Force field technology or technologies?

[Unimatrix Q]

In Star Trek most brigs and arrest cells are equipped with force fields, some apparently safe for humanoids and some deadly like the Dominion's.

Are they different technologies and what effects do they have on humanoid bodies?

I wonder what happens to a body touching them and what it feels like.

 

[Timo]

It might be there is just one tech, but the knob can be turned to different levels of intensity.

Or more like different levels of steepness of intensity gradient. Leaning hard against a Fed forcefield supposedly is very painful, in "Where No Man" already. Smart villains like neo-Khan never even try. Strong ones may wish to do it for sheer bravado, still stopping short of lethal pain. But simply touching is unlikely to be deadly, as evidenced by Spock casually yet still no doubt utterly logically testing his confinement with a finger tap in... Now which one was it? "Whom Gods Destroy"?

That is, the response at light tap might be consistently nonlethal, but different users define "no longer light enough for nonlethal" differently. And Spock can tell from his logical braving of the pain gradient...

What examples do we have of forcefields it is safe and painless to lean against?

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Unimatrix Q]

It might be there is just one tech, but the knob can be turned to different levels of intensity.

Or more like different levels of steepness of intensity gradient. Leaning hard against a Fed forcefield supposedly is very painful, in "Where No Man" already. Smart villains like neo-Khan never even try. Strong ones may wish to do it for sheer bravado, still stopping short of lethal pain. But simply touching is unlikely to be deadly, as evidenced by Spock casually yet still no doubt utterly logically testing his confinement with a finger tap in... Now which one was it? "Whom Gods Destroy"?

That is, the response at light tap might be consistently nonlethal, but different users define "no longer light enough for nonlethal" differently. And Spock can tell from his logical braving of the pain gradient...

What examples do we have of forcefields it is safe and painless to lean against?

Timo Saloniemi

We have Q for example, when he was human in "Deja Q", he acted very squeamish about the human condition but didn'tmind touching the force field in his cell. He appeared not to feel any pain at all.

And what physical background do you think has this tech in the Star Trek Universe?

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

I still think a Physical Jail Door should be used on top of a Force Field.

Relying on 1 system is a bad idea.

 

[Unimatrix Q]

I still think a Physical Jail Door should be used on top of a Force Field.

Relying on 1 system is a bad idea.

Yes. That would be more logical, considering how many times systems apparently lose energy on starfleet vessels.

By the way, thinking about the issue of what force fields actually are, i came up with the thought that they are maybe connected to transporter and replicator technology.

Perhaps they consist of matter hold in one of the last stages before re- or dematerialization, which could explain the density of them and how they respond to touching them.

It would also explain the similarity of transporter and replicator effects to how federation force fields look like in TNG and DS9.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Yet in ST: DSC, the Force Fields manage to stay functioning despite battle damage.

-_-

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

By the way, thinking about the issue of what force fields actually are, i came up with the thought that they are maybe connected to transporter and replicator technology.

Perhaps they consist of matter hold in one of the last stages before re- or dematerialization, which could explain the density of them and how they respond to touching them.

It would also explain the similarity of transporter and replicator effects to how federation force fields look like in TNG and DS9.

http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Deflector_shield
Deflector shields operated by creating a layer, or layers, of energetic distortion containing a high concentration of gravitons around the object to be protected.

 

[Crazy Eddie]

http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Deflector_shield
Deflector shields operated by creating a layer, or layers, of energetic distortion containing a high concentration of gravitons around the object to be protected.

Kind of. "Shields" and "deflectors" are technically two different technologies that do similar things. "Shields" are a forcefield barrier that acts like an extra layer of armor over the hull of the ship. "Deflectors" are a kind of energy field around the ship -- sometimes graviton based -- that pushes objects away from the ship altogether.

Star Trek being what it is, it's never been entirely clear how these two systems work together, what their tolerances are, or why either of them would actually loose strength when something hits them. In a more realistic world, deflectors would cause torpedoes to veer sharply away from the ship tens of kilometers away, where they would probably detonate in space without hitting the hull. Phaser and disruptor beams would probably push right through the deflectors but would be stopped by forcefields, as would any torpedoes powerful enough to swim through the deflector barrier.

There's no reason at all for either system to be "depleted" by percentages when something hits them. What might happen, actually, is that incoming objects put more load on the shield generators which either start to overheat or become physically damaged by the forces transmitted through the fields. In that sense, taking down someone's shields by shooting at them would be like trying to disable a refrigerator by stuffing it with hot coals: it will probably take you a long time -- longer than you can afford -- to actually overwork the refigerator's cooling loop, but if you put in enough heat fast enough you can prevent the fridge from doing its job. Forcefields likely work the same way: if you put enough energy into a particular spot, enough of the energy will bleed through to damage the hull underneath. If you do enough damage to a particular spot, you will probably disable the force-field generators protecting that part of the hull. Deflectors would be a similar issue: every massive and fast-moving object would put some strain on the deflectors to the point that the big dish or the warp core that powers it become overheated to the point of failure. In this case, you might end up forcing an opponent to drop his deflectors if you hit him with enough energy that he starts worrying about burning up his engines.

Just think of Star Trek as its depicted to be the "simplified" depiction you get in a holonovel and all the characters we see are actually just LARPing. That way, the behavior of shields/deflectors is just a matter of the DM giving them a finite number of hit points.

 

[Unimatrix Q]

If force fields are dangerous to come into contact with, what do you think is the cause for that effect?

 

[Deks]

Force fields can likely be attenuated in intensity...
We have seen different levels of forcefields... Level 10 being highest (and managing to interfere with technologies from other more advanced civilizations like Voth).

As for whether they are harmful... Federation forcefields can indeed be harmful... though for basic confinement, it likely doesn't hurt too much, if at all.
Being hurt by a Federation forcefield would likely have an effect if you are in sustained contact with it.
The Federation is not about to make people under confinement hurt themselves... though they could certainly modify the field to be deadly to touch (like the Dominion's).

Dominion has no qualms about killing people and usually keeps prisoners for interrogation, etc... its probably why their forcefields might kill on contact, though the only instance of this being said was by a Vorta who was trying to insert herself into the Federation as a spy (even though the Founders already infiltrated the Federation since the wormhole was discovered, learned about it and other AQ races and their technology - hence why Dominion weapons were able to cut through their shields at first) and could have lied (I don't recall other instances in which we saw Dominion forcefields killing people on contact).

 

[uniderth]

Yet in ST: DSC, the Force Fields manage to stay functioning despite battle damage.

-_-

We don't talk about that.

Force fields can likely be attenuated in intensity...
We have seen different levels of forcefields... Level 10 being highest (and managing to interfere with technologies from other more advanced civilizations like Voth).

You mean level 11.

 

[Deks]

We don't talk about that.



You mean level 11.

Actually, I mean level 10 forcefield as I don't think we ever saw level 11 ones.

As for STD and forcefield staying in operation after battle damage... That's how they are supposed to work anyway.
We've seen hull breaches being sealed by forcefields after heavy battle damage such as on Voyager bridge in the year of hell, and uss ent-e during battle with shinzon.

It's not exactly impossible for a century earlier ships forcefields to stay in operation. They are likely a highly redundant system that would stay operational unless there's catastrophic warp core power loss. Even then, you'd have fusion generators taking over to maintain forcefields... And the power transfer could occur wirelessly

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

We've seen hell breaches being sealed by forcefields after heavy battle damage

Hell Breaches being sealed by Force Fields, that's one amazing Force Field if it can seal a gate to Hell itself.

 

[Deks]

Hell Breaches being sealed by Force Fields, that's one amazing Force Field if it can seal a gate to Hell itself.

Typo... you know I meant hull.
And I'm not religious... plus seeing religion in Trek turns my stomach sometimes, which is why I couldn't enjoy DS9 properly.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Typo... you know I meant hull.
And I'm not religious... plus seeing religion in Trek turns my stomach sometimes, which is why I couldn't enjoy DS9 properly.

I guess I'm the opposite. I'm not particularly religious, but religion doesn't really bother me at all.

 

[at Quark's]

Both the Dominion and Cardassia apparently used a lethal variety of force fields. I can see Weyoun now on his first ambassadorial visit to the Cardassians:

"My friends, we share so many philosophical attitudes in our outlook on life... The way we treat our prisoners, the way we design our forcefields …. you're our kind of people, and I think we should be in a permanent alliance! Could I tempt you with a Dominion membership offer? "

DS9: The Jem'Hadar

SISKO: How did you know that the security barrier's lethal?
ERIS: Because everything about the Jem'Hadar is lethal.

DS9: Civil Defense

DUKAT: Tell me something, Major. The Cardassian neutralisation emitters that were under here. I assume you deactivated them when you control of the station?
KIRA: That's right. We prefer our containment fields to be non-lethal.

 

[Johnny7oak]

shields and forcefields are a lot alike... its just closely meshed in overlapping shield frequencies that you can't physically walk through it. An energized forcefield will repel you rather than kill you. I think what is does is use shield frequencies to come up with the affect that push back rather than just block. Other examples electrify with energy warnings to warn the person.