Dr. Crusher's Staff and Resonsibilities.

[Vanyel]

I mentioned this before in another thread, but I thought it could use a full discussion.

Crusher was the CMO of a ship, the 1701D, that seemed to have about 1,000 people on it at any one time. We know she wasn't the only doctor on board too. So how big was her staff, and if her staff was big enough would she be seeing patients on a regular basis, or would a CMO be mostly a desk job, with only the occasional patient, help in emergenecies and help with difficult/strange diagnosis'?

I would imagine her staff to be rather large, at least 10 doctors, 1 doctor for ever 100 people, with 1 of them being her assistant and a few dozen nurses. Field medics would come under her command as well, as would Troi and all the other counselors.

A ship with as large a compliment as the 1701D, and with several doctors under her and other medical staff, would her position (or any CMO on a Galaxy Class or approximately sized ship) be mostly a desk job? Attending senior staff meetings and such.

I compared her to Dr, Cuddy from House, a Medical Doctor, who rarely saw patients, but signed off on unusual procedures and represented the doctors and staff at Board meetings.

Well, I do think her staff is rather large, at least as large as I mentioned, and that she'd be a mostly in her office filling out reports, assigning duties to her staff as needed, and other office work.

 

[Squiggy]

What does the medical department of an aircraft carrier look like?

 

[Sandoval]

I think ten doctors is overestimating things. This isn't a hospital that is being sought out by the sick, this is a medical facility aboard a starship full of fit, healthy 24th century people.

Three doctors including Crusher I can accept, perhaps even four at a push, but not ten.

 

[Vanyel]

I think ten doctors is overestimating things. This isn't a hospital that is being sought out by the sick, this is a medical facility aboard a starship full of fit, healthy 24th century people.

Three doctors including Crusher I can accept, perhaps even four at a push, but not ten.

I was thinking that by including 3 shifts for a 24 hour rotation. The ship doesn't go to bed at 1000. Then an extra or 2 for leaves and such.

 

[Sandoval]

Actually most of the ship probably does go to bed at 1000, given that the night shifts are always portrayed as being quieter with less people moving around.

But that aside, a thousand people isn't a lot in real terms. Think of a school with 1000 pupils and how many of those require medical attention on a daily basis. Probably only a few a week, if that.

 

[sonak]

I think ten doctors is overestimating things. This isn't a hospital that is being sought out by the sick, this is a medical facility aboard a starship full of fit, healthy 24th century people.

Three doctors including Crusher I can accept, perhaps even four at a push, but not ten.

smaller naval ships like destroyers or cruisers often have three or four medical personnel on board. I think ten would actually be about right for a ship the size of the Ent-D.

don't forget about when they go into battle or deal with a medical crisis. Three or four would be too low.

 

[Sandoval]

smaller naval ships like destroyers or cruisers often have three or four medical personnel on board. I think ten would actually be about right for a ship the size of the Ent-D.

Three or four medical personnel is not the same as having three or four doctors though is it? I'd wager that these destroyers of which you speak don't have three or four doctors, but rather one doctor and three assistants, possibly two doctors.

Likewise I'd imagine that a modern aircraft carrier home to a thousand crew doesn't have ten doctors.

 

[sonak]

smaller naval ships like destroyers or cruisers often have three or four medical personnel on board. I think ten would actually be about right for a ship the size of the Ent-D.

Three or four medical personnel is not the same as having three or four doctors though is it? I'd wager that these destroyers of which you speak don't have three or four doctors, but rather one doctor and three assistants, possibly two doctors.

Likewise I'd imagine that a modern aircraft carrier home to a thousand crew doesn't have ten doctors.

yeah, medical personnel, not necessarily doctors.

 

[Vanyel]

smaller naval ships like destroyers or cruisers often have three or four medical personnel on board. I think ten would actually be about right for a ship the size of the Ent-D.

Three or four medical personnel is not the same as having three or four doctors though is it? I'd wager that these destroyers of which you speak don't have three or four doctors, but rather one doctor and three assistants, possibly two doctors.

Likewise I'd imagine that a modern aircraft carrier home to a thousand crew doesn't have ten doctors.

You're right about a modern Super carrier. However, when it comes to major medical problems, its bandage them up, do all you can, keep therm comfortable and get them to a hospital. Not always possible for a starship out exploring.

The Glaxay class is designed for deep space travel and being a year or more from a starbase (Though they seem to be mostly a week or two from a base.) They are also designed for emergency help and evacuations, something for which a larger Medical staff would be needed.

 

[MacLeod]

I think ten doctors is overestimating things. This isn't a hospital that is being sought out by the sick, this is a medical facility aboard a starship full of fit, healthy 24th century people.

Three doctors including Crusher I can accept, perhaps even four at a push, but not ten.

Well to compare the Constitution Class ship with a compliment of 430 had two Doctor's. In case of the Enterprise, Doctor's McCoy and M'Benga

 

[Sandoval]

I think ten doctors is overestimating things. This isn't a hospital that is being sought out by the sick, this is a medical facility aboard a starship full of fit, healthy 24th century people.

Three doctors including Crusher I can accept, perhaps even four at a push, but not ten.

Well to compare the Constitution Class ship with a compliment of 430 had two Doctor's. In case of the Enterprise, Doctor's McCoy and M'Benga

So around twice the people on a Galaxy class equals four doctors. I can buy that.

 

[JRoss]

Yeah, but factor in the children. Children need lots of care. We know there are two sickbays at least. Figure one doctor on at all times, with three shifts makes six doctors easily.

 

[Vanyel]

I think ten doctors is overestimating things. This isn't a hospital that is being sought out by the sick, this is a medical facility aboard a starship full of fit, healthy 24th century people.

Three doctors including Crusher I can accept, perhaps even four at a push, but not ten.

Well to compare the Constitution Class ship with a compliment of 430 had two Doctor's. In case of the Enterprise, Doctor's McCoy and M'Benga

So around twice the people on a Galaxy class equals four doctors. I can buy that.

The 1701 was all Starfleet personnel. A Galaxy class has Starfleet and civilians, including children. I would imagine that just like today when one kid in class gets a nasty bug, several others in that class will too.

Also I would like to touch on a few things.

Comparing a Galaxy class to a carrier or super carrier is an unfair comparison. While modern carriers are capable of doing most surgeries, they can't do it all. The ship rocks and sways. The doctor may be used to it, but delicate surgeries which are risky on dry land would be even more so on a carrier, so those patients would be sent ashore a soon as needed or possible. Those aren't issues on a Galaxy class, except in very rare circumstances (Brothers). Since it can do more it would need more doctors.

Also the ship never sleeps. Before Jellico it was a 3 shift rotation, meaning 8 hours on 16 off; post Jellico it was 4 shift rotation meaning 6 hours on 18 hours off. Either way, it's a lot of free time, so the ship should be hopping all day.

 

[Vanyel]

Yeah, but factor in the children. Children need lots of care. We know there are two sickbays at least. Figure one doctor on at all times, with three shifts makes six doctors easily.

Maybe a 4 shift rotation post Jellico.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

Actually most of the ship probably does go to bed at 1000, given that the night shifts are always portrayed as being quieter with less people moving around.

But that aside, a thousand people isn't a lot in real terms. Think of a school with 1000 pupils and how many of those require medical attention on a daily basis. Probably only a few a week, if that.

Schools aren't normally sailing amongst the stars, where possibly hostile aliens species live

 

[Sandoval]

Schools aren't normally sailing amongst the stars, where possibly hostile aliens species live

I didn't say they were, I think you're misunderstanding what is meant by a comparison with a school containing a similar number of children to the 1000-strong crew of the Enterprise.

That aside your statement is largely irrelevant given that the Enterprise is not a school with 1000 pupils, but rather a starship with a small school onboard for a few dozen children.

 

[Tomalak]

Well Voyager seemed to have just one doctor and one nurse for a crew of 150, and no one else seemed to have any medical training beyond basic first aid.

It would be odd if all the crew members with medical expertise were wiped out during the jump into the Delta Quadrant, but not impossible. I seem to recall their mission was only supposed to last a few weeks, so it is possible there were more medics who never even made it on board. Although, it would seem remiss to go into a combat situation in a dangerous region of space without a full medical staff.

Based on that, I suppose for 1,000 people they could cope with seven or eight doctors, perhaps some of those specialising in surgery, paediatrics etc. Then there are thehttp://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Psychiatrist psychologists, such as Troi, who might have some emergency medical training. The science staff could probably be roped in to serve as triage medics and orderlies in a crisis. There could well have been civilian specialists on the ship too, such as Dr Toby Russell.

 

[Squiggy]

It would be odd if all the crew members with medical expertise were wiped out during the jump into the Delta Quadrant, but not impossible.

It's stated in Memory Alpha that the "entire" medical crew was killed. That would denote more than a couple of people.

 

[Timo]

The idea of Crusher having a great many colleagues is somewhat at odds with the portrayal of her daily routines: it's she who gets to treat petty sprains and allergies, in addition to the bookkeeping on medical shipments, the designing of new instruments, the unraveling of new mysteries of biology, and the curing of horrible pandemics ravaging not just the ship but the week's guest colony as well. If she has staff, she also appears to have real problems with delegating.

Of course, it's also possible that the three or more MDs aboard keep themselves updated on the latest in every field of practical and theoretical medicine by treating the sprained ankles one week, writing the groundbreaking papers the next week, and organizing the disaster relief missions the week after that.

But the evidence can be interpreted either way. One doctor per 1000 patients, available for 8 hours per day, is plenty here on Earth. Three might be overkill unless one of these were a specialist in, say, dentistry, while the others didn't know a molar from a mole. Since we never saw more than two doctors at a time (and even then one was a guest), it shouldn't be impossible to argue that this is all they got.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[Squiggy]

Dr. Selar served on D with Pulaski and Crusher.