Eric Stoltz made me understand the tragedy of the ending of Back to the Future and the inhumanity of the American Dream

[Oddish]

This is heavy.

Yeah, there's a problem with the earth's gravitational pull.

Not Doc's best line, but a decent one.

So, he virtually killed his brothers so that two strangers would have a better life (at least financially)?

Absolutely not.
1. One of his siblings was female.
2. The two strangers' lives were improved on multiple axes.
3. Killing his siblings and giving two strangers a better life were two separate actions on his part. The former happened when he shoved George out of the way of that car. The latter when he manipulated George and Lorraine into happily ever after.

*~*~*

Another question, though. Once Marty had picked up the guitar and ensured that his parents would get their last dance, he had presumably locked things on course. George and Lorraine were going to kiss and realize they were going to be together forever, no further action on Marty's part required. So why didn't the photo return to normal right then?

 

[Tosk]

Another question, though. Once Marty had picked up the guitar and ensured that his parents would get their last dance, he had presumably locked things on course. George and Lorraine were going to kiss and realize they were going to be together forever, no further action on Marty's part required. So why didn't the photo return to normal right then?

BTTF has time travel rules all of its own. Things "dissolve" depending on what's happening in the relative now, and even then not in what we might consider a logical way. (Like the photo, Dave's hair is erased first.) Until George and Lorraine actually kiss, the future is still uncertain.

Movie logic. It's also how you can tell when it's safe to feed a Mogwai.

 

[Set Harth]

We're talking about time travel here. Either it's all a joke, or none of it is.

Well, as long as we're quoting THAT movie....

"I don't know why everyone believes that, but that isn't true."

"So... Back To The Future's a bunch of bullshit?"

 

[Oddish]

Well, according to Stephen King's "The Langoliers", if you go back in time, you get gobbled up by Pac-Men From Hell.

 

[Skipper]

Absolutely not.
1. One of his siblings was female.

Uh sorry shame on me!

2. The two strangers' lives were improved on multiple axes.

Well I have to say that the movie doesn't show us that they are two better people in every way. They have a good job it would seem, but as far as we know they are two absolute assholes towards their colleagues.
And that's what bothers me about the movie. That it focuses more on the materialistic aspects. "Uh look! Marty's brother has a job and wears a suit! Of course he's a better person now!".

 

[Kai "the spy"]

Well, we know the new version of Marty's brother goes to the office on a Saturday, so there.

 

[Oddish]

Well I have to say that the movie doesn't show us that they are two better people in every way.

I think we're supposed to just figure that they were fundamentally decent people who deserved better lives than the ones they had in the "original" timeline.

 

[Skipper]

I think we're supposed to just figure that they were fundamentally decent people who deserved better lives than the ones they had in the "original" timeline.

In the movie they seemed a little contemptuous towards Marty, but maybe just because he was a little confused,

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

I still wonder just how badly things will go for Marty as it becomes clear that his memories are out of alignment with the timeline he finds himself in.

BTTF does not trouble itself or audiences with being psychologically displaced by alternate realities. The film's coda is that material wealth is the best that life has to offer, so Marty will never be troubled with living in a world where his own social and psychological development is not at all aligned with that of the altered reality and its impact / shaping / nurturing of his "family" and the world and events around them. He's "well off" in Spielberg-ian suburbia, so Marty--we are told in the visual sense--is going to be just fine 'n' dandy.

"So... Back To The Future's a bunch of bullshit?"

Yes.

 

[SithHappens]

Fundamentally, George and Lorraine would have been. Their appearance, personalities, and first 17 years of history would have been unchanged. Just their adult lives were different.

Realistically, all three McFly siblings should have been obliterated, replaced with three very different people. But, due to the Durable Timeline Principle seen in most time travel movies, they seem to be more or less the same. And it's best that we try not to worry too much about it.

yep, same in Star Trek with the mirror universe, once the universes diverge the chances of a counterpart diminish significantly as time passes. By the time the DS9 counterparts were being born and it's probably zero chance.

 

[Tallguy]

In the movie they seemed a little contemptuous towards Marty, but maybe just because he was a little confused,

Ever have older / younger siblings? They're the worst. (And the best.)

The film's coda is that material wealth is the best that life has to offer

Did you see the family at the beginning of the movie and think "These people's problems are that they don't have STUFF"???

 

[Oddish]

BTTF does not trouble itself or audiences with being psychologically displaced by alternate realities. The film's coda is that material wealth is the best that life has to offer, so Marty will never be troubled with living in a world where his own social and psychological development is not at all aligned with that of the altered reality and its impact / shaping / nurturing of his "family" and the world and events around them.

Is it about wealth? Or about George McFly being a self-assured and confident person? The worst element of pre-time travel George's life was not poverty. It was that Biff's bullying him.

Did you see the family at the beginning of the movie and think "These people's problems are that they don't have STUFF"???

I did not. I saw a bullied father, an overweight and judgmental mother, and a brother who worked a dead end job. At the end, I saw a confident George, a Lorraine who took care of herself and appreciated Jennifer, and a brother who was going places.

 

[Skipper]

Did you see the family at the beginning of the movie and think "These people's problems are that they don't have STUFF"???

Of course not. But the film chooses to show us that they are now a "better" family through the lens of their material possessions.



And what are the concerns, the priorities of this new and improved version of George McFly?

"Now, Biff, I want to make sure that we get two coats of wax this time, not just one."

 

[fireproof78]

So George is more confident and not getting conned.

I don't see the material concerns as being the important end result. Confidence and satisfaction are.

 

[Tallguy]

And what are the concerns, the priorities of this new and improved version of George McFly?

Playing tennis with his wife.

He seems to consider getting what he paid for a distraction. And does it seem like it bothers him all that much?

 

[Airmandan]

I hate time travel. You all should watch Dark Matter on Apple TV if you want some trippy multi timeline shit.

 

[Oddish]

Or "Parallels" on TNG.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

But is it his family? Are they the same people who gave birth to him and raised him? Or are they just people with the same name who lived a completely different life?

Of course it's still his family. They just have better lives.

Obviously they still love Marty, so it's not like he's losing anything. He still has the same parents and siblings. They're the same people. Just with better jobs and attitudes and all that.

We don't know if Marty's memories will catch up with the new timeline, but even if they don't, who cares? He has a family that loves him and that's all that matters.

And don't give me that crap about "material wealth". As I said, European film critics. Of course they're going to slam the American Dream. They're going to be as uptight and elitist and snobby as they can. The film's GOAL is not to have wealth, that's just a side benefit at the end. The point is that Marty put his family back together when it was in danger. The point is that the McFlys are happy. If they just happen to be a tad better off in the new timeline, then what the hell, just roll with it!

Yeah, it is just a bit of a coincidence that Marty has the same brother and sister at the end. But in an infinite universe, the likelihood that Dave and Linda will still exist is simultaneously infinitely good and infinitely bad. Meaning, they're no less likely TO exist than to NOT exist.

 

[SithHappens]

This thread has ruined my teenage years ha as I always thought BTTF was pretty tight when it came to time travel with few plot holes

 

[Gaith]

This thread has ruined my teenage years ha as I always thought BTTF was pretty tight when it came to time travel with few plot holes

If Doc takes Marty and Jennifer to the future at the end of the first movie, why do the older versions of themselves still exist in 2015?