That's interesting. She could have a very strong future ahead of her. She is easily one of the strong points of the series for me.
Gotham - Season 1
- Thread starter Agent Richard07
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That's interesting. She could have a very strong future ahead of her. She is easily one of the strong points of the series for me.
I seem to be in the minority here, but I'm loving this show. It's like a cross between a hardboiled detective story and a wacky cartoon. Sometimes in the same scene. It's incredibly entertaining.
I think people are disappointed because they wanted and expected a gritty crime drama and that's not what this is. I for one am thrilled to get this silly, wonderful show instead.
I think people are disappointed because they wanted and expected a gritty crime drama and that's not what this is. I for one am thrilled to get this silly, wonderful show instead.
Count me in on that minority. I really enjoy it in spite of the quibbles I may have.
Some perhaps, but certainly not all of us. I mainly want something that doesn't bore me.
My guess is Copplepot's arc is about his rise to power in the Gotham underworld. He'll need funds to accomplish this. (hence the kidnapping) Since he's on the outs with the Falcone/Mooney faction he might hook up with Maroni and use it's resources to develop a power base.
I find most, if not all network police procedurals to be pretty bland so I'm glad that Gotham isn't going that route. The ones that are watchable are only that way because they have interesting main characters.
As for the shift in tone, I figured it was because the show was finding its footing.
As for the shift in tone, I figured it was because the show was finding its footing.
Well, isn't it the other way around? They're showing that the reason she would later call herself Catwoman is because she was always obsessed with cats. Maybe we'll learn the reason for that later, perhaps something to do with her family history and those women in her locket.
I'm not sure "accurate" is a meaningful term for a franchise that has been reinvented and changed so many different times even in the original comics.
Only better.
And as I said, I don't like the thought of him being "disturbed." He's grieving and hurt, yes, but that doesn't make him mentally ill. The whole modern "Batman is crazy" meme is a misunderstanding of the character. What he is is a hero. He's someone who's chosen to turn his tragedy into a motivation for doing good. I read an observation not long ago, something to the effect that villains turn their pain into destructive action, while heroes turn their pain into positive action. Batman doesn't cling to the memory of his parents because he's some dysfunctional neurotic who can't let go, but because it reminds him of the cost that crime inflicts upon its victims, and thereby motivates him to continue fighting on behalf of the innocent. The thing I admire most about Gotham is that it gets that about Bruce -- it isn't writing him as mentally disturbed or self-destructive. He may seem that way at first, but then it turns out he has a thoughtful, calculated reason for his actions. He's trying to strengthen himself, not destroy himself, because he has a purpose now. I loved how committed he was here to finding something he could do to help the abducted children. He's turning his pain into positive action, and that's something to admire.
I don't know if I'm disappointed so much as confused about what the show wants or intends to be. I'm not particularly a fan of gritty crime dramas, and I'm not averse to zany superhero comedies (The Middleman, we still miss you!). But this show can't seem to make up its mind from one scene to the next, and the inconsistency of it is jarring.
And if it is going for Burton/Schumacher silliness, I'm concerned for its ratings, because I don't think audiences want that from their superhero stories these days, least of all from a Batman-based story. One of the reasons Birds of Prey flopped, I think, was because it was too stylized and fanciful and weird for its audience to buy into it.
Gotham hasn't reached Burton/Schumacher territory yet. It's a little Nolan and a little Lois & Clark.
I like Selena, and having raised a daughter I understand the makeup obsession that can happen with some girls around middle-school age. What put me off was that after spending at least a day in a dungeon, and probably 48 hours without a visit to a proper sink, her makeup wasn't even smudged.
The kidnappers didn't remind me of Smallville, they reminded me of Supernatural. Particularly the Christmas episode a few years ago ("Oh Fudge!!!") but really at least a dozen Supernatural creatures come to mind.
I sort of get the intended Burton feel of old/new, except it isn't working when they pick up a cell phone. There hasn't really been a need for cell phones in general (Penguin's call to the victim's mom being the exception.) If the cells were absent, the entire vibe would be early 80s. If they want to mix up the eras they need to do it a little more mindfully.
To me, the over the top characterizations are a reminder that some day some guy is going be running around dressed as bat and be taken seriously. Otherwise it would just be another cop show.
The kidnappers didn't remind me of Smallville, they reminded me of Supernatural. Particularly the Christmas episode a few years ago ("Oh Fudge!!!") but really at least a dozen Supernatural creatures come to mind.
I sort of get the intended Burton feel of old/new, except it isn't working when they pick up a cell phone. There hasn't really been a need for cell phones in general (Penguin's call to the victim's mom being the exception.) If the cells were absent, the entire vibe would be early 80s. If they want to mix up the eras they need to do it a little more mindfully.
To me, the over the top characterizations are a reminder that some day some guy is going be running around dressed as bat and be taken seriously. Otherwise it would just be another cop show.
I've only seen a few early episodes pf Arrow, but that show is bad camp even when they don't use uniforms.
I saw one episode where an average young woman lure's the main character's friend Tommy into the bottom floor and when the main character gets down there she has Tommy in a painful hold, breaking his wrist... I don't think a girl like that, even with some martial arts skill, would be able to overpower a guy like that in that way. I didn't buy that.
I liked the second episode (though the dead bum at the beginning was breathing.) For some reason, the show's uneasy mixture of both Nolan and Burton sensibilities is oddly comforting.. it can make the show seems serious in the moment and yet I can sit back and kind of enjoy how much fun it is. It also makes the show less pretentious than a lot of cop procedural.. gives it some pathos being as dark as it is.. but also isn't afraid to rem,ind us of the comic book absurdity of it all form time to time.
When I'm home cooking, since I live along, I don't bother to always keep my side dishes separate form the main part of the meal. I like mixing it all together and just enjoying it without worrying, without nitpicking and without hanging over every detail.
I saw one episode where an average young woman lure's the main character's friend Tommy into the bottom floor and when the main character gets down there she has Tommy in a painful hold, breaking his wrist... I don't think a girl like that, even with some martial arts skill, would be able to overpower a guy like that in that way. I didn't buy that.
I liked the second episode (though the dead bum at the beginning was breathing.) For some reason, the show's uneasy mixture of both Nolan and Burton sensibilities is oddly comforting.. it can make the show seems serious in the moment and yet I can sit back and kind of enjoy how much fun it is. It also makes the show less pretentious than a lot of cop procedural.. gives it some pathos being as dark as it is.. but also isn't afraid to rem,ind us of the comic book absurdity of it all form time to time.
When I'm home cooking, since I live along, I don't bother to always keep my side dishes separate form the main part of the meal. I like mixing it all together and just enjoying it without worrying, without nitpicking and without hanging over every detail.
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Whoever did Carol Cane's make-up was channelling their inner Burton.
I mentioned this on the last page, but it's basically half-Batman '66, half-Nolan, and with a bit of Burton thrown in (primarily in the costuming and some of the production design flourishes) -- which is resulting in the horribly schizophrenic tone. If you want to go all-out goofy, that's fine, because Batman '66 is wonderful. If you want to go full Nolan, that's fine, because those films are wonderful. But straddling the line (while very, very blatantly aping aspects of what's come before) just results in a very, very confused show that has basically every element (the direction, the cinematography, the acting, the writing, the design) doing its own thing, instead of working in conjunction with one another, and that doesn't work for me.
I seem to recall Keith R.A. DeCandido (TrekBBS's KRAD), who is a student of karate, commenting recently that it's entirely possible for a woman to overpower a larger man if she has the right training.
Christopher, that comes across super-skeevy. I can't imagine you meant it in a pervy way, but given the actress' age there's a subtext there.
I really liked the second episode. I also think that Jada Pinkett-Smith maybe the best thing about this show. Sure she was chewing some scenery but it was fantastic, I hope her character doesn't go anywhere soon.
Oh, come on. Admiration of aesthetics does not have to be sexual. There's only a "subtext" there if you're looking for an excuse to be judgmental.
Take Selina, for example. Remember the three or four scenes of her literally pawing at the necklace she has of her mom. You know, like a cat does with a toy? Because she's a cat? Like Catwoman? Get it? Hey did you get that? She's gonna be Catwoman.
"She likes to be called Cat."
"Why?"
It's like coming up with a logical in-universe justification for this shit has never even occurred to them. Honestly, I don't even care about the comics as long as you give me something that makes sense on its own terms. But they can't even be bothered to do that. They aren't trying to be accurate, but they aren't trying to do anything new or interesting with the mythos, either. So what are they doing? Why does this show exist?
Exactly. Basically they're leaning on the Batman mythos to try to make something which isn't interesting feel as if it is. If they're not going to do something fresh with it - what's the point? There's too much of this kind of blatantly obvious writing in superhero comics as it is which is why I quit reading them.
I came into this with low expectations but some hope because the concept of exploring Gotham has potential. "The City" is fertile mythic ground and Gotham has always been a character in the Batman mythos. But bad mob story rehashes dressed up with pointed references to Batman characters is a pretty empty pursuit.
You do have a history of essentializing women based on their appearance, both on your blog and in your fiction. It's not judgmental to point that fact out or to note that a comment that you likely intended as innocent can have different overtones given your track record.
Sure, maybe, but the episode didn't even hint as to how this happened.
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