Gary Mitchell as First Officer

[Winterwind]

Doesn't Dehner say at one point that Kirk and Mitchell had been friends for "years"? And Mitchell mentions Kirk at the Academy. I think they knew each for years.

My own bit of fanon is from one of the older novels, I'd have to flip through a few to find it, but it talks about how Kirk had requested Mitchell as his first officer, but Starfleet had assigned him Spock instead, because Mitchell was "too much like Kirk" and a captain needs an XO that can present different ideas and viewpoints (such as Spock). After reading that novel, I've never seen Gary as XO in WNMHGB, at most he would be second officer.

Hmm. Going back a few years with this one but I think it was simply titled "Enterprise". I read it way back. Kirk's first assignment, when he got the ship (and IIRC, he was in his 20s in the novel) was basically ferrying around a 23rd century circus on a tour. And Gary was actually injured and not even on the Enterprise for the entire novel.

 

[Timo]

Helmsman or Navigator are subordinate assignments compared to the XO

Not in "The Cage", unless we assume that the Lieutenant who was Pike's navigator was called Number One because she was Pike's number one mistress, not because she was Pike's first officer...

We don't know Mitchell or Spock's position from "Where No Man", nor do we actually know Number One's position from "The Cage" beyond her being the XO. But in both cases, we did see top officers operating bridge consoles related to "other lines of work", such as helm, navigation or sciences. Clearly, in Starfleet, one can be both XO and one's own subordinate...

I think it was simply titled "Enterprise".

Voyda N. McIntyre: Enterprise: The First Adventure.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Kagan]

It may have never been said explicitly in WNMHGB but Spock does identify himself as second officer in a log entry in "The Enemy Within."

I wonder if there's a third option. Perhaps neither Spock nor Mitchell were first officer? Perhaps the true first officer was on leave or special assignment and decided not to return to the Enterprise.

Ben Finnery, "Court Martial", wears commander's stripes on a gold shirt; however, he is referred to as a lieutenant commander and a records officer. Finney would probably have been on the Enterprise during "The Enemy Within", and should have spent more "time in rank" than Spock.

 

[Potemkin_Prod]

In "Alternative Factor," the navigator has commander's stripes, iirc. Also, Marlena Moreau mentions a Commander Kenner. Not that I believe either of these guys (or are they the same guy?) is exec officer. Just tossing it out there for consideration.

 

[BillJ]

Also, Marlena Moreau mentions a Commander Kenner.

But we know for sure that Spock is next in line for command in the Mirror Universe.

 

[Timo]

Might be Mirror Universe politics: Kenner may be senior, but from an inferior race, a lowluy placed family, or not a party member...

In general, the regular TOS crew seems to have lots of high-ranking officers when Pike's crew was never stated to feature anybody above the rank of Lieutenant. Might be the same ship type is flexibly used for different types of mission, including milk runs with a crew of 200 commanded by mostly Lieutenants, and prestigious exploration sorties with a crew of 430 commanded by half a dozen Commanders and Lieutenant Commanders plus a full Captain.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[T'Girl]

Helmsman or Navigator are subordinate assignments compared to the XO

Not in "The Cage", unless we assume that the Lieutenant who was Pike's navigator was called Number One

On Kirk's bridge that seat was occupied by the hemsman, but on Pike's bridge, Number One sat in the same position that would one day would be occupied (on Picard's bridge) by Commander Data as ship's second officer/operations officer.

Picard's Enterprise was large enough to have a First Officer with no secondary duties, however Pike's ship was much smaller, having the First Officer also possessing the position of operations officer would be perfect considering the traditional role of a First Officer. Just as on Picard's bridge, the helmsman/navigator on Pike's bridge might have been combined into a single position, to the right of the operations officer.

Also, Marlena Moreau mentions a Commander Kenner.

Kenner may be senior, but from an inferior race, a lowluy placed family, or not a party member...

In the last movie, Scotty's (presumable starfleet) associate was named Kenser, perhaps of the same species as Commander Kenner. Vulcan males as a cultural trait sometimes have similar sounding names.

A love scene between Marlena Moreau and Kenser would be ... (never mind).

 

[Pauln6]

I prefer to think of Gary as first officer at this stage. If Spock is referred to as second officer in a later episode then clearly somebody else must be first officer and Gary is the best alternate candidate.

All officers would have to undergo regular training at all posts so a high-ranking officer in a 'menial' post isn't really evidence of much. I can recall at least one other lt-commander seated at either helm or navigation in TOS, Sulu in TMP (I like to think he was chief operations officer who was just sitting at helm during the V'ger crisis) and, of course, Data, albeit ops was a bridge position by that stage. Spock being both first officer and science officer was not the norm as far as we can tell.

 

[Timo]

If Spock is referred to as second officer in a later episode then clearly somebody else must be first officer

But the self-reference comes in an episode where there are no alternatives available for First Officer!

In "Enemy Within", the only possible reason why the First Officer of the ship would be absent from our view would be if he were one of the three stranded on the planet below. But none of the three holds high rank, as their cuff markings demonstrate, and none outrank Spock in any other episode, either (despite one of them appearing in virtually every other episode of TOS!).

That Spock calls himself the Second Officer might be chalked off as the same thing as Picard in "The Battle" calling Data his second-in-command despite Data clearly being the third-in-command or lower by today's terminology.

Spock: "Captain's Log, stardate 1673.1. Entry made by Second Officer Spock."

Picard: "This is my First Officer, Commander William Riker. Second in command, Data."

Picard clearly means "second in command after Riker", even though the terminology is formally reserved solely for use in "after Picard" situations and should here apply to Riker and Riker only. Spock could equally well consider himself the second officer after Kirk, Kirk being the first officer by virtue of being the commanding officer.

Spock being both first officer and science officer was not the norm as far as we can tell.

But we can't, as we never see another starship's crew in the TOS era. The crews of Decker and Tracey are dead by the time we get to them, and the entire complement of the Defiant is lost, too.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Pauln6]

If Spock is referred to as second officer in a later episode then clearly somebody else must be first officer

But the self-reference comes in an episode where there are no alternatives available for First Officer!

In "Enemy Within", the only possible reason why the First Officer of the ship would be absent from our view would be if he were one of the three stranded on the planet below. But none of the three holds high rank, as their cuff markings demonstrate, and none outrank Spock in any other episode, either (despite one of them appearing in virtually every other episode of TOS!).

That Spock calls himself the Second Officer might be chalked off as the same thing as Picard in "The Battle" calling Data his second-in-command despite Data clearly being the third-in-command or lower by today's terminology.

Spock: "Captain's Log, stardate 1673.1. Entry made by Second Officer Spock."

Picard: "This is my First Officer, Commander William Riker. Second in command, Data."

Picard clearly means "second in command after Riker", even though the terminology is formally reserved solely for use in "after Picard" situations and should here apply to Riker and Riker only. Spock could equally well consider himself the second officer after Kirk, Kirk being the first officer by virtue of being the commanding officer.

Spock being both first officer and science officer was not the norm as far as we can tell.

But we can't, as we never see another starship's crew in the TOS era. The crews of Decker and Tracey are dead by the time we get to them, and the entire complement of the Defiant is lost, too.

Timo Saloniemi

TMP is in the TOS era and therefore can be used to support the notion that first officers can be asked to double in other posts but it isn't the norm. Having said that, there is no indication of who would have been first officer if Kirk hadn't come on board so it's by no means a slam dunk.

I agree that it's likely just a slip of the tongue but it is also arguable that Spock's promotion to first officer after Mitchell's death hadn't been formally approved by Starfleet yet.

Logically, once Spock's promotion was approved he should have been put in a gold shirt and a new science officer should have been brought in but whatever.

 

[Ssosmcin]

Spock is only identified as the science officer, by Kirk in the briefing room scene.

Even that is awfully vague. Kirk merely says that he expects his science officer not to hide unpleasant truths. And he says that to Elizabeth Dehner, who has attempted to hide unpleasant truths about Gary Mitchell. So apparently, Dehner is the science officer here. Or a science officer anyway.

Kirk is not referring to Dehner as science officer. It was made clear in her introduction that she is only the ships's psychiatrist. No, Kirk is responding to Dehner's objection to both his and Spock's coldness about a man they've "worked next to for years." Kirk defends Spock's position (and his own) with: [defending himself] "It is my duty, whether pleasant or unpleasant, to listen to the reports, observations, even speculations, on any subject that might affect the safety of this vessel. [defending Spock] And it's my science officer's duty to see that I am provided with that. [So,]Go ahead, Mr. Spock." In other words, he's saying "shut up, Dehner, Spock's doing his job." There's no question that Spock is science officer. His duties also make that clear. Not everything has to be pointedly stated in the dialog when the evidence is all there. Still, if you want to count it, the TV Guide ad for the premiere comes out and says it as well.

As for First Officer, there's nothing stating there even is one on board. Spock could be chief of security, the way he's brandishing the phaser rifle. However, since Spock is second in command in the other 78 episodes and no mention of promotion was made, and nothing indicates Mitchell isn't anything but his old friend and helmsman, I'm going with Spock is first officer here as well. As for the line where he says "second officer Spock" in The Enemy Within, I chalk that up to a simple goof and don't really see the need to work it into the continuity. Someone accidentally blended "second in command" and "first officer" and got us that error. Sometimes a screw up is just that. Like not paying attention to Kirk's middle initial, or the number of kids his brother had.

Doesn't Dehner say at one point that Kirk and Mitchell had been friends for "years"? And Mitchell mentions Kirk at the Academy. I think they knew each for years.

Kirk actually comes out and says he's known Gary for 15 years in his log. That plus all the dialog and banter makes it pretty clear that they are old friends.

 

[Timo]

Kirk is not referring to Dehner as science officer. It was made clear in her introduction that she is only the ships's psychiatrist.

Just to nitpick, that certainly makes her an officer in sciences, or a science officer...

Curiously, the introduction paints Dehner as an observer of some sort, rather than an actual member of the crew. Her special (and apparently exclusive) duty is to study stress reactions, which she then proceeds to do with Mitchell; if the ship actually has a shrink for the crew, he or she is hiding somewhere else.

McCoy seems to be the only available shrink later on, even if he sometimes claims he isn't competent (and eveh if somebody else is more competent than him in operating a psychotricorder). Possibly Piper thus is Kirk's original shrink.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Ssosmcin]

Kirk is not referring to Dehner as science officer. It was made clear in her introduction that she is only the ships's psychiatrist.

Just to nitpick, that certainly makes her an officer in sciences, or a science officer...

You could say the same thing about McCoy or M'Benga or anyone any science capacity. Of course, we're talking about who the science officer is. Senior Science Officer, I guess.

 

[Timo]

Of course, we're talking about who the science officer is.

...But Kirk in that scene isn't.

Senior Science Officer, I guess.

Didn't some VOY episode give us the title "Chief Science Officer", perhaps as referring to one of Janeway's old assignments? I might remember completely wrong, as I get no relevant hits on quick googling...

Timo Saloniemi