the best stories in the Original Series, and one of the foundations for every legitimate TOS story that came afterward, never existed?
Now, it's not as though this hasn't happened before. The series Enterprise apparently ran into or avoided the same issue about a third of the way through its existence, and came to the same sorry decision.
Granted, there's a great deal of TOS that it's probably necessary for us to forget ever happened (Catspaw, Plato's Stepchildren, Spock's Brain) just so we can get up in the morning. But Ptrope's explanation points to the Trek XI writers either summarily dismissing or being blissfully ignorant of one of the foundation elements of our whole story, part of what made Trek great to begin with: the awe of the revelation, a century after we had a war with these guys, that Romulans were an offshoot of Vulcans. If that's by choice, it's a lousy choice; if that's by accident, then in what universe do these writers live where "Balance of Terror" doesn't exist?
DF "Next Time, If We Need Your Help, We'll Ask For It, Vulcan" Scott
Now, it's not as though this hasn't happened before. The series Enterprise apparently ran into or avoided the same issue about a third of the way through its existence, and came to the same sorry decision.
Granted, there's a great deal of TOS that it's probably necessary for us to forget ever happened (Catspaw, Plato's Stepchildren, Spock's Brain) just so we can get up in the morning. But Ptrope's explanation points to the Trek XI writers either summarily dismissing or being blissfully ignorant of one of the foundation elements of our whole story, part of what made Trek great to begin with: the awe of the revelation, a century after we had a war with these guys, that Romulans were an offshoot of Vulcans. If that's by choice, it's a lousy choice; if that's by accident, then in what universe do these writers live where "Balance of Terror" doesn't exist?
DF "Next Time, If We Need Your Help, We'll Ask For It, Vulcan" Scott
IT was 47 ships, another send up to the fans.
(bolding by me)
While I did enjoy the movie (twice) and didn't much mind all of the changes to the timeline, etc., I actually found Kirk's realization that it was a trap to be the biggest glaring plot hole in the entire movie.
He may have put two and two together, but I suggest he only had one of those twos to work with.
The sensor reading that came back that Kirk heard was about a "lightning storm in space", previously described 25 years prior by the Kelvin as a description of the red matter black hole they found Nero's ship emerging from.
However, there was no black hole created at Vulcan until after Enterprise arrived, after the fight on the mining rig, and after Nero dropped the red matter into Vulcan's core.
Chekov's ship-wide announcement and his line describing a lightning storm in space, the pivotal line of dialog that Kirk used to add two and two together, should not have even happened, because at that point in the movie, the only possible information, even if communications was crystal clear, was that there was a big ship shooting a mining beam into the planet. There was no black hole yet to create the "lightning storm in space" effect which Chekov announced, Kirk heard, and put two and two together with.
George Kirk somehow knows that in the novel.
Enterprise made a fair effort to comply with the canon. There was an issue with the cloaking device, but they found a way to avoid meeting the Romulans face to face.
No, Chekov was talking about the incident from the night before, where Nero captured Ambassador Spock at the spatial anomaly near the Neutral Zone, and attacked the Klingon ships near a prison planet. Kirk realized that the four incidents were connected, and that if the Romulan ship was back after 25 years, and Vulcan was under attack 12 hours later, there's probably a logical connection.
As to how they knew the Narada was a Romulan ship, maybe Romulans are the only race in the Galaxy that uses green torpedos. Captain Archer knew that 100 years earlier.
Besides which, this movie takes place in the post-"Enterprise," post-"Star Trek: First Contact" alternate timeline. It would not resemble the original pre-TOS timeline, even if Nero and Spock were not in it. All the changes to the timeline made by the Borg, the Sphere-Builders, FutureGuy and Daniels may have led to earlier contact with the Romulans.
After all, the very first episode of "Enterprise" already showed that time travel resulted in humans meeting Klingons earlier than in the original TOS timeline. Obviously, meeting Romulans 100 years earlier would not be much of a stretch, considering all the other changes made to the timeline during the course of "Enterprise."
It's a stretch but...
If the original comm officer onboard the Enterprise cannot distinguish between the Romulan and Vulcan languages and has to be relieved by Uhura (giggity!), and if prior to the Kelvin incident Starfleet really had had no visual contact with the Romulans to know that they looked like Vulcans, then perhaps some enterprising linguist compared the two languages and noticed the striking similiarities between the two and surmised that, at least culturally, they were related...who knows, maybe during the Earth-Romulan War, Hoshi checked out some audio samples recorded during battle and created a lexicon that Uhura would one day go on to study...
Again, a stretch, but I like EnsignRicky's explanation better
If the original comm officer onboard the Enterprise cannot distinguish between the Romulan and Vulcan languages and has to be relieved by Uhura (giggity!), and if prior to the Kelvin incident Starfleet really had had no visual contact with the Romulans to know that they looked like Vulcans, then perhaps some enterprising linguist compared the two languages and noticed the striking similiarities between the two and surmised that, at least culturally, they were related...who knows, maybe during the Earth-Romulan War, Hoshi checked out some audio samples recorded during battle and created a lexicon that Uhura would one day go on to study...
Again, a stretch, but I like EnsignRicky's explanation better
I wasn't paying attention then. I better watch it a third time, then
It was kind of hard, given that Chekov's thick accent was distracting from what he was saying -- in any case -- no plot hole - false alarm .. thanks.
see what i said above.
someone either in the kelvin crew or someone who later was going through her rescued logs , communications probably made the connection between the commication from the narada and the tranmssions they had from the romulan war.
and yeah ..
chekov was reporting a lighting storm which is when prime spock came from the singularity and is captured by nero.
we indeed see it later when prime spock describes it.
what uhura had previously heard was the destruction of the klingon ships.
Yeah, I'm thinking Kirk read the dissertation obsessively while he was a cadet in order to find out as much about his father as he could.
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