ENT to TOS tech downgrade in novels?

[F. King Daniel]

Am I the only one who thinks this ‘explaining why ENT stuff looks more advanced than TOS stuff’ planned for the forthcoming Enterprise novels is ridiculous?

I mean – the reason it looks more advanced is because the original series was made in the 60’s on a super-tight budget. That’s the reason. Deal with it. Do we need an in-universe explanation? Can’t we just admit that Enterprise was re-imagined?

I know what some people would have preferred ENT to look like Space 1999 or something (70’s hair, pyjamas with flares for uniforms and typewriters and Acorn computers for technology) to better fit with TOS. But I’m fairly certain that would have sucked.
(Although I will admit that Enterprise shouldn’t have had *all* the technology available to TOS, which it did. They should have read Diane Carey’s Final Frontier first!)

For people so obsessed, isn’t Star Trek XI a much better fit as a hundred-year upgrade to Enterprise anyway? Or will we have to put up with another convoluted explanation as to why Pike’s Enterprise was built on Earth? (it’s because it looks so cool it’s unbelievable! Look at the shot over Kirk’s shoulder in the trailer, imo one of the most breathtaking Trek shots ever. I can’t believe people can see something so cool and whinge about it. It’s sad.)

And if Pocket are going to novel their way up to the 1701 launch (the TOS version), it’d better not clash with Final Frontier! (or Star Trek Log 7!)

 

[JoeZhang]

Am I the only one who thinks this ‘explaining why ENT stuff looks more advanced than TOS stuff’ planned for the forthcoming Enterprise novels is ridiculous?

Where did you hear this?

I'd agree that it sounds like a waste of paper.

 

[Corran Horn]

It's brought up in the recent Pocket information posted on trekmovie.

 

[Christopher]

For people so obsessed, isn’t Star Trek XI a much better fit as a hundred-year upgrade to Enterprise anyway? Or will we have to put up with another convoluted explanation as to why Pike’s Enterprise was built on Earth?

It's already been established that the movie is in a parallel timeline from TOS. Its Enterprise is a different ship within a different history. The explanation for why it was built on Earth will be provided in the movie, apparently.

The books Margaret is talking about will presumably be building toward the original TOS timeline, which still exists in parallel with the movie's timeline. And in that timeline, the E was still probably assembled in space.

And if Pocket are going to novel their way up to the 1701 launch (the TOS version), it’d better not clash with Final Frontier! (or Star Trek Log 7!)

Why not? There are already multiple incompatible versions of a number of events in Trek history. And there's nothing wrong with that, because it can be rewarding to see how different imaginations approach the same concept. We have multiple incompatible versions of Kirk's first mission, of the end of Kirk's 5-year mission, of what Spock did after "Mirror, Mirror," of Kirk's time at the Academy, of Kirk's history with Carol Marcus, etc. And they're all worthwhile stories offering interesting alternative perspectives.

 

[JD]

While I do kind of agree that we didn't need an explantion, I am very curious to see what the authors are going to come up with.

 

[Kopernikus]

Enterprise gave us an unnecessary but nonetheless quite entertaining explanation for the differences between the TOS- and the ENT-Klingons. Was that an waste of time to? I think it sounds like a good story-opportunity, so let's wait and see what happens.

 

[Rat Boy]

My theory:

Spoiler: Kobayashi Maru & Destiny

It has something to do with the Romulan War, specifically how the Romulans were able to remotely hijack starships. The "downgrade" could be in response to that, similar to how the Galactica didn't have networked computers for fear of a Cylon takeover.

 

[KRAD]

Enterprise gave us an unnecessary but nonetheless quite entertaining explanation for the differences between the TOS- and the ENT-Klingons. Was that an waste of time to? I think it sounds like a good story-opportunity, so let's wait and see what happens.

It's funny, my initial thought regarding "Affliction"/"Divergence" was, indeed, a plaintive "WHY????" I thought "Trials and Tribble-ations" was all we needed. I mostly enjoyed the two-parter (why did it take so long to cast James Avery as a Klingon?????), though the Section 31 stupidity on Enterprise was utterly useless filler that contributed nothing to the story.

I continued to think that right up until I wrote "The Unhappy Ones" for Seven Deadly Sins.

Leaving aside any other considerations, given the disdain for humans that Klingons have always shown, the split between QuchHa' and HemQuch has all kinds of story possibilities, as well as explaining why the Klingons of TOS don't quite do the honor thing as much as the Klingons of the spinoffs. Remember what Laneth said in "Divergence" about how she was now weaker; it's likely that QuchHa' weren't considered "real" Klingons, and by the time TOS rolled around and we were into the second generation of QuchHa', many of them probably didn't think of themselves as real Klingons, and so didn't adhere quite so strongly to the teachings of Kahless.

A lot of these issues are addressed in my 7DS story.

 

[Christopher]

(why did it take so long to cast James Avery as a Klingon?????)

I had the exact same thought. When I wrote a TNG spec script with Klingons back in 1992 (my gods, it's been that long?), I imagined Avery as the main Klingon male guest star, and would've recommended that given the chance.

 

[William Leisner]

so let's wait and see what happens.

That's crazy talk!!!

 

[USS Triumphant]

Spoiler: the last episode of Enterprise

One could always put the differences in technology down to the fact that the entire series was a holodeck simulation in the 24th century. Maybe Riker wanted it that way.

 

[Saul]

I do not think it's ridiculous. I appreciate the fact that they are trying to link Ent with TOS which is what I had always wanted with ENT but never got. I will be with continuity glee reading the explaination they come up. I don't envy the job but sure as heck is interesting to see what it will be. Bring it on, I really enjoy the ENT Novels since they are doing a great job of making Enterprise feel more like a prequel to TOS.

There have been many societies in History which lost technology due to politics, war, disaster, religion.

 

[Christopher]

I'm still not entirely convinced that the technology in TOS is any less advanced than in ENT, at least where function is concerned as opposed to form. In TOS, the ships are faster, the computers are smarter and more vocal, the transporters are more reliable, the weapons are more powerful, the translators are more universal, the communicators and tricorders are about the same, etc. Really, what's gone backwards? Okay, people in ENT seem to have more familiarity with cloaking tech and time travel than people in early TOS did, but the former could be a matter of a simpler cloaking tech being superseded and a more advanced one eventually coming along, and the latter could be a matter of the knowledge being classified.

Well, there do seem to be some reversals in terms of medical science, I'll grant that. Phlox seemed to have a better understanding of genetics and advanced surgical techniques than McCoy sometimes did. Sensors do seem a little less powerful in TOS, in some respects at least. But mainly the differences seem more cosmetic than anything else. Controls look a bit cruder, monitors are in bigger boxes, many computer displays are less graphical, the computers make teletype noises, that sort of thing.

The real issue, it seems, isn't reconciling TOS tech with ENT tech, but with today's tech. A modern cell phone or Blackberry exceeds a TOS communicator in ability and complexity and even rivals a tricorder in some respects. Our modern understanding of neuroscience outpaces what McCoy said 23rd-century medical science was capable of in "The Menagerie." Our genetic and robotic sciences are approaching Trekkish levels already. Of course, a lot of that could be explained as technology loss from WWIII, though that doesn't explain why the Vulcans, Andorians, Tellarites, Klingons, etc. aren't vastly more advanced.

 

[Mysterion]

There have been many societies in History which lost technology due to politics, war, disaster, religion.

The Dark Ages followed by the Renaissance, anyone?

I am very interested to see what gets done with this ENT > TOS plotline. Seems there are a lot of interesting possibilities to explain the hows and whys involved.

 

[KRAD]

I appreciate the fact that they are trying to link Ent with TOS which is what I had always wanted with ENT but never got.

Huh? All the fourth season was was a giant ol' link to TOS.........

(Okay, I exaggerate. But not by much....)

 

[William Leisner]

Well, there do seem to be some reversals in terms of medical science, I'll grant that. Phlox seemed to have a better understanding of genetics and advanced surgical techniques than McCoy sometimes did.

Though that could largely be attributed to the fact that McCoy was an Old Country Doctor who joined Starfleet later in his career, whereas Phlox came to the NX-01 with a much broader medical background. Even compared to his contemporary, Dr. M'Benga, Bones had only a basic understanding of non-human medical matters. And really, even in the 21st century, how many physicians have anything more than the most rudimentary understanding of genetics or computer-assisted microsurgery?

 

[Sci]

The real issue, it seems, isn't reconciling TOS tech with ENT tech, but with today's tech. A modern cell phone or Blackberry exceeds a TOS communicator in ability

A modern mobile telecommunications device requires a complex network of relays and satellites to function and is incapable of propagating its signal at FTL speeds through subspace, let alone broadcasting its signal to an orbiting space ship with no relay.

And Captain Kirk's communicators didn't stop working when he got into an elevator.

and complexity and even rivals a tricorder in some respects.

.... I have yet to encounter a cell phone capable of emitting a sensor beam capable of telling you detailed sub-surface information. The most any cell phone I've ever seen can do is take a picture.

 

[Trent Roman]

I'm still not entirely convinced that the technology in TOS is any less advanced than in ENT, at least where function is concerned as opposed to form. In TOS, the ships are faster, the computers are smarter and more vocal, the transporters are more reliable, the weapons are more powerful, the translators are more universal, the communicators and tricorders are about the same, etc. Really, what's gone backwards?

I'd be inclined to agree. The gap between ENT and TOS is more one of aesthetics than practical performance, and that can be explained away easily enough given the vissectitudes of fashion. At some point a few decades prior to TOS, the Federation experienced a massive, overdetermining wave of retro nostalgia which affected everything from ship design to interior decoration and clothing (also explains the bad hair of STII and III). There are enough silly theories about such things today that I can easily see a school of thought forming where it would be seen as aesthetically pleasing, more honest or even psychologically beneficial to have starships look like a child's Duplo set. When we get to TNG, we see the last of that craze (the earlier season uniforms, complete with skirts) finally dying out, and the preceeding era is hereafter referred to as the Dark Century by Federation fashionistas.

Fictitiously yours, Trent Roman

 

[flandry84]

Funnily,when I'm reading TOS lit,I'm kinda imaging a more "teched-up" Enterprise,complete with computer readouts/visuals.Same goes for the Vanguard books.

As for the McCoy thing,I've always thought that poor Bones was badly served by the writers,constantly portraying him as this wilfully pernickity geezer less at home with the realities of his 24 th century milieu than is really credible.Whatever your views on the medical profession,they are rarely unintelligent.

 

[Christopher]

A modern mobile telecommunications device requires a complex network of relays and satellites to function and is incapable of propagating its signal at FTL speeds through subspace, let alone broadcasting its signal to an orbiting space ship with no relay.

And Captain Kirk's communicators didn't stop working when he got into an elevator.

All true, but the point is, if a communicator can do all that, you'd think it could handle video and data too.

and complexity and even rivals a tricorder in some respects.

.... I have yet to encounter a cell phone capable of emitting a sensor beam capable of telling you detailed sub-surface information. The most any cell phone I've ever seen can do is take a picture.

Hence "in some respects." I was speaking more of the computing and memory functions, and the overall multifunctionality.