Didn't you people ever see WoK and SFS?!

[RookieBatman]

I'm going by THE MOVIES, and in THE MOVIES, Saavik and Valeris are VULCANS and there is nothing in THE MOVIES to suggest that they or their names are anything else but VULCAN!

(Jeezus H! Now we gotta have the friggin' "Are the books canon?" debate...)

I'd say it's alright to ignore the novelizations. (And no, the books aren't canon. That's objective fact.) But how about some real-world info? Saavik was originally going to be Dr. Savik, a male Vulcan, which is why her name more fits the male pattern. Valeris, I believe, originally did have the apostrophe in it, I think it which originally V'leris or something, not quite sure about that one. But for whatever reason, Kim Cattrall was given a lot of leeway in choosing her own name. So, long story short, there's really no indication that they sat down and said, "Vulcan females don't just have names that start with T'." It was just strange circumstances that should be considered anomalies, not the trend.

And Dulak, you shouldn't stop writing just because one person disagrees with the way you name your characters. I would've named them the same way. Don't get discouraged.

 

[Mistral]

I don't think Dulak is going to stop writing.

Perhaps you didn't get the flavor of this thread.

Take another read through.

The boys waz jus' funnin' - although our good Admiral did bring up a (semi-) valid point.

 

[Mistral]

Oh please...

The novelizations and other Trek books are full of such extraneous crap. That's why I gave up reading them. You want to go by them, fine.

Well, I don't think the books are canon, but they do provide some interesting conjecture. However, the movie (and the two-parter episode) novelizations are almost always based on the first/second drafts of the screenplays written for the movies. It's how Vonda got the notion of Peter Preston being Scotty's nephew, which ended up being cut from the film. And the nephew angle is considered to be canon, now.

There's a /lot/ of stuff that ends up on the cutting room floor that, so I wouldn't go dismissing the novelizations so quickly.

-- ZC

Hey, sometimes I end up on the floor( I mean, sometimes my stuff gets cut and changes get made-just like in the books vs movies) but you move on, don't take it too seriously and have fun.

"And that's what it's all about!"

 

[Admiral2]

I'd say it's alright to ignore the novelizations. (And no, the books aren't canon. That's objective fact.) But how about some real-world info? Saavik was originally going to be Dr. Savik, a male Vulcan, which is why her name more fits the male pattern. Valeris, I believe, originally did have the apostrophe in it, I think it which originally V'leris or something, not quite sure about that one. But for whatever reason, Kim Cattrall was given a lot of leeway in choosing her own name. So, long story short, there's really no indication that they sat down and said, "Vulcan females don't just have names that start with T'." It was just strange circumstances that should be considered anomalies, not the trend.

Fine. Let's go with that.

Originally intended for a male or not, Savik and Saavik are still not T'Whatever.

Even with an apostrophe, V'Leris is still not T'Whatever.

AFAIC, that still makes them both preferable and more imaginative than T'Bip, T'Bap, T'Bingo, T'Etc....

And Zefram Cochrane, think about it: going by the "betrothal" reasoning, how likely is it that so many Vulcan females across so many fanfictions are engaged to be married? Are you saying that - other than Selar - no female Vulcan in a fanfic is allowed to be single???

 

[Starkers]

I'd say it's alright to ignore the novelizations. (And no, the books aren't canon. That's objective fact.) But how about some real-world info? Saavik was originally going to be Dr. Savik, a male Vulcan, which is why her name more fits the male pattern. Valeris, I believe, originally did have the apostrophe in it, I think it which originally V'leris or something, not quite sure about that one. But for whatever reason, Kim Cattrall was given a lot of leeway in choosing her own name. So, long story short, there's really no indication that they sat down and said, "Vulcan females don't just have names that start with T'." It was just strange circumstances that should be considered anomalies, not the trend.

Fine. Let's go with that.

Originally intended for a male or not, Savik and Saavik are still not T'Whatever.

Even with an apostrophe, V'Leris is still not T'Whatever.

AFAIC, that still makes them both preferable and more imaginative than T'Bip, T'Bap, T'Bingo, T'Etc....

And Zefram Cochrane, think about it: going by the "betrothal" reasoning, how likely is it that so many Vulcan females across so many fanfictions are engaged to be married? Are you saying that - other than Selar - no female Vulcan in a fanfic is allowed to be single???

Hey, can I use T'Bap in a story some time? Gotta love that!

 

[McCovey Cove]

And Zefram Cochrane, think about it: going by the "betrothal" reasoning, how likely is it that so many Vulcan females across so many fanfictions are engaged to be married? Are you saying that - other than Selar - no female Vulcan in a fanfic is allowed to be single???

I never said that no female is allowed to be single, I just said that within the context of Dorothy Fontana's writing and the answers to questions I've heard at conventions, the use of the T prefix indicates that the woman in question is either engaged/betrothed or married. And that is it custom to betroth a male and a female at a young age (As established by "Amok Time").

Now, Ann Crispin's interpretation makes more sense in the grand scheme; that not all Vulcan women are betrothed and have the non T prefix names (Saavik, Sakonna, Valeris, etc). In her novel, The Eyes of the Beholders (Pocket TNG), there's a scene where Selar had a T prefix name and she ends her engagement and becomes Selar. I'm also not saying that this is how it has to be, I was only stating what I generally subscribe to within the context of what the creator of Vulcan culture, D. C. Fontana, has stated in the past.

-- ZC