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GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek?

Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

Someone making SFX from home isn't going to be able to get a movie into production. How are they going to get the honchos at any of the studios to take your calls? Just having a home computer setup to churn out SFX is not going to be enough. What about the little issues of writing a script, and hiring actors who not only have talent, but marketable name recognition? Maybe if you're making movies direct to YouTube, you'll do okay.
 
Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

Nemesis had a lot of problems, but FX never came across as one of them to me. I never noticed anything that stood out to me as being a noticeably bad effect.
That's a valid point. I can think of many badly conceived effects in Nemesis, but the execution was generally good.

I think they may have run out of money to do the Starfleet task force on the other side of the nebula/whatever/thing and then forgot to rewrite or reshoot the scene where they set up the Starfleet task force.

Kegg said:
A bold claim, that. It's easy to say one can make a better film than Lucas or Abrams, harder to do it. As valid as fan criticisms could be of either producer, they do have considerable experience and practical know-how and the odd hit title to their names. That fans armed with enthusiasm could best them at their own game strikes me as a pretty long shot.

(I doubt I could make anything half as good as Michael Bay, for the record.)

Yeah. I mean, I could write a better movie than George Lucas, and very likely write a better movie than Orci and Kurtzmann, but I have no idea how to make a movie, other than taking that $60 million and hiring people who did.
 
Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

Luckily, I never claimed otherwise. I'm obviously aware of what the cost entails. However, you have just said yourself that equal quality can be obtained from smaller companies. A hundred or two hundred million dollars for a movie is crazy; I'm sure either one of us could make a better movie than Lucas or Abrams for a half million or less.

Then you need to do some research, as even the "reduced" Narnia budget was something like $150 million. So, yes, you can have it for "less" thanks to the perforation of small VFX houses, but that's a far cry from your claim that these movies can be made for $500,000. Or perhaps they can, but expect a lot of volunteer labor and a realistic possibility that they'll never get finished. Our very own Dennis and DS9Sega have been working on Polaris for something like four years now and they're still filming the thing. As the old saying goes, you can have it done fast, cheap and quickly – pick any two. If you want it good and cheap, getting it done on time is the first thing to go. You might as well complain that because some brainy college student can spent $1000 to whip up a nuclear reactor in his kitchen, there's no reason for real reactors to cost hundreds of millions.

Methinks you're ignorant of just how ignorant you are.
 
Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

I'm sure either one of us could make a better movie than Lucas or Abrams for a half million or less.

I bet you really are sure of that too, which frankly is a failing on your part, both in underestimating the skills and talents of those whose work you don't like and vastly overestimating your own. There's plenty to criticize in both Lucas' and Abrams' works, but I'd never be so naive and arrogant to assume that what they do is so easy to just take on and surpass without experience and on a shoestring budget.

It's like you don't even try to have a serious conversation anymore, RJ.
 
Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

okay, so, last night i was watching star trek nemesis. i thought it was quite good and i enjoyed it. earlier today i was watching star wars: episode 2 and wow, i'm blown away by the special effects difference. the CGI is on a completely new level. so many great scenes, whether it's jango vs obi wan in space, the droid battles or the jedi against dooku.

compared to Ep2, nemesis is just ... well, there's no comparison. i saw somewhere that quoted lucas as saying "we make this for one tenth of the cost anybody else does." how does he do it? both movies were made in the same year so they both had the same technology at their disposal.

I think the goals are different ST never really wanted to attempt the range covered b SW...the stories are more intimate, one alien ship against another, one idea against another, one planet in question...not whole empires.
 
Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

Then you need to do some research, as even the "reduced" Narnia budget was something like $150 million. So, yes, you can have it for "less" thanks to the perforation of small VFX houses

I think you mean proliferation. Though I'd love to see a small VFX house perforated...
 
Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

Yes. Damn you, auto-correct!
 
Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

I could be wrong, but didn't Insurrection and Nemesis not use ILM because ILM was incredibly busy with the Star Wars prequels at the time?
 
Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

I'm sure either one of us could make a better movie than Lucas or Abrams for a half million or less.

A bold claim, that. It's easy to say one can make a better film than Lucas or Abrams, harder to do it. As valid as fan criticisms could be of either producer, they do have considerable experience and practical know-how and the odd hit title to their names. That fans armed with enthusiasm could best them at their own game strikes me as a pretty long shot.
I hardly think it's a bold claim at all; seems rather like stating the obvious to me. Many independent films are shot on a budget much smaller than a half million; so are fan films, even if you figure in the potential cost of what they get for free. Wonderful local theater productions are put together for a few thousand dollars and video equipment is cheap and plentiful. As for talent, I happen to be a wonderful writer, if I do say so myself, with skills in other areas, and Gep is a great CGI artist, possibly with other skills, and we both know how to find people who can do things that we can't. We're talking about a half million dollars here.

Someone making SFX from home isn't going to be able to get a movie into production. How are they going to get the honchos at any of the studios to take your calls? Just having a home computer setup to churn out SFX is not going to be enough. What about the little issues of writing a script, and hiring actors who not only have talent, but marketable name recognition? Maybe if you're making movies direct to YouTube, you'll do okay.
I never said anything about marketing; I'm just talking about making the movie. And many people do exactly what you say they can't: They produce movies without the blessing of a head honcho at a large corporation. They show these movies at local drive-ins and theaters, at conventions, at contests and festivals, they distribute them direct-to-DVD and sometimes, if lucky, find a mom & pop distributor.

Our very own Dennis and DS9Sega have been working on Polaris for something like four years now and they're still filming the thing.
I imagine that has to do with their specific circumstances. Many independent films are done very quickly, in a matter of weeks; in fact, I would add to my criticism of overinflated budgets, that Big Studio Product takes way too long to produce. In any case, by bringing up Polaris, you've pretty much made my point for me. I'm pretty sure their budget is less than a half mil, and I'll be very surprised if it's not better than much of the generic dreck that the establishment cranks out.

Methinks you're ignorant of just how ignorant you are.
Methinks more likely you are holding a grudge over some sacred cow I've punctured. Which is a shame. You're a pretty nice guy, but you've developed this knee-jerk reaction to every criticism or observation I make. :shrug:

I bet you really are sure of that too, which frankly is a failing on your part, both in underestimating the skills and talents of those whose work you don't like and vastly overestimating your own. There's plenty to criticize in both Lucas' and Abrams' works, but I'd never be so naive and arrogant to assume that what they do is so easy to just take on and surpass without experience and on a shoestring budget.
Well, I certainly prefer arrogance to complacency and laziness. And if I'm acutely aware of my talent, I'm also acutely aware of where I lack it-- but I also know where to find people who can fill those gaps. And it boggles my mind that a half million dollars can be considered a shoestring budget. Do you also think that prescription drugs are cheap and profession football players are underpaid? :rommie:

It's like you don't even try to have a serious conversation anymore, RJ.
Well, this is a bizarre non sequitur. I try to have serious conversations all the time, without much success. Unfortunately, my (quite obvious and valid) criticisms of the current state of culture are not popular-- it seems one must be a dedicated follower of fashion to be taken seriously. :(
 
Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

OP is a little confused.

George Lucas' quote about the 10x budget was in reference to a Star Wars TV Series that was in development, not movies.
 
Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

I could be wrong, but didn't Insurrection and Nemesis not use ILM because ILM was incredibly busy with the Star Wars prequels at the time?
Not just the prequels. Their movies from the year 2002 alone (apart from Episode II) include "Gangs of New York", "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets", "Men in Black II", "Minority Report", "The Time Machine", "Bourne Identity", "Tears of the Sun" and a few more, so I guess it's possible that they were in over their heads already.
 
Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

How did Stewart and Spiner help the plot? (And whatever help they gave, it clearly wasn't enough.) :rommie:
They helped the plot by being in the movie, which would have been even worse without them. :p
 
Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

A hundred or two hundred million dollars for a movie is crazy; I'm sure either one of us could make a better movie than Lucas or Abrams for a half million or less.

Ha...well only if you want to do something like X-Files set in the "real world." Because you're sure not building any spaceship sets for that.

We spent a half-million dollars at my job on a series of videos that take place in a single condominium. Less than a 2 week shoot and a total finished product of less than a half hour. No way you'd get a whole movie done in that amount of time.

But that's working in Hollywood. Can you just shoot a movie in Idaho and finish it for under a half million? Of course you can!

But there's no way you're doing that AND paying for lots of special effects for that amount of money. Even Memento cost $9 million and there's no aliens or laser battles in that.
 
Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

How did Stewart and Spiner help the plot? (And whatever help they gave, it clearly wasn't enough.) :rommie:
They helped the plot by being in the movie, which would have been even worse without them. :p

The plot would have been just as bad with any two random characters in their roles. What you mean is that they helped with name recognition, and fooled some poor souls into seeing that steaming pile. There was certainly no other reason to see it, other than being a total Star Trek completist, I guess, so that's how they earned their paychecks. They contributed more to the BO than the writer and director, that's for sure.
 
Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

James Nguyen and Hal Warren posts in here, don't they? Because look at how "great" of movies they made for low budgets, hell throw Tommy Wisseau in there too. All three of those men thought a great, quality, movie could be made on a low budget with new actors and Mr. Nguyen even had CGI effects in his movie which is using the term very loosely.
 
Re: GEORGE LUCAS: How does he make SW so cheaply in comparison to Trek

A hundred or two hundred million dollars for a movie is crazy; I'm sure either one of us could make a better movie than Lucas or Abrams for a half million or less.

Ha...well only if you want to do something like X-Files set in the "real world." Because you're sure not building any spaceship sets for that.

We spent a half-million dollars at my job on a series of videos that take place in a single condominium. Less than a 2 week shoot and a total finished product of less than a half hour. No way you'd get a whole movie done in that amount of time.

But that's working in Hollywood. Can you just shoot a movie in Idaho and finish it for under a half million? Of course you can!

But there's no way you're doing that AND paying for lots of special effects for that amount of money. Even Memento cost $9 million and there's no aliens or laser battles in that.
Even $9 million is a small fraction of $200 million. I have any number of DVDs on my shelf (or floor) that include stop-motion or CGI effects that were made for less than $200 grand. I'm fully prepared to be proven wrong about this, but it seems to me that I would have to work hard to spend a half mil on an adaptation of Foundation shot down on the Company Theater stage or a local warehouse with establishing CGI rendered in Poser or Bryce on my laptop-- or even if I splurged and used a local professional SFX house (not counting money spent on the option, of course). The producers of Exeter could have done it, even if they paid for everything. I'm curious to learn the specifics of why a series of videos shot in a condominium cost more than any number of full-length independent features, though-- and I don't mean that sarcastically at all; I have no idea why that would be.
 
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