DISH Network adding a lot of new HD channels soon.

[Johnny Rico]

As of now, the most HD channels that any provider has had is around the 30 mark. Apparently, that's all about to change. Many more national channels are finally getting an HD feed. One of those, is ironically the Science Channel. In fact, several of the Discovery Networks are getting HD feeds shortly. With Disc HD Theater (which is actually separate from the regular Discovery Channel with different programming), the regular Disc Chan is getting an HD feed as well as TLC, Science Channel, Animal Planet, and even the History Channel. Those are coming in August and early September, with even more coming later in September.

A Music Channel called MHD will carry HD content from MTV, VH1 and CMT.

For full story, read here.

 

[Outpost4]

DirecTV is doing someting similar. This fall they are greatly expanding their HDTV movie channels line-up, with the networks being offered by Dish coming later. Also being added soon are local network stations (NBC, CBS, etc.) being re-broadcast in HDTV.

With an addtional satellite being launched early next year, DirecTV will be able to broadcast 150 national and 1,500 local channels in HDTV.

Look for 2008 to be a big year regarding HDTV from both satellite services.

Here is a May, 2007, write-up on these changes from DirecTV.

 

[Harmon Bokai]

That's assuming they're able to get their birds in place. I have Verizon FIOS and will probably be getting all of those channels, except MHD.

I've had MHD since February.

Oh, and none of my HD signals are compressed like with satellite.

 

[Gertch]

I really like DISH and may go for one of the HD upgrades they are offering. But I really want to get FIOS. I can save almost a hundred bucks by bundling different services with them.

As for DISH, I wish they could offer ala carte. I get 50 million sports channels I never use and the ever increasing amounts of Hispanic channels. I don't get enough of the nature or learning style channels and they just moved a fricken shopping channel from their normal range to between regular stations.

But the increase in HD channels is still making it more attractive to upgrade.

 

[Johnny Rico]

Gertch said:
I really like DISH and may go for one of the HD upgrades they are offering. But I really want to get FIOS. I can save almost a hundred bucks by bundling different services with them.

As for DISH, I wish they could offer ala carte. I get 50 million sports channels I never use and the ever increasing amounts of Hispanic channels. I don't get enough of the nature or learning style channels and they just moved a fricken shopping channel from their normal range to between regular stations.

But the increase in HD channels is still making it more attractive to upgrade.

50 million? Wow! That few? I get a Gazillion shopping channels that I don't use/need.

 

[cubbie]

Is it going to cost more? I"m paying the $20 for the 30 channels already

 

[Johnny Rico]

cubbie said:
Is it going to cost more? I"m paying the $20 for the 30 channels already

I don't think so. In fact, I think once all channels go to HD and people will either have to upgrade their SDTV to an HDTV or get a converter box, the $20 premium price now may be revoked, as having HD will be the standard instead of the luxury it is now.

 

[cubbie]

That would be really nice. Thanks!

 

[Michael Chris]

I seriously wish FiOS was available here. That'd rock.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Does Dish compress the hell out of their channels like a certain other sat service does?

Johnny Rico said: In fact, I think once all channels go to HD and people will either have to upgrade their SDTV to an HDTV or get a converter box

That is NOT what is happening.

The upcoming deadline has nothing to do with HDTV as such. It doesn't even have anything to do with cable or satellite - if you have those, you will never notice that any change occurred.

It's only concerning OVER-THE-AIR broadcasts. And even then, it's only transitioning to all-digital broadcasts. All digital, but NOT all HD. (All HD is digital, but not all digital is HD.)

 

[Johnny Rico]

Babaganoosh said:
Does Dish compress the hell out of their channels like a certain other sat service does?

Well, here's what I know. Currently E* (Echostar - DISH Network) and D* (DirecTV) both use MPEG2 compression, which isn't all that efficient by today's standards. So they're both changing to the newer, more efficient compression format, MPEG4 which is what iPods use.

This will allow more channels to fit on the satellite transponders. In essence, it'll double the number of channel bandwidth that is available now. So where only 6 channels fit previously, 12 will now fit. How that breaks down between SD and HD signals is a little more complicated.

But in the long run, this compression and available bandwidth limitation is what has kept more HD channels from going on-line.

E* is going MPEG4 on Aug. 15, and D* is going MPEG4 soon thereafter as well I believe.

Johnny Rico said: In fact, I think once all channels go to HD and people will either have to upgrade their SDTV to an HDTV or get a converter box

That is NOT what is happening.

The upcoming deadline has nothing to do with HDTV as such. It doesn't even have anything to do with cable or satellite - if you have those, you will never notice that any change occurred.

It's only concerning OVER-THE-AIR broadcasts. And even then, it's only transitioning to all-digital broadcasts. All digital, but NOT all HD. (All HD is digital, but not all digital is HD.)

Oh, I know. What I was saying is that once most channels go HD, the service providers will probably have to drop the HD premium on their bills. Right now E* charges $20/month for HD service. Either that or all of our bills will go up accordingly.

 

[Alpinemaps]

Okay, so I have a few questions.

I currently am a cable subscriber, with an HDTV. I have high speed Internet via the cable service. While there is a telephone line coming into the house, I don't have a phone line turned on (my cell phones work just fine for a home phone).

Additionally, I'm a big baseball fan, and my local team (San Diego Padres) have a television contract with the local cable company (there is no OTA broadcast). To make matters even more confusing - even though I live in San Diego County, my zip code is considered a Los Angeles television market by the FCC.

I would like to switch to Dish or DirecTV, because of the reasons you guys mentioned. Especially with the idea of the impending HD channels. Costs seem to be lower.

The big questions I have:

- What do those of you with a satellite do for high speed Internet? What are my options?
- Would I still get the local baseball team? (MLB Extra Innings, perhaps?)
- What sort of costs am I looking at?

 

[Johnny Rico]

Alpinemaps said:
The big questions I have:

- What do those of you with a satellite do for high speed Internet? What are my options?

We use Verizon DSL. We also use Verizon for our home phone land line. We have never gone without a landline. We've lived in this house for nearly 40 years, and have been there since rotary phones.

My DSL line is a 1.5 Mbps line. I could probably go faster with a cable connection, but cable TV sucks big donkey balls in our area.

- Would I still get the local baseball team? (MLB Extra Innings, perhaps?)

Well, are you talking HD broadcasts? If so, then E* has recently added a bunch of HD RSNs (Regional Sports Networks). If you get a Fox Sports Net in your area that covers your local MLB games, then more than likely you might already have or soon will get an HD feed of that channel.

I live in southern Illinois and our RSN is FSN-MW which plays St. Louis Cardinals games. Apparently E* added 9 HD RSNs earlier this year, and just this past week added 8 more, for a total of 17 currently. Next month they're supposed to add even more.

- What sort of costs am I looking at?

Generally, the HD packages costs $20 more than the regular package of the same channels. But you'll ocntinue to get more and more HD channels as they come on-line, at no additional cost.

 

[Alpinemaps]

Johnny Rico said:

- Would I still get the local baseball team? (MLB Extra Innings, perhaps?)

Well, are you talking HD broadcasts? If so, then E* has recently added a bunch of HD RSNs (Regional Sports Networks). If you get a Fox Sports Net in your area that covers your local MLB games, then more than likely you might already have or soon will get an HD feed of that channel.

Cox Cable here in San Diego has the broadcast rights for the Padres. The other cable stations lease out the rights to rebroadcast, both the SD and HD broadcasts.

Unfortunately, that means we have no OTA nor a regional sports channel (like FSN), that broadcasts the games. I think the Phillies are the only other team that has a similar arrangement.

I'll have to look into the MLB Extra Innings to see if Padres games are broadcast on there. Being able to watch my team every night a big plus for me, and probably the biggest barrier keeping me from making the switch (bigger than cable vs DSL)

 

[Johnny Rico]

Alpinemaps said:
I'll have to look into the MLB Extra Innings to see if Padres games are broadcast on there. Being able to watch my team every night a big plus for me, and probably the biggest barrier keeping me from making the switch (bigger than cable vs DSL)

I just read from a transcript from the June "Charlie Chat" (CEO of E*) that "MLB Extra Innings" is exclusive to D*. So if that is important to you, then I guess you'd be better off getting D* (DirecTV).

Here's the relevant portion with the MLB part bolded:

Henry: DirecTV claims they are going to launch 100 or so HD channels, what are you going to do to counter and what do you plan on launching? Also, what happened with the negotiations with MLB Extra Innings?

Answers: MLB chose to sign exclusively with DirecTV, DISH participated in the hearings to get that changed but it did not work out. Part of the deal included adding a MLB channel and provide to all subscribers, which would have caused in increase in cost to the customer. It is available to customers via the Internet for half the price for those with broadband. As far as new channels we are talking with those that are coming out with new HD channels but nothing firm at this point. Imagines that by the end of the year that we’ll be in the 40’s (currently at 32 today). Will continue to be a leader in HD. Talking with the top rated SD channels today, probably another 6 – 8 channels this year. Also looking at new HD channels like Smithsonian HD, which will only be in HD. Also in negotiations with others channels that are planning on launching their HD channels at the end of the year and into next year.

 

[Harmon Bokai]

I had D* for nine years (and E* for five). Both services have some issues that you should be aware of: bandwidth being the biggest.

Neither of them, right now, have enough birds (satellites) to service all of the HD content they claim to be rolling out this fall. In addition, they heavily compress the video signal.

I was startled when I switched to Verizon FIOS this past winter...to see a massive improvement in picture quality. Also, I have, currently, 28 HD channels with a virtually unlimited amount of room for adding more, all uncompressed. I believe FIOS is being rolled out in So. Cal. so you might look into it.

Barring FIOS, and assuming the Padres are a major priority, you might be best served staying with Cox. The things that made satellite TV so worthwhile a decade ago, as compared with cable, really aren't such clear advantages anymore.

Oh, by the way, there's also been a lot of issues with D* receivers failing, rapidly. And that can a be a big pain in the butt.

 

[Johnny Rico]

Garak11 said:
I had D* for nine years (and E* for five). Both services have some issues that you should be aware of: bandwidth being the biggest.

Well yeah, that's always going to be an issue with something that has finite space. Fiber optics don't have that problem, but satellite transponders obviously do, so compression is the only option.

Neither of them, right now, have enough birds (satellites) to service all of the HD content they claim to be rolling out this fall. In addition, they heavily compress the video signal.

Well, that's being solved in two ways. One, the switch to MPEG4 compression from MPEG2, and the addition of new birds. E* is supposed to launch some new birds soon. D* dish just launched DirectTV 10, and E* is supposed to get another one or two up sometime in the near future as well.

But back to the MPEG4 thing. That'll essentially double the channel capacity that each transponder can hold. As MPEG4 is a compression algorithm that is object-based, rather than frame-based like MPEG2 is. Frame-based compression is when the whole frame is compressed as one entity where only the changed pixels are different in each frame. Because each frame is compressed individually this takes up more bandwidth. With object-based compression in MPEG4, each object on-screen is compressed once, and is redisplayed as it moves on the screen, which only then leaves new stuff on screen to be compressed. It sounds a little strange, but this object-based compression system is a more efficient compression and you actually get a slightly better picture with it over MPEG2. iPods use MPEG4 and if you download a MPEG4 video on your computer and a MPEG2 version of the same video, you'll notice that the MPEG4 video is much clearer.

I was startled when I switched to Verizon FIOS this past winter...to see a massive improvement in picture quality. Also, I have, currently, 28 HD channels with a virtually unlimited amount of room for adding more, all uncompressed.

Well, that's wonderful, but if you live in Backwater, Kansas or something, it'll be a while before FIOS reaches Podunkville.

Oh, by the way, there's also been a lot of issues with D* receivers failing, rapidly. And that can a be a big pain in the butt.

I don't doubt that, but I've heard the same horror stories with HD cable receievers as well. My uncle went through 3 boxes before he finally got one that worked right. Me, I had a problem with my E* ViP622, but in the end it turned out to be a loose connector on my co-axial up in the attic. We found this after going through a replacement LNB and receiver.

 

[Bored_Now]

This thread amazes me. Not because of the topic, but just because Johnny Rico is posting something other than "Barkbark! Liberals! Barkbark! Media! Bark!"

Kudos on getting medication, sir.

 

[TerriO]

And, Bored_Now, you've earned yourself a warning for trolling.

Comments to PM.

ETA: Bored_Now has left the building.

 

[Harmon Bokai]

Ok, but E* and D* also downscale the resolution of HD to 1280 by 1080 and trust me, it makes a major difference. And yes, MPEG-4 is a better compression method than MPEG-2, having sat through any number of engineering seminars, but the net data savings still won't be enough for every announced HD channel, unless the signals are going to be aggressively dynamically downsized.

In my opinion, Satellite is an interim technology, one that will ultimately be replaced by IPTV and FIOS. Of course, I wrote that 10 years ago in a magazine story, so at least I get points for being consistent.