Episode of the Week : Space Seed
- Thread starter Botany Bay
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Have to give this one a 9. A very good episode but not quite a 10 for me. I think the fact that the second movie was a sequel to this one helps its popularity for most people. Actually as a kid watching the re-runs in the 70's I would have rated it a 7 or 8 but have come to appreciate it more over the years.
Six.
Marla is the weakest link in this episode. And the mano a supermano between Kirk and Khan: ugh.
Nice character moments as the main cast discusses Khan and history give it added value.
Marla is the weakest link in this episode. And the mano a supermano between Kirk and Khan: ugh.
Nice character moments as the main cast discusses Khan and history give it added value.
I agree - very good character moments. Especially seeing Kirk vs Khan with Spock as back-up.
And very heroic scenes as Khan took control.
McGivers being armed was a good touch.
Montelban was super charismatic.
McGivers falling for Khan in 5 minutes and betraying the Enterprise was the weakest point in the episode for me. She didn't seem like a weak or immoral person so it was difficult to understand. I'd rather she'd been tricked into following them. Still the rest of the episode was so good sometimes you gotta let it go.
Still 8~9/10 Can't decide.
And very heroic scenes as Khan took control.
McGivers being armed was a good touch.
Montelban was super charismatic.
McGivers falling for Khan in 5 minutes and betraying the Enterprise was the weakest point in the episode for me. She didn't seem like a weak or immoral person so it was difficult to understand. I'd rather she'd been tricked into following them. Still the rest of the episode was so good sometimes you gotta let it go.
Still 8~9/10 Can't decide.
I'm sure I'm influenced by the fact that this episode was the catalyst-in the realization of TWoK-to the true rebirth of TOS in the movies. Nonetheless, this is a superb episode with excellent performances from both regular and guest cast. A 10 ten all time episode. A solid 9-plus!
I gave it a six. Great performances by all, especially Ricardo Montalban, but even its link to TWOK isn't enough for me to call it one of my favorites, and I never bought the whole angle with McGivers betraying her captain, shipmates and oath for Khan, no matter how charming he may have been.
10.
Two words: Ricardo Montalban.
And he's not only excellent when he gets angry, but when he's calculating and using his charm.
"I'm sorry, Captain, I was lost in thought."
I've seen every TOS episode, every TOS movie, and I'm going to tell you this:
I've never seen Kirk look in over his head as I did in this episode. And you know something else? I think even Kirk seems to think so. I can practically see Kirk doubt himself as he sits across from Khan. But his defiance of Khan makes him a greater hero than ever.
Aside from the Shatner-Montalban dynamic, I loved the rest of the cast.
Nimoy, Kelley, Nichols and Doohan all contribute to the proceedings.
Great ensemble piece.
Two words: Ricardo Montalban.
And he's not only excellent when he gets angry, but when he's calculating and using his charm.
"I'm sorry, Captain, I was lost in thought."
I've seen every TOS episode, every TOS movie, and I'm going to tell you this:
I've never seen Kirk look in over his head as I did in this episode. And you know something else? I think even Kirk seems to think so. I can practically see Kirk doubt himself as he sits across from Khan. But his defiance of Khan makes him a greater hero than ever.
Aside from the Shatner-Montalban dynamic, I loved the rest of the cast.
Nimoy, Kelley, Nichols and Doohan all contribute to the proceedings.
Great ensemble piece.
I'll give it an 8. It gets points for Montalban, showing us a new ship, the banquet scene, and Khan's ultimatum to the crew after capturing Kirk. McGivers' plotline is the weak spot, though it probably played a little better during 1960s sensibilities, yet still a bit unbelievable. Montalban and Madlyn Rhue had played soulmates before, including as Indians on Bonanza.
One of the first two VHS tapes I bought back around 1983 or so, the other was 'The Menagerie". "Space Seed" was in a gray sleeve and included the Wrath of Khan trailer as a preview.
One of the first two VHS tapes I bought back around 1983 or so, the other was 'The Menagerie". "Space Seed" was in a gray sleeve and included the Wrath of Khan trailer as a preview.
I don't see the problem with the Marla McGivers storyline. From the beginning, she obviously preferred to stay in her fantasyland of painting dictators than going on an away mission. She was always completely infatuated and romanticized such men. Given how this is established from the beginning, I don't see a problem with the way she was completely overwhelmed by Khan', his personality, his looks and his history.
***Psst--You have to say "landing party" in this forum!***
Yeah, somewhere between it being the 60s and McGivers being portrayed as an academic whose subject of obsession came to life, I'll give her behavior a pass, though it wouldn't have flown in a later decade.
Yeah, somewhere between it being the 60s and McGivers being portrayed as an academic whose subject of obsession came to life, I'll give her behavior a pass, though it wouldn't have flown in a later decade.
Why not? She's an active and decisive woman, chasing her personal dreams to great success! She changes sides no less than three times, and triumphs with each coat-turning. In doing so, she saves lots of lives, including those of the main hero and the main villain. While Kirk is as much a relic of the ugly past as Khan is, McGivers is a modern success story whose thinking outside the box not only saves the day in the episode, but also makes possible the follow-on movie.
Remarkably, this seeming action-adventure about space pirates is in the end a battle of ideologies, with Kirk and Khan sharing one and McGivers representing another. It is not for naught that our heroes are shown celebrating Khan's historical tyranny and then giving him every chance to follow the path: it's all about "live and let live", even if both the males at first think their only option is dominance and subjugation of the other.
Timo Saloniemi
Remarkably, this seeming action-adventure about space pirates is in the end a battle of ideologies, with Kirk and Khan sharing one and McGivers representing another. It is not for naught that our heroes are shown celebrating Khan's historical tyranny and then giving him every chance to follow the path: it's all about "live and let live", even if both the males at first think their only option is dominance and subjugation of the other.
Timo Saloniemi
My favorite bit of business in this episode is when the crew thinks Kirk is dead and Spock is taken down to the pressure chamber. He doesn't bat an eyelash upon seeing Kirk waiting to ambush Khan's man and doesn't miss a beat falling in step with Kirk's plan...Kirk and Spock have become a well-oiled machine.
My God.
I'm still only by third episode, Code of Honor, and I'm already changing my lingo.
TOS forever, but I'm enjoying my TNG journey so far!
9 for me. One of my favorites. Among other things, this had one of those what I learned from ST moments with the quote from Paradise Lost although if I remember correctly, didn't they misquote it?
I think the show said, "Better to rule in hell, than serve in Heaven," when it is actually "Better to reign in Hell, than serve in Heaven."
I think the show said, "Better to rule in hell, than serve in Heaven," when it is actually "Better to reign in Hell, than serve in Heaven."
I know you didn't mean it that way, but ... gosh!
And I imagine Khan was a monster in the sack.
I think I oughta go rinse my mind out with soup.
She appears to have a submission kink, and somehow she let's Khan take control of her.
If she hadn't turned on her crew in the first place, maybe none of it would have happened. I don't think she did it b/c she knew Khan would take over the Enterprise and wanted to have his trust so she could betray him and save the ship.
It sounds like you're saying Khan had as much legitimacy to command the Enterprise as Captain Kirk did.
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