Homeward opinions

[Renvar]

In the episode Homeward, d'you think Picard made the right call with the Boralans? After Nikolai abducted the villagers from the planet and came clean, Picard went along with the plan pretty quickly to transplant them to a new world. But was this really the best course of action?

For one, the effects of a new ecosystem could be potentially devastating to the immune system of a pre-industrialized humanoid. Presumably, the crew can beam down to alien worlds because of the transporter's bio-filter and the advanced medical technology available. The Boralans, on the other hand, could potentially die from diseases that the native life forms have developed natural resistances to over time.

Secondly, did they really expect the Boralans to just accept the new animals and plant life located (from their POV) a few hundred kilometers from where they were? To relate it to our terms, say a group of Aztecs were caught up in a similar situation and migrated to a planet where targs were present. Would the society really accept that?

Also, Nikolai's whole argument about preserving a culture is dubious at best. The Boralan's world is gone. That world helped to shape the beliefs of its people, just as their new one will. By planting the seed of that new villiage, they're effectively saying goodbye to that culture. Assuming they survive and prosper, the society present there a decade from then could be expected to be vastly different than the one they tried to save.

 

[Finn]

Considering we saw a dog on an alien planet in the Delta Quadrant, why not?

 

[JNG]

How could letting them die possibly have been any better???

This is the most hypocritical episode of all Trek.

 

[Anwar]

Actually, thinking about it I almost found myself agreeing with Picard's initial stance on just leaving the Boraalans to their planet.

It would've taken hundreds if not thousands of ships to fully evacuate that planet, and by doing so they'd have set a precedent for the Federation towards primitive races in danger. From that point on they'd have to do the same for other worlds in danger, and where they heck are they supposed to get the manpower, logistics and ships for such a huge undertaking like galactic nursemaid? This would probably take way from other ship duties, like defense.

 

[Timo]

I could easily see the Federation doing something akin to zookeeping, that is, capturing and preserving small samples of doomed civilizations. But it would be just like traditional zookeeping: solely for the amusement of the captors. The sample wouldn't survive as unique, except in the biological sense (and in the interbreeding Trek universe, even that would quickly dilute out).

I'd thus agree with Picard. People die all the time. Many die of disease on Earth, and that doesn't mean Dr Crusher made the wrong decision when going elsewhere to do other things. Many die of crashing buildings or failing constructs of other sort, and that doesn't mean LaForge chose the wrong place and time to do his engineering work. Picard can't save everybody, either, and there's no particular reason he should try.

Whether he should try to save a few, every now and then, is really up to his personal preferences and the orders he receives. And those orders in turn are up to the "personal preferences" of the Federation, which may well prefer not to adopt pups from dying litters.

We have to remember, though, that Kirk tried to save the people in "Paradise Syndrome", without him or the UFP explicitly owing anything to them. Perhaps policies change. Perhaps this is because the UFP learns through experience, and it had a bad experience between those episodes on the issue of trying to save portions of a dying culture.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Renvar]

How could letting them die possibly have been any better???

This is the most hypocritical episode of all Trek.

Actually I wasn't thinking of letting them die. After all, Nikolai had already taken them from the planet when Picard found out; returning them to the atmosphere-free planet would be a cruel way to kill them. If I were in Picard's shoes, I would have tried to make first contact with them, rather than proceed under the delusion that I could stick them on another world and make it all better. Granted there's risks in that choice too, but even if they all commited suicide like Vorin (which I doubt), I submit that would still be a better outcome. The Boralans would be able to choose their own destiny, rather than the E-D crew choosing for them.

 

[Vic Sixx]

Remember the episode Pen Pals, another dying planet Drema 4, Picard felt it was a violation of the Prime Directive to help them out, but later he did anyway and saved it. I never really understood how it was breaking the Prime Directive to save a dying planet. Picard seem to think it was.

Would they have saved Ceti Alpha 5 if they had found out it was dying? Who knows, Kirk's time was less rigid than Picard's.

 

[Finn]

^Why would they? It wasn't home to any indigenous civilization (or Kirk would not have left Khan there), and apparently Captain Terrell had no knowledge about Khan and the augments (He didn't understand why Chekov was so concerned about being on a vessel called Botany Bay) , which suggests the events of Space Seed isn't common knowledge among Starfleet officers.

Also, Picard was pressured into it, with the sound of that little girl begging for help and his officers cornering him in his quarters. Besides, it was feasible to save the planet without ruining the...Dreman culture. Those Boraalians ceased to be Boraalians. They became Vaccans the moment they got to that planet, especially with Human traits now part of their community thanks to Nikolai. In few generations, they won't be even biologically pure Boraalian.

Judging from the way they looked, it probably will be millennia before they would make it to the stars, especially with the small number they have to start with. I wonder if they would ever learn that they could trace their origins to two distant planets called Earth and Boraal II. Humanity may be still around, but the Federation probably would be a distant memory if not forgotten by then.

 

[MeanJoePhaser]

The Native Americans the Preservers move change that much once they were relocated?

The real argument here is the inclusion of human DNA in the mix,is a species' genetic purity is key to cultural uniqueness?

Is it the species that should endure or merely the civilization/culture?

 

[Vic Sixx]

^Why would they? It wasn't home to any indigenous civilization (or Kirk would not have left Khan there), and apparently Captain Terrell had no knowledge about Khan and the augments (He didn't understand why Chekov was so concerned about being on a vessel called Botany Bay) , which suggests the events of Space Seed isn't common knowledge among Starfleet officers.

There was a population of about 200 million when Kirk left Kahn there. they said so in the story. They were on the wrong planet they thought it was Ceti Alpha 6 not 5. They weren't expecting to find anything on that planet much less a cargo carrier.

 

[Finn]

Where did you get that figure? Memory Alpha says nothing about a population on Ceti Alpha V.

Yes, they didn't expect to find anything there, but it was clear Captain Terrell didn't know what Botany Bay was. He was still ignorant about it after Khan introduced himself.

 

[JoeD80]

Remember the episode Pen Pals, another dying planet Drema 4, Picard felt it was a violation of the Prime Directive to help them out, but later he did anyway and saved it. I never really understood how it was breaking the Prime Directive to save a dying planet. Picard seem to think it was.

Would they have saved Ceti Alpha 5 if they had found out it was dying? Who knows, Kirk's time was less rigid than Picard's.

There's an interesting exchange in the original series episode "A Taste of Armageddon" where the prime directive is discussed. Kirk decides he can interfere with the planet's war because the directive only applies to developing worlds, and he figures one where everybody walks into suicide booths doesn't count. Seems the same concept should be applied to dying worlds -- since they aren't going to develop once the planet is destroyed, go ahead and evacuate everyone you can.

 

[Vic Sixx]

Where did you get that figure? Memory Alpha says nothing about a population on Ceti Alpha V.

Yes, they didn't expect to find anything there, but it was clear Captain Terrell didn't know what Botany Bay was. He was still ignorant about it after Khan introduced himself.

I remember that figure being mentioned in the story, and that Ceti 5 being likened to Aboriginal Australia. If I'm remembering right.

 

[Timo]

That's weird. There's nothing like that in the episode - absolutely no hint of a native population, no comparisons with Earth, nothing. All we learn is that Ceti Alpha V is "habitable, although a bit savage, somewhat inhospitable."

Perhaps one might say that "savage" requires the presence of savages. However, I rather doubt that this would have been the writer intention, and certainly nothing in this episode or others suggests the idea of the planet being inhabited.

The comparison to Australia is made not because the planet would be like Australia, but because Khan had flown a vessel named after an Australian penal colony. Kirk thus sees fit to remark that the planet is no worse that the penal colony - but this doesn't mean the two locations would be similar in any other respect save for both being a bit "savage". For all we know, the area of Ceti Alpha V where the prisoners were set down was far from open bodies of water and devoid of vegetation but had fertile soil, thus being the exact opposite of Botany Bay...

And definitely no mention of a native population. No sir.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Nebusj]

There's an interesting exchange in the original series episode "A Taste of Armageddon" where the prime directive is discussed. Kirk decides he can interfere with the planet's war because the directive only applies to developing worlds, and he figures one where everybody walks into suicide booths doesn't count. Seems the same concept should be applied to dying worlds -- since they aren't going to develop once the planet is destroyed, go ahead and evacuate everyone you can.

There's no discussion of the prime directive in ``A Taste Of Armageddon''.

The locals are quite well aware of the interstellar community: Kirk goes to the system with orders to secure a treaty port. And the locals understand interstellar radio codes well enough to send a warning signal. The locals are fully able and willing to carry out interstellar war, both simulated and actual, and the legitimate governments of both planets launch attacks on the Enterprise and her crew. What special protection should they have against the eminently foreseeable consequences of attacking a Federation starship?

You might be thinking of ``The Return of the Archons'', in which Spock protests that disrupting Landru's rule may conflict with their prime directive of noninterference, but Kirk does not ``decide'' it only applies to growing cultures. He says directly: ``That refers to a living, growing culture. Do you think this one is?'' And Spock agrees, it is not a growing culture and their prime directive does not restrict actions regarding it.

Similarly in ``Errand of Mercy'' once Spock is able to establish (however hastily) that the Organian culture does not appear to be growing Kirk opens up offers of abundant aid in transforming Organia.

 

[JoeD80]

Oh yeah that dialogue from "The Return of the Archons" is the one I was thinking of. I knew it was an episode that involved a big computer somewhere.