Does it bother you Riker got the USS Titan and not a Galaxy class?

[TheSubCommander]

Does it bother anyone that Riker was assigned to the USS Titan, a ship basically the size of Voyager, instead of a Galaxy class? Even if the Titan is supposedly the latest exploration ship, I find it hard to think he would downgrade to a smaller vessel. It doesn't seem to jibe with me for several reasons:

1. He had served on the Enterprise-D for 15 years, and didn't want to leave.
2. In ALG, he was so attached that he saved the E-D from mothball, and hotrodded it out as his personal flagship.
3. At the end of Generations, he seemed far more broken up about the loss of E-D, than Picard, even going as far as to say he had always assumed he would be taking over command, when Picard moved on to Admiral or something.
4. Again, I know it is supposed to be a long range exploration vessel, and state of the art. But what can the Titan do, that an upgraded Galaxy class can't do better? Basically, like the same arguments people make about Voyager VS Enterprise D, if you took a Galaxy and gave it all the modern tech of the Titan, naturally, the Galaxy class should be the better ship.
5. Being on the neutral zone, with all those Warbird running around, wouldn't it make more sense to have a Galaxy that is proven capable to go toe to toe with them, rather than an untested Titan?

So what say you? Personally, I think it makes a lot more sense that Riker should have been assigned a Galaxy Class ship. I think a refit Galaxy class, akin to AGT Enterprise D would have been right up his alley.

 

[JarodRussell]

Whatever ship class the Titan is, it surely wouldn't look as ugly as the one that won that fan contest. I think it's a good think it isn't canon.

And it was one of the things I disliked about Nemesis. Riker ALWAYS wanted to command the Enterprise some day. Picard should have been promoted and Riker should have replaced him. The film was about change and progression anyways, so why not have Picard accept the promotion to Admiral?

 

[2takesfrakes]

Considering that we were never going to get to see Riker commanding the TITAN, in the first place, any thought about what class of vessel it was, or how appropriate it would be having someone of Riker's callibur commanding it never crossed my mind. Now that you mention it, however, it would've come across as FanBoy Wank, to give Riker his own Galaxy Class vessel. That such a command would even be available isn't unrealistic, per se, but it does seem a bit too convenient. I suspect it worked out for the best, the way Riker's first command panned out ...

 

[JarodRussell]

Wasn't Riker's first command the one where he saved Earth from the Borg? Or the one where he saved the Enterprise from a Ferengi surprise attack (back then when the writers still thought the Ferengi were dangerous villains)?

 

[2takesfrakes]

... why not have Picard accept the promotion to Admiral?

Because none other than Captain James T. Kirk advised Picard not to.

 

[2takesfrakes]

Riker's first command was a Klingon Bird of Prey.

 

[BillJ]

So what say you? Personally, I think it makes a lot more sense that Riker should have been assigned a Galaxy Class ship. I think a refit Galaxy class, akin to AGT Enterprise D would have been right up his alley.

I don't remember them identifying what class Titan was in the movie? If they didn't, then you can assume it's whatever class you want it to be.

 

[Makarov]

They never let Picard get promoted, get married, or show Riker leaving the Enterprise, because the writers never willingly change the formula of the crew. Aside from cast members that want to leave for whatever reason.

I recently watched through Battlestar Galactica and it has the same thing. They try to do all these epic storylines on BSG but when it comes down to it, they rarely ever change the formula of the crew.

I don't mind it with Star Trek because you know that's what you're in for but with BSG I expected more. It would have been cool to see Riker take command though in the show or the movies, that's one reason why I enjoy All Good Things so much.

 

[JarodRussell]

It's ironic how many challenges the TOS movies took. Promote Kirk, turn the Enterprise into a training ship under Spock's command, introduce Kirk's son, kill off Kirk's son, kill off Spock, destroy the Enterprise, have a film without the Enterprise and with the crew as renegades, etc... the TNG films played it pretty safe. Except for destroying the Enterprise, nothing really changed.

 

[Timo]

...And for that very reason, I would have been very disappointed had Riker gotten the command of the E-D, the E-E, or some successor Galaxy or Sovereign. What Riker wants for most of TNG and associated movies is to not move forward at all. Starfleet would do well to punish him for such uselessness and try and get back the old Riker who in the early seasons of TNG had ideas, initiative, and ambition.

If Riker got a ship of the type described in the novels and associated artwork, I'd consider it a promotion: from a bloated barge to a ship that does and goes. But more significantly, I'd consider it a cutting of the umbilical cord, a moving out of Picard's basement. Riker has skipped that part of his career where he'd demonstrate the ability to command smaller ships, so it's high time.

Timo Saloniemi

 

[C.E. Evans]

This thread would be better suited in the Trek Lit forum because outside of the novels, the Titan is an unknown design. As such, she could very well be another Galaxy-class ship or even the first of the "Titan-class," a possibly even bigger design.

 

[Levi]

I agree. I think it would have been a lot more realistic for Picard to take a promotion to Admiral or Commodore (They offered him Command of the Academy, couldnt he still take that?), and Riker should have taken over the Enterprise. It seems like that would have been a lot better for the story line then what they did. It shows progression and shows how starfleet officers move on and up.
However, the way they did it is also common place. Riker wanted the Enterprise, however you dont always get the command you want. Riker stayed a Commander and passed up commands several times, this may have hurt his chances. But eventually, he had to take a command or be left behind. Picard also has the right to stay a Captain, and honestly, I can see it from Picards view too. If I was in Command of the Flag ship of StarFleet, I would pass up promotions to Admiral so I could stay Captain of a ship as long as I could. Even if that meant how I would end my career.

In the end, any way works for me. We don't get to plan out exactly how our careers go. I doubt its the same in Starfleet. Riker wanted the Enterprise, but he didn't get it. But he still seemed happy in the end.

If I was First Officer on a Sovereign Class ship, I would want to command one myself very much so. But if the time came to be promoted to Captain and SF Command thought I was better suited to Command say, a Prometheus Class, then so be it!

 

[TheSubCommander]

I suppose technically Nemesis never named the class of Titan in the film, it could be imagined as any class, and if that were the case, I would choose it to be a Galaxy class.

But since some sources initially reported it to be Prometheus class, and of course the books have it as a Luna class, when I opened this thread it was with the assumption it was one of those two. A Prometheus class could be powerful enough a ship I suppose (it seemed tough enough the Romulans wanted to capture it in Voyager) for the mission Riker was put in command of, but since I haven't read the pocket books, I admittedly don't know much about the Luna class, other than it seems like it is comparable to an Intrepid class, being slightly larger.

Still, if you are going to be assigned a never-before assigned task to patrol the Romulan border and be an envoy to the Romulans, seems to me more a job for a capital ship, like a Galaxy, or Sovereign, and for reasons I stated earlier, I like the idea of Riker having a Galaxy class, maybe even modded like the AGT version, or somewhere in between that and the USS Venture.

As for Riker not getting Enterprise-E, I think when they made Nemesis, it was left open like that because they didn't know at the time if there would be a sequel to Nemesis or not. Had there been, I am sure we would have seen Picard and Riker on a joint mission with both ships, sort of like Excelsior and Enterprise in ST6.

As for Riker not getting the ship he wanted because his career was hurt for turning other commands down, I far from agree. Spending 15 years as Picard's XO? Learning from him and gaining experience on probably the best ship in the fleet? Let's not forget that Riker is credited for being in command of Enterprise, when they saved earth from the Borg in BOBW, and being on the Phoenix during the first warp flight. How does that hurt you? Answer, it doesn't. Riker was arguably more distinguished as an XO, than the majority of captains of lesser, aging vehicles doing mundane, eventless sensor sweeps in uncharted nebulas.

 

[BillJ]

As for Riker not getting the ship he wanted because his career was hurt for turning other commands down, I far from agree. Spending 15 years as Picard's XO? Learning from him and gaining experience on probably the best ship in the fleet? Let's not forget that Riker is credited for being in command of Enterprise, when they saved earth from the Borg in BOBW, and being on the Phoenix during the first warp flight. How does that hurt you? Answer, it doesn't. Riker was arguably more distinguished as an XO, than the majority of captains of lesser, aging vehicles doing mundane, eventless sensor sweeps in uncharted nebulas.

This is just trying to explain something that makes absolutely no sense. Post-"The Best of Both Worlds", Riker was nothing more than Picard's administrative assistant. Riker was essentially blocking other officers, including Data, from serving and learning under Picard because he was afraid of the big chair. Picard could've trained ten future starship captains during the time Riker squatted on the position.

 

[Finn]

Like what some said already, we don't even know what class the Titan was canonically

 

[Kevman7987]

This is just trying to explain something that makes absolutely no sense. Post-"The Best of Both Worlds", Riker was nothing more than Picard's administrative assistant. Riker was essentially blocking other officers, including Data, from serving and learning under Picard because he was afraid of the big chair. Picard could've trained ten future starship captains during the time Riker squatted on the position.

I'm actually of the thought that Starfleet sent a memo to Riker that said to take this command or they would remove him from the Enterprise for starbase command duty; Or to paraphrase a line from the film Eagle Eye, a "job where you have to touch shit with your hands" as a punishment.

You can't pass up commands every other day for 15 years while preventing Picard from training other future starship captains and not have Starfleet get irritated. That one scene in BOBW where Riker yells at Shelby in the turbolift kind of pisses me off now. Shelby was right and Riker is kind of a dumbass for being so shocked that someone else wanted his job. He really should have taken a command after the Borg incident. Let Data (as XO) and Troi's replacement (she'll follow Riker) watch over Picard's mental health.

 

[2takesfrakes]

From day one, Gene Roddenberry, et al, knew that they were going to be in that dilemma, because Riker was a young studd. And Frakes was painted into a corner with the character, because the question was always going to come up, "why isn't Riker the captain?" whether it was the audience asking, or one of the characters. And the sort of brush-off responses Riker would give to that are entirely unsatisfactory.

So, in effect, the solution was the introduction of this absurd regulation, now, where it's the First Officer's job to go on Away Missions. But the stupidity of this shoehorned stipulation became its own problem and never ended up equating to why Riker never left the ship, anyway. Once they realized that, of course, they played fast and loose with it, until the whole thing was only brought up just to have Picard defy it. In short, Frakes' job was always kind of threatened because GR didn't want another Spock character as First Officer - Data. So, for the set-up to be different it had to not work, basically. It's really strange, actually, but when Riker finally got his own command, I was happy that very little was made of it. This had been overdue far too long and there's just no hype there, anyway, because there's not going to be another TNG spinoff, because the movies keep losing all this money ...

 

[Melakon]

It's never bothered me; he's a fictional character. Riker could be commanding a garbage scow for all I care.

 

[Avro Arrow]

Does it bother anyone that Riker was assigned to the USS Titan, a ship basically the size of Voyager, instead of a Galaxy class?

No, it doesn't bother me at all.

1. He had served on the Enterprise-D for 15 years, and didn't want to leave.

Well, the -D and -E combined for 15 years, but I know what you mean. But by that point, he had to realize that it'd take dynamite to get Picard out of the Enterprise's captain's chair permanently, so if he wanted his own ship he'd have to leave.

2. In ALG, he was so attached that he saved the E-D from mothball, and hotrodded it out as his personal flagship.

But the -D is destroyed in this timeline, so this is moot.

3. At the end of Generations, he seemed far more broken up about the loss of E-D, than Picard, even going as far as to say he had always assumed he would be taking over command, when Picard moved on to Admiral or something.

He thought wrong... Picard's not leaving.

4. Again, I know it is supposed to be a long range exploration vessel, and state of the art. But what can the Titan do, that an upgraded Galaxy class can't do better? Basically, like the same arguments people make about Voyager VS Enterprise D, if you took a Galaxy and gave it all the modern tech of the Titan, naturally, the Galaxy class should be the better ship.

So the Titan is supposedly a "lesser" ship, but you need to give Titan's technology to a Galaxy in order for the Galaxy to be better?

5. Being on the neutral zone, with all those Warbird running around, wouldn't it make more sense to have a Galaxy that is proven capable to go toe to toe with them, rather than an untested Titan?

Umm... Enterprise never actually seemed to do that well in battle unless it was against a foe it significantly outgunned. That starboard power coupling was especially vulnerable...

So what say you? Personally, I think it makes a lot more sense that Riker should have been assigned a Galaxy Class ship. I think a refit Galaxy class, akin to AGT Enterprise D would have been right up his alley.

Riker was in command in Rascals, and he let the ship get captured by Ferengi in outdated Klingon BOPs. Riker was in command in Generations, and he let the ship get destroyed by a single outdated Klingon BOP. I'd say he's lucky Starfleet gave him a ship at all.

I agree. I think it would have been a lot more realistic for Picard to take a promotion to Admiral or Commodore (They offered him Command of the Academy, couldnt he still take that?)

That was in season 1, wasn't it? I'm sure Starfleet didn't just leave the position open for 15 years in case Picard changed his mind...

 

[LeadHead]

Nah, I never needed for Riker to take command of a Galaxy or Sovereign class ship. At the end of Nemesis, they said that the Titan was heading up the new task force near the Neutral Zone, so his ship was clearly advanced and important. I liked the Titan design that they used in the novels because it was a good design, but it also didn't seem that Riker got a hand me down ship. Something very similar to a Galaxy or a Sovereign class would have been a mistake.