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I love the idea of Legacy, but I am not sure it is the right direction to go for the Franchise. Every show thus far created has been some level of Nostalgia Bait.
- DISCO: TOS-era
- SNW: TOS-era & fan favorite characters & the OG Enterprise
- Picard: TNG Nostalgia
- Lower Decks: 90's Trek Nostalgia
- Prodigy: 90's & Voyager Nostalgia
- Section 31: Lost Era Nostalgia
Even the Kelvin timeline is pseudo-nostalgia for the TOS era.
Academy will be the first show released that will not carry on that nostalgia. It will be something new and different.
Kurtzman gets a lot of shit, but in my view he saved the franchise. I don't think we would have gotten the modern era of trek had Bryan Fuller stayed on.
Prodigy's nostalgia isn't dependent on any knowledge of Voyager or other shows though. For its intended audience, their parents would have been children or teens when Voyager came out, so it's not counting on people knowing who Janeway is at least.
It's not the 32nd century I have a problem with, or even the state of the Federation at that time, but like OP said, how it doesn't feel terribly futuristic compared to even the time period they left. One of TNG's strengths was managing to to feel like a generational shift in technology over TOS, while still working on a television budget. The stuff shown in Discovery is futuristic compared to what we had seen, but not 800 years better. Even compare to what the show has against what little we saw of the future from time travelers in Voyager or Enterprise, and it just falls kinda flat for me.
I never really bought into the "they need to go to the future because we already know what happens". That argument can be made with Enterprise or SNW, yet both have served their time period just fine. I think fans were happy with Discovery's galaxy level threats, and rather than scale them down, they jumped to a time period where they thought they would get less criticism for it.
Eventually I suspect they will just write this future off as being in a alternate universe. Sooner or later someone will want to come along and create their own future, post Berman era Trek and not want to deal The Burn and all of that stuff. Kind of like how The Terminator movies kepth changing the future for each movie and even it's tv show.
I agree with you that I think this is likely to happen, and I'm not sure I'm a fan. Kelvin universe aside, I like how all of Star Trek is one big (messy) canon, and splintering off entire shows will lead down a dangerous path.
I think it has to happen eventually. To many shows and movies. Of course the beauty is you can weave in and out and sometimes do stuff in the Prime Universe or stuff in a new one.
If someone wants to go post-Berman era, they'd just set it after PIC's third season. Somewhere around the 2450s. The only reason to go as far in the future as DIS did is if you want to do something radical, and at that point you can add another thousand years and go to the Calypso time period.
The logical timeframe for a next big show is 2460 or so, yes.
2151 ENT
2266 TOS
2364 TNG
Thus, 2460 something for the next.
Generally, the big eras often jump a century so the show can detach itself from the prior era and allow for some more stories in between. TNG started this and I am still surprised since ENT dropped that they haven't gone forward much. STO is in what, 2409 or so now, but yea.
When you watch Voyager, you having a recurring 29th century element, almost acting as a dual narrative following the occasional adventures of Braxton, The Wells' crew etc. Same again with Enterprise and its 31st century setting with Daniels, the Temporal Cold War and such.
Moving into the 32nd century was more natural than any other future time, in my opinion. You just didn't get much meat in terms of continuity from what we saw in the earlier two shows. Remember the bigger-on-the-inside pod from Future Tense? Where was that tech??
I also feel like the Burn should've been the atomic bomb of the Temporal Cold War, the consequence of all the incursions that we've seen from TOS up to Enterprise. There surely has to consequences eventually, but yet, it was a disappointing revelation in the end.
The 32nd century, cool idea, but should've been more than rainforest starships and floating nacelles.
What exactly were the big technological advancements we saw from THE VOYAGE HOME to TNG, besides ships being a bit faster?
The only thing that comes to mind are replicators. Before that they were food slots that pretty much served the same function, being instantly served the moment you request.
I was gonna bring up holodecks, but we see in TAS and DIS that they were already a thing, just not overused as the Berman era went about.
What exactly were the big technological advancements we saw from THE VOYAGE HOME to TNG, besides ships being a bit faster?
The only thing that comes to mind are replicators. Before that they were food slots that pretty much served the same function, being instantly served the moment you request.
Replicators, Holodecks, Data, UI/Ship interface design, badge communicators. A lot of the heavy lifting is also done by it being a show in the 1980s rather than the 1960s, so across the board things look less dated.
Replicators, Holodecks, Data, UI/Ship interface design, badge communicators. A lot of the heavy lifting is also done by it being a show in the 1980s rather than the 1960s, so across the board things look less dated.
Most of those already existed, but like you said 80s production values meant a better depiction of them. Like computer monitors largely being completely static images in TOS, whereas they’re a bit more animated in TNG. But that’s more of a production advancement than an in universe advancement.
I do feel the 32nd century is too far ahead but as an aside from that, technological advancement has not always been linear rather than ebbs and flows.
IRL we may have had wheels for more than 4000 years before anyone came up with an internal combustion engine to put them on.
We had the telephone for over 100 years as a fairly consistent item until we went through rapid development into mobiles, iPhones, androids and VOIP.
In my headcannon there were periods in future Trek history where development was quite static - the 25th century, after the Mars attack, and the Changeling and Borg plots, could very easily have been a period where technological growth slowed completely. It sounds like the period leading up to the Brrrrrn wasn't rosy either, so that's another 150 years too.
I do feel the 32nd century is too far ahead but as an aside from that, technological advancement has not always been linear rather than ebbs and flows.
IRL we may have had wheels for more than 4000 years before anyone came up with an internal combustion engine to put them on.
We had the telephone for over 100 years as a fairly consistent item until we went through rapid development into mobiles, iPhones, androids and VOIP.
In my headcannon there were periods in future Trek history where development was quite static - the 25th century, after the Mars attack, and the Changeling and Borg plots, could very easily have been a period where technological growth slowed completely. It sounds like the period leading up to the Brrrrrn wasn't rosy either, so that's another 150 years too.
Right. Also consider the evolution of flight. The Wright brothers fly the first stable aircraft, jump to 60 years later and we land on the moon. That’s quite a progress! It’s no wonder people in the 1960s genuinely thought that we’d be making moves to other planets in the solar system within the next 60 years. Star Trek even makes the declaration that Captain John Christopher’s own son is supposed to have made a successful flight to Saturn by now.
But here we are, nearly 60 years after the first moon landing and we still haven’t traversed beyond that. It’s not a stretch to suggest the Federation had experienced its own pauses and setbacks. So this suggestion that the 32nd century should only have seen a non-stop technological progress isn’t the most reasonable.
I’d prefer future series to be set from the 33rd century and onward. There’s no real reason to do otherwise unless you actually want those connections to past shows.
My Head Canon for the show I want to see made is set in the start of the 26th century.
I have my own In-Universe Progress that factors in Michael Burnham & her Time Travel shenanigans.
My ideal traditional episodic Star Trek series would be set in the 33rd century. No legacy characters in the main cast. Few callbacks. Mainly focused on establishing their own cast and the universe around them. I know that’s what studios wouldn’t like, but that’s how TNG was made, so if they want their “next TNG” that’s how you do it, as opposed to having a series with Seven, Raffi, and Picard’s bastard child.
My In-Universe Story would start at the beginning of the 26th Century on Earth:
= 2501/01-01 Sat 00:00;00.0 GMT
= StarDate V5: +345 / 826 ¦ 847
MOST of the "Legacy Characters" would be long dead or retired, only a few characters might be able to reasonably pop up.
"The Doctor" from VOY, "Odo" from DS9, "Pelia" from SNW, "Data" from TNG/PIC.
One of the issues with the 25th century is that the Federation is too large, too dominant. There is no power nearby that rivals the Federation in technology, power or prestige. The Romulan Star Empire was sundered, the Klingons are allies (and soon join the Federation), the Cardassians are broken and weak. The greatest existential threats to the Federation - the Borg, Species 8472 & the Dominion were all humbled and defeated. Even the Ferengi have joined the Federation!
You don't have a sense of scale of just how large our Universe really is.
1) The invading force of "The Dominion" was defeated, "The Dominion" in the Gamma Quadrant is still alive & well.
2) "The Borg" territory in the Delta Quadrant was massive, the fall out from Janeway & Picards actions in VOY & PIC will have HUGE long term ramifications to the local powers and future of the Milky Way
3) Just because the Romulan/Klingons/Ferengi join the UFP, doesn't mean you can't find new enemies.
in the 33rd century, "The Breen" are a force to fear, Orions are not to be trifled with, there is an entire Universe of new aliens to work with.
4) Species 8472 are in peaceful cease fire with the UFP, who knows how they'll react to "The Borg" now that they've been split apart and local powers are taking their tech for their own use.
5) Never forget about the Multi-Verse, any number of scarier enemies New/Old can come through.
Remember, that space is 3D.
And the 3D volume that we need to explore is MASSIVE.
And the size of our Milky Way Galaxy is ALOT larger than what most people think:
Me either. Picard season 3 was fun and seeing the Enterprise D again was a novelty, but the series was all about keeping the status quo and looking backwards. The new characters can't succeed without the old characters, the new hero ship can't succeed without the old hero ship, the main villains are hung up on a conflict that ended 25 years ago, the new peaceful Borg are ignored for the old, malevolent Borg. The Titan can't have it's own legacy but has to become an Enterprise. And Seven being it's Captain and Jack Crusher being assigned to it after skipping the academy entirely was just too much.
There's being reverential, and then there's whatever Terry Matalas wanted . A series being inexorably tied to the Next Generation and having no identity of it's own? Yeah I'll pass.
I see it more of a "Passing of the Baton" and building on the foundation that the past has made.
You don't need to forget about the past, but the future is there and ready to move forward based on the actions & consequences of the past. The Legacy is what kind of world our children will inherit and maintain for their next generation.
The identity is what you make of it with your adventures and what you do. Captain Seven will have her own adventures with her crew, it'll be fine.
Right. Also consider the evolution of flight. The Wright brothers fly the first stable aircraft, jump to 60 years later and we land on the moon. That’s quite a progress! It’s no wonder people in the 1960s genuinely thought that we’d be making moves to other planets in the solar system within the next 60 years. Star Trek even makes the declaration that Captain John Christopher’s own son is supposed to have made a successful flight to Saturn by now.
But here we are, nearly 60 years after the first moon landing and we still haven’t traversed beyond that. It’s not a stretch to suggest the Federation had experienced its own pauses and setbacks. So this suggestion that the 32nd century should only have seen a non-stop technological progress isn’t the most reasonable.
Exackkerly. But there is also a political and motivational willpower to do it that has been lacking, couple with the caution that resulted from the loss of two Space Shuttles. The phone I am typing this on has more processing power to the order of 1,000,000 times or so than the tech on the Apollo modules.
There's a lot to support that Starfleet's risk aversion could be in play as well. We saw the possibility of the NX Alpha and the whole NX Deep Space programme possibly being held back due to technological mishaps or political appeasement of the Vulcans; I am sure there would have been similar episodes throughout Starfleet history.
They chose the era to be ahead of everything else in canon, so the time cops of the 27th and 30th centuries. The tech hasn't changed much which is IRL to keep it recognisable as Trek, and in universe, because the Burn led to something of a dark age of 120 years and was preceeded by a century of time wars that made Khan a Canadian kid in 2024.
They chose the era to be ahead of everything else in canon, so the time cops of the 27th and 30th centuries. The tech hasn't changed much which is IRL to keep it recognisable as Trek, and in universe, because the Burn led to something of a dark age of 120 years and was preceeded by a century of time wars that made Khan a Canadian kid in 2024.
They chose the era to be ahead of everything else in canon, so the time cops of the 27th and 30th centuries. The tech hasn't changed much which is IRL to keep it recognisable as Trek, and in universe, because the Burn led to something of a dark age of 120 years and was preceeded by a century of time wars that made Khan a Canadian kid in 2024.
White dudes hiring a Mexican actor to play an Indian is in the Stone Age of 1966 is one thing. Hiring the pastiest looking Brit to play an Indian in 2013 is a whole other thing!
White dudes hiring a Mexican actor to play an Indian is in the Stone Age of 1966 is one thing. Hiring the pastiest looking Brit to play an Indian in 2013 is a whole other thing!
