Crossover continuity

[F. King Daniel]

Let's be honest here: Archer's Enterprise is the ultimate retcon, and trying to differenciate "Earth Starfleet" and "Federation Starfleet" is just fans trying to explain it all away. There's no way the ship that paved the way for the Federation, made first contact with Andorians, Romulans and countless others and saved the Earth from destruction wouldn't have come up in conversation in prior Treks or on those "legacy walls" on the -D and -E had Star Trek been some epic plan rather than something made up as they went along.

 

[T'Girl]

^^^ But if Sisko was referring to all Starships named Enterprise, regardless if the fleet was Federation or United Earth, then shouldn't he (and we) count and include the Starship prior to Archer's?

I'm talking about Earth's hoop and long cylinder Starship that was also on the display wall and also named Enterprise.

And how many pre-Federation non-Human races had Starships who's names translated into something like "Enterprise?"

 

[Finn]

Would we count a British Navy ship from the 1760s as part of the American Navy?

If it was assigned to a port in what would be an US port, and played some pivotal role in history somewhere along the eastern seaboard that paved the way for the country's existence, it would be at least known to historians and buffs at the least.

Because it literally wasn't part of the Federation. Go back and watch TATV, it was decommissioned just before the Federation was founded. It was never in active service when the Federation existed, therefore it is not a Federation starship.

Is the Phoenix a Federation starship? Are NASA shuttles considered Federation spacecraft? The obvious answers are no, and the same logic applies to the NX-01.

The logic would work if they actually stated that they were talking about Federation starships only. Can anyone confirm if they stated there were talking about Federation starships. Even if they were, I don't see why they would dismiss it, when Archer and his crew were one of those who paved the way for the formation of the Federation from the P'Jem incident to the first contact with the Romulans to stopping a war between the Andorians and the Vulcans not to mention being the first warp five ship from Earth, oh yeah and Archer becoming one of the first Presidents of the Federation. I wouldn't have simply dismissed it just because it was decommissioned before the Federation was founded.

SCOTT
The Enterprise. Show me the
Bridge of the Enterprise, you
chattering piece of...

COMPUTER VOICE
There have been five Federation
ships with that name. Please
specify by registry number.

Scotty simply asked for "the Enterprise". Why did the computer assume just the Federation. It should have suggested every single vessel called Enterprise, including Archer's Enterprise especially given its role in history.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Because Scotty is a Federation officer, aboard a Federation ship, who never lived in time when there wasn't a Federation

 

[Finn]

^Not very logical. The computer would not assume that much. Remember all the suggestions the computer made like a Betazoid horse or something, when Picard wanted to go riding on the holodeck. By your logic, the computer should have only suggested Earth Horse breeds, especially if he had never lived on the other planets.

 

[The Wormhole]

The logic would work if they actually stated that they were talking about Federation starships only. Can anyone confirm if they stated there were talking about Federation starships. Even if they were, I don't see why they would dismiss it, when Archer and his crew were one of those who paved the way for the formation of the Federation from the P'Jem incident to the first contact with the Romulans to stopping a war between the Andorians and the Vulcans not to mention being the first warp five ship from Earth, oh yeah and Archer becoming one of the first Presidents of the Federation. I wouldn't have simply dismissed it just because it was decommissioned before the Federation was founded.

Well, Sisko did tell the Time Agents that the Enterprise he encountered was "the first, Constitution class" so they were clearly just talking about Federation starships. Though I have heard people try to retcon that sentence by removing the comma so that it is just "the first Constitution class" which also works since there were two Constitution class Enterprises.

And besides, it doesn't matter how much the NX-01 contributed to the formation of the Federation, it still can't be called a Federation starship since it wasn't in service during a time when the Federation existed.

Look at it this way, did Archer ever introduce himself as "captain of the Federation starship Enterprise"? No, case closed.

 

[Finn]

I didn't say Archer's Enterprise was a Federation ship, just that the computer wouldn't seperated pre-Federation ships from the five we knew then. Would the computer assume which Paris based on who's asking.

 

[C.E. Evans]

My personal favorite bits of crossover continuity:

-The Daystrom Institute of Technology mentioned several times in TNG and once in DS9 was a nod towards Dr. Richard Daystrom from TOS' "The Ultimate Computer".

-The Voyager's use of tricobalt devices in "Caretaker" was a nod towards the tricobalt weapons mentioned in the TOS episode "A Taste of Armageddon".

-The United Earth Space Probe Agency mentioned in early TOS episodes reappeared as part of Starfleet's official logo during the final season of ENT.

 

[sojourner]

In a Voyager episode (can't remember which), Janeway says that Kirk "claimed to have met" Da Vinci, but "the evidence is less than conclusive" (I personally loved hearing that Kirk's adventures are treated with a pinch of salt by later generations)

Nah, it just makes her look like a self centered bitch. I mean, come on, she can meet Amelia Earhart but when it comes to someone else meeting a historic figure it's "less than conclusive"??

 

[Nerys Myk]

^Not very logical. The computer would not assume that much. Remember all the suggestions the computer made like a Betazoid horse or something, when Picard wanted to go riding on the holodeck. By your logic, the computer should have only suggested Earth Horse breeds, especially if he had never lived on the other planets.

Cant say that I do.

Picard is a man of the Galaxy. He's not limited to "Earth". The computer needed specfics when he asks for a "horse". Just as it needs specifics when someone asks for a "starship Enterprise".

The way the computer interacts is often written in an inconsistant manner. ( I know, inconsistancy in Star Trek!!!! Who woulda thunk it!?) Since it mentioned Federation starships were gonna have to assume it had a reason. My reasoning is it knows who Scotty is and tailors it's responses accordingly.

 

[Nerys Myk]

In a Voyager episode (can't remember which), Janeway says that Kirk "claimed to have met" Da Vinci, but "the evidence is less than conclusive" (I personally loved hearing that Kirk's adventures are treated with a pinch of salt by later generations)

Nah, it just makes her look like a self centered bitch. I mean, come on, she can meet Amelia Earhart but when it comes to someone else meeting a historic figure it's "less than conclusive"??

In her defense, the guy was an immortal and claimed to be several other historical figures as well.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

^ But didn't Kirk promise never to reveal who Flint really was?

 

[sojourner]

I am guessing it was revealed after Flint died.

 

[T'Girl]

In a Voyager episode (can't remember which), Janeway says that Kirk "claimed to have met" Da Vinci, but "the evidence is less than conclusive"

Kirk surrounded by a crowd in Ten-Forward. "... and then there was the time on Holberg 917G, where I engaged in fisticuffs with Leonardo da Vinci over the hand of a beautiful maiden, who (as it turns out) was actual a fembot, you see it went like this ... "

 

[DevilEyes]

In a Voyager episode (can't remember which), Janeway says that Kirk "claimed to have met" Da Vinci, but "the evidence is less than conclusive"

I guess Spock didn't erase ALL of his memories? He erased just the memory of Reyna, but not of Flint?

 

[Chris3123]

In Trials and Tribbleations, the Temperal cop mentions a sixth Enterprise. This was shortly prior to the introduction of the Enterprise-E.

*Ahem* They could have meant Archer's Enterprise

No, they couldn't have. The Enterprise-E had been in service for almost a year at that point. They had to have been living under a rock not to have heard about it. The Ent-E would make six, but if they also included the NX-01 it would be seven.

 

[sbk1234]

I think we may be overthinking the Archer's Enterprise situation just a tad.

 

[Nerys Myk]

I think we may be overthinking the Archer's Enterprise situation just a tad.

Overthinking is almost a prerequisite here.

 

[sojourner]

Dread Pirate Roberts - "Are you done?"
Vizzini - "I haven't even started!"

 

[mtblillie]

I like the one episode of DS9 where Gul Dukat talks about a Gul Mercet, and how he dislikes him so much, but Gul Mercet was featered in TNG and both characters were played by Marc Almaino.