Hey, I never noticed that before....

Discussion in 'Star Trek - The Original & Animated Series' started by Warped9, Aug 1, 2015.

  1. alchemist

    alchemist Captain Captain

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  2. Doug Otte

    Doug Otte Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    He wore a hairpiece, if not a full wig, most (if not all) of the time on the show. In some episodes, it's more obvious, like a helmet. Other times, it's more subtle.
     
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  3. nightwind1

    nightwind1 Commodore Commodore

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    They just do not grok the holy book...
     
  4. Agent 13

    Agent 13 270 Rear Admiral

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    [​IMG]
     
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  5. JesterFace

    JesterFace Fleet Captain Commodore

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    After reading this thread title I noticed that I have never watched the original pilot episode 'The Cage'. It's on the DVD boxset I have but I don't remember ever actually putting it on. A new TOS episode. Interesting. What a n00b.

    I have seen clips of it somewhere but from start to finish, most likely not.
     
  6. Physics of Trekkies

    Physics of Trekkies Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    If you've seen The Menagerie, you've basically seen The Cage.
     
  7. ZapBrannigan

    ZapBrannigan Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    There are some surprising moments cut from "The Menagerie." Like when Spock tries to take the ship and bug out on Pike. But okay, if you've seen one version, you've seen them all. :lol:
     
  8. Physics of Trekkies

    Physics of Trekkies Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Correction: Like when Spock lays out the option to the command staff of leaving a planet that was full of aliens that could destroy them in a second. Don't frame it like Spock "tries to take the ship". Little dramatic there.

    Do you know what the adverb "basically" means?

    Internet is full of know-it-all dicks that look to create debate where none need exist. You don't have to be one. Post better, please. Thanks in advance.
     
  9. trekshark

    trekshark Commander Red Shirt

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    Does Spock shout "the women!" in the menagerie version?
    If not then the cage is a must watch
     
  10. BK613

    BK613 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    And those "hereditary headaches" and of course, The Menagerie changes the ending...
     
  11. JesterFace

    JesterFace Fleet Captain Commodore

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    I have watched through TOS but it's been (dare I say) a long time so even 'The Menagerie' is not fresh in memory.
    That might make watching through TOS more interesting, nearly completely new first pilot. ;)
     
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  12. 1001001

    1001001 Pull Up a Groove and Get Fabulous! Moderator

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    This is completely unnecessary and a violation of our posting rules. Consider this your one friendly warning. Anything like this again and you’ll get a formal warning.

    Moving on...
     
  13. Doug Otte

    Doug Otte Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I disagree. Yes, the basic story of The Cage is still there. There are some scenes that were cut for The Menagerie.

    The biggest difference to me is that showing The Cage framed by the current Enterprise scenes changes the basic flow. It's nice to see The Cage as its own entity.
     
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  14. Physics of Trekkies

    Physics of Trekkies Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    How so?
     
  15. Physics of Trekkies

    Physics of Trekkies Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    How so? This can be PM'ed so the discussion stays on point.

    Thanks in advance
     
  16. hofner

    hofner Commodore Commodore

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    Nitpicing about the difference between 'The Menagerie' and 'The Cage' versions aside, as someone who started watching TOS during its initial broadcast, it was quite something to see Cage in its entirety almost twenty years later.

    Robert
     
  17. ZapBrannigan

    ZapBrannigan Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I bought the pay-per-view premier on Oct 18, 1986. It was the hybrid color-b&w version, and having seen "The Menagerie" all my life, it was amazing. Just to see material I hadn't memorized like the Pledge of Allegiance was a big deal, but the restored scenes were a bigger deal than that. What a night.
     
  18. Cancel Culture

    Cancel Culture Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The footage of Pike and Vina at the end of "The Menagerie" had been used to tell a completely different story in "The Cage." Therefore, it's a case of seen one, not entirely seen the other.
     
  19. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    It's also delightfully meta: a bunch of illusionists are recycling footage in order to entertain and manipulate those involved... On the cheap.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
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  20. Physics of Trekkies

    Physics of Trekkies Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    I was kind of waiting for someone to bring up this "difference". Hold on, hear me out.

    The events in "The Cage" happen and at the end, Vina gets an illusory Pike, cool. All's well that ends well. Even the Talosians seem to let go the idea of breeding humans because of our psychology but in Vina's case, that should not be problematic at all.

    Now at the end of "The Menagarie", Vina gets the real Pike after beaming down in his chair. A Pike now only too happy to be "an animal in a cage" given the extreme alternative of being a robot in a chair that the real world presents him.

    (Even as a kid, I understood that "The Cage" ended with the same scene but with a totally fake Pike in both body and mind)

    "The Menagerie" is absolutely brilliant. The conflict between reality and paradise. Pike's crisis between duty and freedom as a mirror to Kirk's crisis between duty and loyalty to Spock.

    It really makes the Kirk era 2-parter so much stronger than the pilot imo. So much stronger that I can see no benefit that watching the pilot has against watching "The Menagerie".

    What basic flow is interrupted? I can grant that the complexity of Vina's being given a fake Pike in body and mind is needed to augment Vina's being given a fake Pike in body but REAL in mind would make "The Cage" necessary in re-watches (and I do. I really do), but "The Menagerie" gives the fullest experience.

    Heck, when I do re-watch "The Cage" I actually just feel "mentally itchy" for the Kirk 2-parter that fully deals with all these themes much more satisfactorily.

    All of this jmo but yes, "The Cage" is basically summed up fully in the 2 parter and expanded upon much more superior. Essentially, if you have seen "The Menagerie" you have seen "The Cage" and you have been granted extra insights that the pilot did not/could not.
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2021
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