Davies vs. Moffat Eras
- Thread starter Mr Light
- Start date
Agree.
Moffat explained it (or tried to) during Season 5 with the Cracks. It's the reason Amy had no idea what a Dalek was.
However, rebooting the universe at the end of the season undid all the damage the cracks caused, and therefore everyone should remember that stuff again. Conveniently, when it comes to alien life everyone in the Who Universe is willfully ignorant.
I think the Davies era is far superior, hands-down. All the characters, from the Doctor to the companions to the families of the companions, felt REAL. It was primarily a character show, like any good drama, and I cared about these people so much. I cared about their adventures and about their real lives. I cared about their internal conflicts. I loved Rose, and her mother, and Donna, and Donna's father, and the character of the Doctor himself in both incarnations - half the episodes left me crying, they were so emotionally involving. There were, of course, some really dumb episodes here and there (farting aliens, and such), but like a bad episode of, say, Star Trek: TNG when it was at its height, it doesn't really matter, because the characters and foundation and world and tone of the show were so well-established, that it was enough to get us smoothly and contentedly through the rough spots. It also goes without saying that some of the best episodes of this period were written by Moffat.
The Moffat era, however, has been much more off-putting. Nothing and no one quite feels real. Everything is shticky and on-the-nose and wacky and self-referential and oh-so-clever and monologue-y and fairy-tale-ish and lesson-y. I wish everyone would just stop talking about the Doctor's personality and reputation and facial expressions. I wish the companions would stop talking as if they're side characters in a show about the Doctor. I wish the show wasn't so formulaic and self-mythologizing. Where is the heart? Where is the realness? Where is the honesty? There has been nothing, absolutely nothing, in the Moffat years that comes anywhere close in emotional quality to Donna listening to the sad song of the Ood, or Rose trying to decide whether to save her father. It's just too much a show about itself now, and it can't take its head out of its own ass long enough to actually try to tell an honest story about real people. That's my take, anyway.
I've actually become quite bored by the show. It occurs to me, I'm actually about 3 or 4 episodes behind. Back in the day, the show was, for me, unmissable. Sigh.
The Moffat era, however, has been much more off-putting. Nothing and no one quite feels real. Everything is shticky and on-the-nose and wacky and self-referential and oh-so-clever and monologue-y and fairy-tale-ish and lesson-y. I wish everyone would just stop talking about the Doctor's personality and reputation and facial expressions. I wish the companions would stop talking as if they're side characters in a show about the Doctor. I wish the show wasn't so formulaic and self-mythologizing. Where is the heart? Where is the realness? Where is the honesty? There has been nothing, absolutely nothing, in the Moffat years that comes anywhere close in emotional quality to Donna listening to the sad song of the Ood, or Rose trying to decide whether to save her father. It's just too much a show about itself now, and it can't take its head out of its own ass long enough to actually try to tell an honest story about real people. That's my take, anyway.
I've actually become quite bored by the show. It occurs to me, I'm actually about 3 or 4 episodes behind. Back in the day, the show was, for me, unmissable. Sigh.
They really are such very different styles, and I absolutely love them both for what they are.
That said, I recently (and by recently, I mean I finished yesterday) rewatched the RTD seasons, and weird as it sounds, I really miss how "small" the universe felt. I felt like Tennant's Doctor made some real friendships and connections with his companions and their family members. He loved Rose. Rose was gone, and that loss was felt throughout the next two seasons. There was a whole world built around the Doctor, which resulted in a story that allowed all of them to come together in "Journey's End." Every Companion and friend together -- even Jackie, for Pete's sake! (pun not intended) -- in the TARDIS flying them home. It's one of my all-time favorite moments of the show.
Moffat...I really enjoy his take on the show, but sometimes I think he gets way too full of himself. Too much effort to be clever. One thing I really like about him is that he's not afraid to make complicated time-travel arcs. I personally love River's story.
HOWEVER, I think he goes too far sometimes with his portrayal of time. Two instances that stick out are in both "The Impossible Astronaut" when we learn that he's 200 years older when he gets "murdered." Another instance that's even worse is on Trenzalore when 900 YEARS go by. I'm sorry, but that's just WAY TOO LONG, to the point where it doesn't make any sense. 900 yeas and literally nothing about the situation has changed? Moffat doubled the Doctor's age in the course of a single episode, and we're just supposed to go along with it. You could have easily said 9 years, and I would have had a much easier time accepting it.
That said, I recently (and by recently, I mean I finished yesterday) rewatched the RTD seasons, and weird as it sounds, I really miss how "small" the universe felt. I felt like Tennant's Doctor made some real friendships and connections with his companions and their family members. He loved Rose. Rose was gone, and that loss was felt throughout the next two seasons. There was a whole world built around the Doctor, which resulted in a story that allowed all of them to come together in "Journey's End." Every Companion and friend together -- even Jackie, for Pete's sake! (pun not intended) -- in the TARDIS flying them home. It's one of my all-time favorite moments of the show.
Moffat...I really enjoy his take on the show, but sometimes I think he gets way too full of himself. Too much effort to be clever. One thing I really like about him is that he's not afraid to make complicated time-travel arcs. I personally love River's story.
HOWEVER, I think he goes too far sometimes with his portrayal of time. Two instances that stick out are in both "The Impossible Astronaut" when we learn that he's 200 years older when he gets "murdered." Another instance that's even worse is on Trenzalore when 900 YEARS go by. I'm sorry, but that's just WAY TOO LONG, to the point where it doesn't make any sense. 900 yeas and literally nothing about the situation has changed? Moffat doubled the Doctor's age in the course of a single episode, and we're just supposed to go along with it. You could have easily said 9 years, and I would have had a much easier time accepting it.
Just think, there are likely entire generations of peoples from the races represented in the orbiting fleet who spent their entire careers just sitting and waiting. Unless they were all like Tasha Lem and her people and didn't age at all for the better part of a millennium.
I enjoyed both show-runners eras equally. I know two data points isn't enough for a patter, but for me the second season of RTD's run and the second season of Moffat's run were the worst seasons of the show. Perhaps it's a sophmore slump type of effect?
Well, I appreciated how RTD had a fast paced manic energy to it, but I also appreciate how Moffat is willing to slow down every now and then.
Well, I appreciated how RTD had a fast paced manic energy to it, but I also appreciate how Moffat is willing to slow down every now and then.
I must admit, I like that the Eleventh Doctor lived a long, long lifespan. I hate that Ten only really lived about 4 or 5 years. I wish that he'd been seen to age during the course of the specials, as if he'd lived a long time and had lots of offscreen adventures.
I remember at the time, revealing that Tennant had a year of off-screen adventures at the start of "End of Time" was a shocking thing to me. Oh, how quaint
Ironically, RTD originally considered having an aged Tenth Doctor for The End of Time with the implication he had an entire lifetime of adventures since Waters of Mars, but ultimately decided against it.
A long life span isn't the problem. It's that 1100 years of his life span happen off screen, and 900 of those years happen in the same frickin town. Frankly, the Doctor we know is too impatient to let that happen. TARDIS or not, he would have figured out another plan. 900 years is just an absurd amount of time for he and the Silence and the Daleks and all those other aliens in orbit of Trenzalore to be doing the exact same thing.
Plus, Moffat then had to top himself. "A millenium in one place isn't enough, now he has to be in one place for a few BILLION years! Yeah!!"
Yeah, I did find the billion years a bit OTT.
That actually didn't bother me. For one, it was a time loop. So while it may have gone on for a billion years, the Doctor certainly didn't remember that happening. He only experienced a few days (or however long one iteration of the loop lasted). And it seems pretty clear that those billion years existed in their own little time bubble, so ultimately it didn't matter how much time had passed; the Doctor will still emerge the same age he was when he went in.
I don't mind the earlier age jumps, like the 200 years series 6 spans, because the Doctor is traveling.
There also appears to be a century we don't see before "The Snowmen" as the Doctor says he's over 1,200 in the Clara era ("The Day of the Doctor"), but in "Impossible" he's only 1,100. I figure the Doctor spent some time (a few decades) avoiding the Ponds after "The Wedding of River Song," then spent a few more decades moping after "The Angels Take Manhattan."
But, yeah, the Trenzalore experience doesn't make any sense in-universe nor for any of the players involved.
I can think of all sorts of ways the Doctor's enemies could have broken the siege of Trenzalore that the Doctor, in his tower, could do nothing about.
1) Drop asteroids on the planet.
2) Detonate the star and induce a nova.
3) Contaminate the biosphere with Dalek nanites and turn the population into stealth Daleks.
It was a stupid set-up from the start.
